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Can a citizenship application be rejected after AOR? If yes, do you have to satisfy residency criteria again before reapplying?

limits

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Hi,

As the topic states, I am wondering if it is possible for CIC to reject a citizenship application after AOR has been sent to an applicant and if yes, for what reasons can they do that? Further, if it is rejected, would the applicant have to satisfy residence criteria for citizenship again before reapplying?

This is just a hypothetical question to satisfy my curiosity. Of course, if anyone has first hand experiences to share, that would be lovely as well!
 

EUK

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Hi,

As the topic states, I am wondering if it is possible for CIC to reject a citizenship application after AOR has been sent to an applicant and if yes, for what reasons can they do that? Further, if it is rejected, would the applicant have to satisfy residence criteria for citizenship again before reapplying?

This is just a hypothetical question to satisfy my curiosity. Of course, if anyone has first hand experiences to share, that would be lovely as well!
Yes it can be specially when someones has spent less than 1095 days in Canada as per current policy.
 
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Seym

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AOR is just a completeness check, that you ticked all the boxes, provided all the documents, signed everywhere...
The actual assessment of someone's eligibility starts after. You can probably find situations where an application was denied by a citizenship judge (years after AOR!) in this forum.

And yes, the applicant must satisfy all criterias whenever he applies, which includes the physical presence requirement.
 

limits

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AOR is just a completeness check, that you ticked all the boxes, provided all the documents, signed everywhere...
The actual assessment of someone's eligibility starts after. You can probably find situations where an application was denied by a citizenship judge (years after AOR!) in this forum.

And yes, the applicant must satisfy all criterias whenever he applies, which includes the physical presence requirement.
The only two eligibility criteria left after AOR to possibly be rejected on are physical presence and criminality though, right? Assuming you satisfied both of those, what else can they reject you on?
 

dpenabill

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As the topic states, I am wondering if it is possible for CIC to reject a citizenship application after AOR has been sent to an applicant and if yes, for what reasons can they do that? Further, if it is rejected, would the applicant have to satisfy residence criteria for citizenship again before reapplying?
The only two eligibility criteria left after AOR to possibly be rejected on are physical presence and criminality though, right? Assuming you satisfied both of those, what else can they reject you on?
As others have commented, AOR merely means CPC-Sydney has determined the application is complete. NO assessment of the merits of the application. NO determination that the applicant has met ANY of the requirements for a grant of citizenship other than the procedural requirement to submit a COMPLETE application.

Thus, even though there is AOR, ALL the requirements for a grant of citizenship are YET to be evaluated and determined.

For example, adult applicants will be tested for knowledge of Canada AND ability in one of the official languages. The latter is done attendant the knowledge test and accompanying interview. The "proof" of language ability submitted with the application ONLY satisfies the requirement that such proof be included to constitute a complete application. NOTE: even if the applicant passes both the written knowledge of Canada test AND is assessed by the interviewer to meet the language ability requirement, IF the applicant is later required to attend an additional interview or hearing, with either a Citizenship Officer or Citizenship Judge, the applicant may be examined again to verify the applicant has the requisite knowledge of Canada AND ability in an official language -- and further note, the applicant may be advised of a particular reason for such further interview or hearing, such as questions about actual physical presence or prohibitions, but the notice generally refers to the requirements for a grant of citizenship and the Federal Court has held this is sufficient notice to the applicant that the interview or hearing may also involve testing for knowledge of Canada and/or ability in one of the official languages.

Somewhat recent Federal Court decision stating this involved an applicant called to an interview/hearing because of concerns about whether she had actually met the physical presence requirements, which her evidence showed she did, but she failed the oral test of knowledge of Canada, which she claimed was unfairly given since the notice did not specifically advise her that she would be tested, again, for knowledge of Canada.

