It says "No" for North Carolina here, so that's what I would have expected: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certified_copy
Child born to a Canadian Citizen outside Canada
- Thread starter S.K
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Well, sort of. NC has only recently changed this. You did used to be able to get "true copy" forms signed by notaries for such documents as birth certificates, and as I wrote, you still can for some documents, just not as many as in the past. So it's still a valid workaround in NC to get around the fact that the state won't allow notaries public to certify documents here. And FWIW the Canadian government took no issue with the "True Copy" of my wife's Canadian Citizenship Certificate in our kids' application. They accepted it.
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Just wondering...why would it be surprising that IRCC accepted the true copy of your wife's citizenship certificate? The Document Checklist (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/citizen/CIT0014E-2.pdf) states that you should send a certified copy of this: "proof that one or both of your natural parents were Canadian citizens when you were born, such as: Canadian citizenship certificate." So, you sent exactly what was requested, a certified copy of the citizenship certificate, and it was accepted. If you're saying it was surprising because there's some question as to whether NC notaries can certify documents, I don't think IRCC is monitoring the situation with notary laws in the 50 states. If applicants simply follow the checklist, I don't think they will have a problem.
Because by the strict letter of the wording, NC notaries cannot certify documents; they can only certify the identity of the person standing before them who has filled out the True Copy form and thereby affirmed that the document in question is a true copy. It's not the notary saying the copy is true, it's the applicant. The notary just certifies the applicant's identity.
Yes, I addressed that with another person who wanted to send a certified copy of his father's birth certificate, but faced the restriction found in many states on a notary making a True Copy declaration. I suggested that he give it a try (i.e. doing a self-certification, notarized by a notary). As far as I know, he hasn't reported back to say whether he followed through and whether it worked. Apparently, you're saying that it worked for your wife's citizenship certificate, but I'd still be interested in knowing whether it works for birth certificates.
In North Carolina it's not possible for a notary to certify birth certificates nor issue True Copy documents regarding them. We are required to get certified birth certificates from the Register of Deeds (which I did today) or Vital Records. But for those states that allow True Copy certifications for birth certificates I would assume Canada would accept those.
Yes, that's a given. What I'm questioning is whether the substitute method (self-certification, with the applicant's signature notarized) is accepted by IRCC for birth certificates. It's the only method involving a notary that can be used in many states.
Sanity check:
In our case my wife is Canadian and so we have filled out the application on behalf of our kids in her name (we have listed me, a non-Canadian, as their father). Is there any requirement that the one who attests to the ID document copies' validity be my wife? IOW, as long as it is notarized, can I be the person listed on the affidavit who attests that the various copies are true copies instead of my wife? (The back story is that my wife has a bad case of the flu since Wednesday - too bad to go out - and we want to get this darned thing squared away and mailed ASAP.)
In our case my wife is Canadian and so we have filled out the application on behalf of our kids in her name (we have listed me, a non-Canadian, as their father). Is there any requirement that the one who attests to the ID document copies' validity be my wife? IOW, as long as it is notarized, can I be the person listed on the affidavit who attests that the various copies are true copies instead of my wife? (The back story is that my wife has a bad case of the flu since Wednesday - too bad to go out - and we want to get this darned thing squared away and mailed ASAP.)
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I'm not sure what you're saying when you write: "we have filled out the application...in her name." The application needs to be in the name of the person requesting the certificate. So, in your case, the child is the applicant, not your wife.
The question of whether a self-certification of a birth certificate is acceptable has not been answered. Since your child cannot make a self-certification anyway (due to age), that method cannot be used.
I direct you to this page: https://www.immigroup.com/news/what-are-certified-copies
Notice that IRCC accepts documents (at least for immigration purposes) that have been certified by people in certain professions. However, further down, the professions are more limited for people outside Canada. IRCC *may* allow (say) a doctor in the USA to certify a document, but they also may not. I would think that a lawyer (as an officer of the court) would be acceptable.
In your situation, the best thing to do is to just send an original birth certificate that you would get from the city, county, or state (depending on which agencies issues birth certificates in NC). You can try another method, but it may not be accepted.
The only other document that needs to be certified is your wife's citizenship certificate, and you say she already did a notarized self-certification and it was accepted.
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What I mean is that my wife is the "in care of" person and she has provided her signature as the parent/guardian on the last page of the application. Since she's a Canadian citizen and I'm not she's the one who is "running the show" on paper.
