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Work Permit at the Border. Expired previous work permit

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,558
7,195
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
Hi Mosor,
Yes, I do have a visitor visa.
One thing I didn't understand is, why to flagpole after crossing the border?

I am planning to apply for work permit right at the time of entering Canada. Will that be a problem?
Note that as you require a TRV to enter Canada, you don't qualify to apply for a work permit at a POE. Some have gotten away with doing this but know that there is a good chance that you will be knocked back and told to apply at a visa office.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/temp/work/port.asp
 

peace365

Star Member
May 22, 2014
84
13
Note that as you require a TRV to enter Canada, you don't qualify to apply for a work permit at a POE. Some have gotten away with doing this but know that there is a good chance that you will be knocked back and told to apply at a visa office.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/temp/work/port.asp
Yes, I read about that requirement but when I browsed this forum I didn't come across anyone for whom the work permit application was denied at POE at land border.
 

Ahora

Hero Member
Aug 29, 2011
634
77
123
IRAN
Category........
Visa Office......
Vancouver
NOC Code......
1123
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
21-02-2017
I got work permit visa based on LMIA that issued 3 months ago. I got one way ticket to Vancouver for 27th July . My flight stay in Toronto and change flight so I think I should get work permit in Toronto airport , Is that right ? what document they need to show them for that . and is it an easy process or not ? thanks for your advise
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
92,541
20,360
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
Yes, I read about that requirement but when I browsed this forum I didn't come across anyone for whom the work permit application was denied at POE at land border.
There are certainly plenty of posts here with examples where people have been refused. They may be a bit tricky to find - but they are certainly there.
 

scylla

VIP Member
Jun 8, 2010
92,541
20,360
Toronto
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
28-05-2010
AOR Received.
19-08-2010
File Transfer...
28-06-2010
Passport Req..
01-10-2010
VISA ISSUED...
05-10-2010
LANDED..........
05-10-2010
I got work permit visa based on LMIA that issued 3 months ago. I got one way ticket to Vancouver for 27th July . My flight stay in Toronto and change flight so I think I should get work permit in Toronto airport , Is that right ? what document they need to show them for that . and is it an easy process or not ? thanks for your advise
Yes - the work permit will be issued in Toronto. You'll want to ensure you have at least two hours between flights.
 
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mosor

Star Member
Jun 28, 2017
93
18
Note that as you require a TRV to enter Canada, you don't qualify to apply for a work permit at a POE. Some have gotten away with doing this but know that there is a good chance that you will be knocked back and told to apply at a visa office.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/temp/work/port.asp
Note that as you require a TRV to enter Canada, you don't qualify to apply for a work permit at a POE. Some have gotten away with doing this but know that there is a good chance that you will be knocked back and told to apply at a visa office.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/temp/work/port.asp
That's not entirely correct. IRPA regulation 190(3)f states this:

(3) A foreign national is exempt from the requirement to obtain a temporary resident visa if they are seeking to enter and remain in Canada solely
  • (f) to re-enter Canada following a visit solely to the United States or St. Pierre and Miquelon, if they
    • (i) held a study permit or a work permit that was issued before they left Canada on such a visit or were authorized to enter and remain in Canada as a temporary resident, and

    • (ii) return to Canada by the end of the period initially authorized for their stay or any extension to it
So, if someone needed a TRV to initally enter Canada, they couldn't get at Work Permit at the airport POE. However, once they obtain temporary resident status, and they flagpole from the USA at the land border, they no longer need a TRV and thus they can apply for a Work Permit without a Work Visa as long as their status is still valid.




 

Bs65

VIP Member
Mar 22, 2016
13,190
2,419
That's not entirely correct. IRPA regulation 190(3)f states this:

(3) A foreign national is exempt from the requirement to obtain a temporary resident visa if they are seeking to enter and remain in Canada solely
  • (f) to re-enter Canada following a visit solely to the United States or St. Pierre and Miquelon, if they
    • (i) held a study permit or a work permit that was issued before they left Canada on such a visit or were authorized to enter and remain in Canada as a temporary resident, and

    • (ii) return to Canada by the end of the period initially authorized for their stay or any extension to it
So, if someone needed a TRV to initally enter Canada, they couldn't get at Work Permit at the airport POE. However, once they obtain temporary resident status, and they flagpole from the USA at the land border, they no longer need a TRV and thus they can apply for a Work Permit without a Work Visa as long as their status is still valid.



