I would like to know if the CBSA officers at Canadian airports have exit records? I am in breach by 15 odd days and I would like to know if i can get through? I will land at YUL.
Do CBSA officers at the airport have exit records?
- Thread starter ishaannayyyar
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Short answer is I do not know. Longer answer is that for a short breach, if you tell the truth about why breached (if and only if you are asked) and are returning to Canada to reside, there should be a good chance or even a high chance they'll wave you through.
Whatever goes on, just keep your answers truthful and brief.
As part of secured border initiative (I sarcastically call it Orwellian Triple Hermetic Secret Worshipping Initiative), both the US and Canadian authorities started to exchange evidence of admissions on the ground, so they both inform each other when you cross into other country by land, and airlines do their own collection of data, which is then shared with federal agencies. You would be shocked if you knew how much of your personal information (far from border crossings) is being collected, shared and is accessible by border agents of the two countries. So, the short answer is (if you exited Canada in recent years) they know when you left the country.
That being said, even if you are in breach of RO, they may or may not ask you about it. If they ask, you have a right to remain silent. Or, you can explain yourself and they may wave you through.
P.S. I don't know what the odds of being issued deportation order are for very short breaches, and frankly, even the best of the immigration attorneys can't say for sure. It depends on so many things, including the officer you face, his mood that day and attitude towards someone who looks and dresses like you. When I traveled as PR to Canada by land I used to be sent to secondary each time WITHOUT ANY BREACH OF RO or ANY NEGATIVE RECORD (I have ZERO criminals records and as a kid was that nerdy mom's boy, the last one ever to get into any kind of trouble , let alone trouble with law), so, I am sure, if it was ME who was 15 days in breach of RO, they would instantly order me deported. Nay, they would do that even if I was only 15 seconds past the 3 year limit out of Canada. But you may fare differently. They treat everyone differently (I watched how they behaved towards others, and noticed that some travelers were greeted with warm smile, even they could be criminals importing a contraband or in wide breach of RO as PRs).
Aside from variables that no one can predict, and lack of transparency in how the admissions are handled, just keep in mind: you don't ever have to incriminate yourself. You can always remain silent. Remaining silent is perfectly LEGAL ,it just could be pointless and useless, since they most likely have all the data about your presence and absence, and can calculate your breach without your assistance, and your silence may only delay your passage through the POE.
No. They will admit you for 30 days (so you can appeal) with the order of deportation.
What is the best way I can avoid being reported ? My last entry was on 1st September and I last left for France in 30 October. I am in breach by about 14 days.
Any tips, how to avoid being reported ? Any particular trend from previous experiences of others ?
There is nothing you can intentionally do to avoid being reported. What if border agent is biased bully and you look like someone he thinks he can mistreat with impudence? He will then pick on you just out of the blue, and having eventually discovered that you are even half day in breach can order you deported. That's what they wanted to do to me, but couldn't, because I was not in breach at all. Remember, there are some crazy bullies who apply for jobs in law enforcement, so they can play out their sick fantasies of power and control on powerless victims. How could anyone intentionally avoid such an officer? It's just a matter of luck.
As to recent trends, I posted a thread and asked members about it, but very few (aside from regulars) answered. I guess either too few had RO breaches and encounters at POE, or people are just too fearful to share their experiences, thinking it may cause them trouble in future.
As to recent trends, I posted a thread and asked members about it, but very few (aside from regulars) answered. I guess either too few had RO breaches and encounters at POE, or people are just too fearful to share their experiences, thinking it may cause them trouble in future.
Asked and answered here:
For sure. Yes. And likewise @armoured's further elaboration of this, including in particular the prudent approach is to assume they have the information.
My guess is the OP is overthinking things, so again the responses by @armoured should cover it. Especially since (according to previous posts) the OP has a PR card valid well into 2023 and has entered and exited multiple times this year.
Which suggests the OP should be able to offer personal insight into how the Port-of-Entry (PoE) examination might go for a PR in a similar situation, including a very similar situation.
Which in turn invites taking a look under-the-hood:
There is a big difference between what information is accessible versus what is actually accessed and considered; that is, there is a big difference in what information, what data bases, law enforcement officers can look at and consider, versus what they usually see without conducting additional queries, with a big range in-between in what is typically done in various scenarios. However one describes law enforcement prioritization protocols in conducting interviews, including those conducted by CBSA PoE officers, be that as "triage" or "telescoping" or simply investigatory interviewing techniques, not only will the scope of the interview expand depending on whether the subject's answers raise more questions, but so too can the scope of the interviewing officer's queries into accessible data bases. Which is part of why it is rarely a good idea to be less than forthcoming and upfront during a PoE examination, let alone overtly uncooperative (declining to answer questions is virtually demanding to be investigated more in-depth, and by the way, this tends to invite a stricter application of the rules . . . that is, it is typically counterproductive).
[Side note: changes in the law during the last decade have elevated the risk of an inadmissibility determination based on misrepresentations made during a PoE examination. Previously only misrepresentations made in proceedings to obtain status in Canada (like in the PR visa application) constituted grounds for finding a PR inadmissible for misrepresentation, terminating the PR's status. During the latter part of the Harper period changes were made which could result in inadmissibility for making misrepresentations to obtain entry into Canada, that is, misrepresentations made by a returning PR during the PoE examination.]