I'm not asking about self-certification of a birth certificate because it's immaterial in my case. The copy I got from the Register of Deeds is already a certified copy - it's an official, certified, embossed copy . There's no other way to get a certified copy of a birth certificate in North Carolina - notaries can't use a True Copy for them any more. I think this is what you mean by "original copy" from the city, county or state (which here can be either Register of Deeds or Vital Records).
My question is really about the ID documents: copy of passport, school records and immunization records. For those I had no choice but to use a notarized affidavit or true copy form - that's the way you have to do it in NC. The point is that SOMEBODY (the applicant or applicant's parent/guardian) has to put their name on thing, and the notary merely swears that that person listed on the paper was, in fact, that person and appeared before him/her. This might SOUND like "self-certification" but IRCC has already accepted this method for my wife's Citizenship Certificate that we submitted. On that one SHE signed the True Copy form, but in this case (as I posted above) she is very sick and for sake of expediency I just went ahead and did it today myself as the kids' father.
The verbiage reads like this:
(my name), appearing before the undersigned notary and being duly sworn, says that: the attached documents, listed below, are true copies and contain no alterations from the originals.
- Passport for my son/daughter
- School records for my son/daughter
- Immunization records for my son/daughter
I did one for my son and one for my daughter.
So my question is not about "self-certification" it's just about whether IRCC might take issue to ME being the one attesting to the ID documents (not including the birth certificates) being true copies.
I fully cop to being anal retentive about this but I don't have to mail the corrected application until Monday, and I REALLY don't want to get it returned to me again. I THINK what I've done is probably OK but why not ask?
Also, as far as birth certificates go, the requirement was to send a certified birth certificate AND ALSO 2 certified forms of ID, one with a picture (passport for us). I'm not lumping the birth certificate in with the ID docs (even though it seems like it could serve as one) because the application seems to draw a distinction between birth certificates and other forms of ID. When the application got kicked back to us they included a list of accepted forms of ID and birth certificate was not on that list.
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I received my certificate in the mail today, 11/17/17. I can confirm that if you have mail forwarding in the US, they will forward it. I'm going to get my SIN when I visit early next month, and when I get back to the US, I'll send this shiny certificate out via mail to the Canadian Passport Agency. Thanks all!
Please look at this form: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/citizen/CIT0014E-2.pdf
Notice how for "Identity documents" it says "copy?" It doesn't say "certified copy." So, why is this a concern? Yes, I know that another person on here thinks that the statement at the top of the page means that EVERYTHING has to be certified. But, as I pointed out, that couldn't be true, because otherwise IRCC wouldn't have the document checklist! They would simply say, "all documents must be certified copies." I sent a simple copy of my driver's license and passport, and I had no problem. While I understand that finding ID for a child makes things more complicated, it's not impossible. Just follow the instructions and everything will work out. As I mentioned, it probably would have worked in the first place with the birth certificate as ID if you had simply included a second copy and marked it as such.
Another person in the forum...am04...reported that he sent applications for two of his children, one born in the U.S. and one in India. For ID, he sent copies of their passports and birth certificates. He reported that the ID of the American-born child was accepted, but the Indian-born child was not. He applied again, this time including the school record as the second form of ID.
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Sure, of course I've read this a lot of times already. Why is it a concern? Because of that statement you reference - it's ambiguous. I'm asking a question for which the answer isn't covered by the instructions. At this point if no answer presents itself over weekend I'll just roll with what I have on Monday and hope for the best...
Well, we disagree on the ambiguity. To me, the statement means that for a first application, I need to send a certified copy of my birth certificate (either one I got from the vital records department or a true copy), and if I lose that (or want an updated certificate), when I apply again, I just need to make a plain copy. To you, it means that every item needs to be certified, despite what it has on the rest of the form.
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Ah, my interpretation was different. I don't consider that I'm applying again - I'm resendng the existing application after having checked "Option 1". So I consider this still our first application. To me applying again would mean sending out a completely new application because we DID receive citizenship certificates but needed replacement for whatever reason - starting from scratch as it were. But to the extent that reasonable people can have differing opinions on this underscores the inherent ambiguity.
For the record, I'm NOT having my wife's Citizenship Certificate recertified. I don't believe it's required or necessary because I'm merely submitting the same application.