I guess depends how CBSA interpret 'visit' the USA given with flagpoling you do not enter the USA so technically having not entered you do not visit. All words I know but ultimately upto the individual to interpret as they want .
 

mosor

Star Member
Jun 28, 2017
93
18
I guess depends how CBSA interpret 'visit' the USA given with flagpoling you do not enter the USA so technically having not entered you do not visit. All words I know but ultimately upto the individual to interpret as they want .
I guess depends how CBSA interpret 'visit' the USA given with flagpoling you do not enter the USA so technically having not entered you do not visit. All words I know but ultimately upto the individual to interpret as they want .
If you speak USCBP officer and received their administrative refusal letter then you visited the US and are seeking entry. That's exactly how the CBSA interprets visit.
 

mosor

Star Member
Jun 28, 2017
93
18
There are certainly plenty of posts here with examples where people have been refused. They may be a bit tricky to find - but they are certainly there.
If they got refused at a land border after a flag pole, it wasn't because they didn't have the work visa. More than likely some of their documents weren't in order, or they didn't qualify in some other way for the work permit they were seeking.
 

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,558
7,195
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
So, if someone needed a TRV to initally enter Canada, they couldn't get at Work Permit at the airport POE. However, once they obtain temporary resident status, and they flagpole from the USA at the land border, they no longer need a TRV and thus they can apply for a Work Permit without a Work Visa as long as their status is still valid.
That is your interpretation, not CBSA's. The fact is, many have been refused for just this reason.
 

mosor

Star Member
Jun 28, 2017
93
18
That is your interpretation, not CBSA's. The fact is, many have been refused for just this reason.
No it's the CBSA's interpretation. You still visited the USA even though you were refused entry. Any cracker jack lawyer will rip you to shreds if you try to argue that seeing a CBP officer at US POE on US soil, isn't a visit to the US. No where in 190(3)f does it say you needed to be authorized to enter the USA. It just says visit. The refusal letter doesn't mean you didn't visit the USA. It is just a mutual agreement by the USA and Canada, to obligate each country to take back each country's refusals.

Now you give anecdotal evidence that plenty of people here have been refused a work permit at a LAND BORDER for this reason. If that's the case, then they got some junior officer who didn't know what they were doing. More likely they were for refused for a million other possible reasons, and they misunderstood why they were exactly refused. For instance, they may confuse that they need an LMIA with needing a work visa.

People can confirm this by calling any land POE and speak to an officer who works immigration. You're obviously not sure people can't do this at the land border. It's disingenuous to tell people that they can't do it at any POE when you're not so sure yourself.
 

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,558
7,195
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
No it's the CBSA's interpretation. You still visited the USA even though you were refused entry. Any cracker jack lawyer will rip you to shreds if you try to argue that seeing a CBP officer at US POE on US soil, isn't a visit to the US. No where in 190(3)f does it say you needed to be authorized to enter the USA. It just says visit. The refusal letter doesn't mean you didn't visit the USA. It is just a mutual agreement by the USA and Canada, to obligate each country to take back each country's refusals.

Now you give anecdotal evidence that plenty of people here have been refused a work permit at a LAND BORDER for this reason. If that's the case, then they got some junior officer who didn't know what they were doing. More likely they were for refused for a million other possible reasons, and they misunderstood why they were exactly refused. For instance, they may confuse that they need an LMIA with needing a work visa.

People can confirm this by calling any land POE and speak to an officer who works immigration. You're obviously not sure people can't do this at the land border. It's disingenuous to tell people that they can't do it at any POE when you're not so sure yourself.
As I have stated, some have managed to do it while some have been refused, so I am quite sure that a refusal is possible.

It's disingenuous for you to tell people they will 100% be able to do it when that is not true. You are not CBSA and cannot guarantee people that they will be successful.
 

mosor

Star Member
Jun 28, 2017
93
18
As I have stated, some have managed to do it while some have been refused, so I am quite sure that a refusal is possible.

It's disingenuous for you to tell people they will 100% be able to do it when that is not true..
If they meet the elements of regulation 190(3)f, meaning that they already have valid status in Canada, that their status hasn't expired, and they are coming from the United States, even as a flagpole, they can apply for a work permit without a work visa. Now, if they are directly coming from the United States without first gaining status in Canada and they need a TRV, then yes they need a work visa. If their status expired in Canada and they flagpole without first applying for and getting restoration, then yes they need a work visa.

So will they be a 100% successful to apply for a work permit without a work visa at the border? Only if they meet all the elements of 190(3)f. If they don't meet one of the elements they can be refused.

You are not CBSA.......
Why do you say that? Personally if someone was quoting IRPA regulations not found on the CIC site, and spoke with such conviction about what the process actually is, I would have thought differently.
 
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