Before responding further, your other posts indicate you have recent personal experience with PoE examinations specifically in regards to a PR in a situation very similar to yours . . . or, actually, precisely in your situation. Including a very recent post (just this past Friday) suggesting, first, you are currently in Canada, and secondly you had just returned to Canada while in breach.
The forum should be looking for you to provide input about what can happen at the PoE for a PR just a little in breach.
For context:
And then there is this one (posted November 30 for reference):
And there is the series of posts in another topic you started with this:
NOTE: there are some discrepancies in the details in the various posts. Which happens without that meaning much, just a mistake here or there. Some potentially more significant than others. Whether the exit in October was in mid-October (October 14 according to November 30 post) or October 30 (today's post) is largely insignificant. Obviously, whether the OP was in Canada or not last Friday, is potentially more significant, BUT even setting aside an assumption that was an anticipatory or hypothetical presence rather than actually being here, that is, even if there is discrepancy in the facts here, in the overriding factual setting even that is probably of little significance.
WHAT IS MORE SIGNIFICANT, in terms of getting the story straight, so-to-say, is to be BOTH CONSISTENT and TRUTHFUL in answering border officials' questions. If answers during previous PoE interviews are not consistent with the truth, it is more important to be TRUTHFUL going forward than to be consistent with previous answers. We all make mistakes. Some are more serious than others. It tends to be a serious mistake to double down on or otherwise attempt to conceal a previous mistake.
As I noted above, it appears you are likely overthinking things. There is probably little reason to apprehend Residency Obligation questions UNLESS something about YOUR previous PoE experience suggests there are already some RO concerns about you, you personally.
If, for whatever reason, that is the case, that is that your personal experiences at the PoE this year indicate there is a concern about you, or if for whatever other reason your next PoE screening goes there, into questions about your RO compliance, the best you can do is still what @armoured suggested. Be upfront. Be truthful. Do not be evasive. To the extent asked, tell your story, but no need to elaborate.
As to why in general it is NOT likely there will even be questions about your RO compliance, let alone a formal RO compliance examination: the short length of time you have been abroad (since last in Canada) and the minimal extent of the breach by a PR well within the first five years of landing.
Any PR in breach of the RO is at RISK of RO compliance questioning at a PoE, and at RISK of being Reported if determined to be in breach. If you are not in the process of finally coming to Canada to stay, to settle and stay, that increases the risks some . . . BUT if you have indeed come here at least twice this year, and your most recent absence is only two or three months, the probability of being confronted with RO compliance questions (except as noted above) is LOW, ranging from LOW to VERY LOW. This is especially so given your landing was just in 2018 and your PR card is valid until sometime well into 2023.
I cannot recall seeing any anecdotal reports of a PR being reported in circumstances anywhere near yours. There are no more than rare reports about RO related questioning at all in circumstances anywhere near yours. I have seen NO IAD decisions about a PR being Reported in similar circumstances. I do not read all the IAD decisions about PR inadmissibility for RO breaches, but over the course of the last decade I have been regularly reading and researching many of them, and as best I can recall none happened any sooner than at least a full three and a half years after landing, and those were cases where the PR had been absent for nearly three and a half years since the last time they were in Canada (that is, soft landing followed by well over three years before next coming to Canada).
In any event, it appears you are overthinking things. But, sometimes the appearance of overthinking things is rooted in some awareness. Either way, the short answer, the be truthful, cooperative but brief answer, covers it.
IndianBos
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- Oct 8, 2014
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- 2174
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Chances of you being reported are quite low. I was in a same situation in 2018, was short of residency obligation by around 8-10 days. I was sent to secondary and was let go with a warning. They do ask you to stay in the country for 2 years straight so as to conform to residency obligation.
REMEMBER: If you are in BREACH OF RO, you are NOT OBLIGATED TO TRUTHFULLY HELP BORDER OFFICER TO DEPORT YOU. YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO REMAIN SILENT. Don't EVER forget the RIGHT TO REMAIN SILENT. It's LEGAL to remain SILENT. Do NOT help border agent to deport you, do NOT TALK if what you say is not in your favor. Just KEEP SILENT.
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No, they cannot deport you immediately.
Please read other threads here about the process. Because I repeat my point above: if you (as it seems) mostly live in Canada, and only 15 days in breach, and reply calmly and credibly why you were abroad and any other relevant, chances are good (probably very good) you'll just be let in without anything more. That's not a guarantee.
Worst case, you get 'reported' (they start process of revoking PR status, but only start) and you can appeal. If you remain in Canada during the appeal process, very unlikley it would lead to revocation of status.
Look, there are people on this board who give credible information. There are some whose information is not credible.
If someone explicitly tells you that every interaction they've ever had with CBSA has been bad, then perhaps their advice on how to deal with CBSA is not so good. (Also, non-crazy people do not use the word salad phrasing "Orwellian Triple Hermetic Secret Worshipping Initiative.")
I was sent to secondary inspection each time I crossed into Canada by land, and in all cases I had plenty of time to comply with RO, I was NOT in breach of RO. But they grilled me, in hopes that I was in breach or they could find something else to deport me. So, just because you were treated nicely doesn't mean the OP will get the same treatment. They treat everyone differently and there is no transparency as to what the criteria is for admissions officer at POE, to treat one better or worse than the other.