This highlights the fact that applicants must continue to meet ALL the requirements right up to the actual grant of citizenship consummated by taking the oath. Note, for example, even though a decision is made approving the grant of citizenship, and the applicant is scheduled to take the oath, there have been more than a few cases where the day the applicant shows up for the oath that applicant's oath is cancelled and the case is subject to further processing . . . this typically involves either information that the applicant has a prohibition (an arrest the morning the oath is scheduled will constitute a prohibition) or that the actual presence calculation needs to be re-evaluated.

If and when the process gets bogged down resulting in long delays, such as it was 7 to 11 years ago, and which it appears likely to be happening now due to Covid-19, for those applicants who have moved abroad after applying ongoing compliance with the PR Residency Obligation can also become an issue. A key requirement, after all, is that the individual have valid PR status . . . and again, this requirement must be met right up to the taking of the oath.

As also noted by others, any material misrepresentation, at any time during the process, can result in the application being denied. Additionally, the applicant must timely and appropriately respond to all requests for additional information, and appear as scheduled.
 

limits

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If and when the process gets bogged down resulting in long delays, such as it was 7 to 11 years ago, and which it appears likely to be happening now due to Covid-19, for those applicants who have moved abroad after applying ongoing compliance with the PR Residency Obligation can also become an issue. A key requirement, after all, is that the individual have valid PR status . . . and again, this requirement must be met right up to the taking of the oath.
Do you know what happened last time the process got bogged down 7 to 11 years ago? How much was the process delayed by? That would be a good indication of how long we can expect the process to be delayed by this time.

With regards to the PR Residency Obligation, to maintain your PR Status you must be present in Canada for 730 days (2 years) in the past 5 years. So assuming you became eligible and applied for Citizenship today, for most applicants their PR status will be valid for at least 2-3 years. Given that the whole process takes 1-1.5 years until you receive your grant, you are pretty safe. Of course, that might not be the case anymore and one will have to be watchful of maintaining their PR status as there maybe delays.
 

dpenabill

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Do you know what happened last time the process got bogged down 7 to 11 years ago? How much was the process delayed by? That would be a good indication of how long we can expect the process to be delayed by this time.
No, unfortunately, that history (from 2009 well into 2013) will not illuminate much if anything about how long the processing of citizenship applications may take in the wake of the Covid-19 global pandemic. We are still very much in the midst of stuff-happens relative to the Covid-19 situation, and probably a long way yet from fully seeing its direct impact let alone indirect and downstream consequences. And the nature of the slowdown in processing a decade ago was very different than what is happening now.

Sometimes it is very, very difficult to forecast how things are going to go. This is clearly one of those times.

As for how and why the process got so bogged down a decade ago, there was not just one factor that triggered or dominated the slowdown in processing, although much of it was related to the Conservative government's concerns about and measures taken against what was then perceived to be widespread immigration and citizenship fraud, fueled in large part by what was perceived to be passport shopping, seeking a passport-of-convenience, and applying-on-the-way-to-the-airport. But it was more complicated than that. For example, during that time a large number of PRs continued to make what were called 'short-fall' applications, based on meeting the "residency" requirement even though they had not been actually physically present in Canada the then-standard 1095 days in the preceding four years. The law was a total mess. Vague and confusing, subject to multiple different interpretations, so a very large percentage of those cases were necessarily on a full-blown RQ and Citizenship Judge hearing track, bogging the system down considerably.

Half of the routinely processed applications were taking longer than TWO years by 2012-2013. Any non-routine processing at all could lead to a timeline of THREE plus years, with a rather large number of cases taking longer than FOUR years. At the same time, this was nowhere near uniform. A large number of routinely processed applications were, during this same period, taking just six to eight months. My own 2013 application took just eight months and those sitting beside me at the oath ceremony had waited just six months. In contrast, a friend of mine said his application took longer than SIX years, and the Federal Court cases revealed some taking from EIGHT to TEN years.

Again, there were MANY factors contributing to that mess. And it was a mess. A big part of how and why I got so involved in these matters. Took TWO MAJOR REVISIONS of the Citizenship Act (Bill C-24 and Bill C-6) to sort things out. Revising the Citizenship Act does not come easily. Bill C-24 was the first major revision of provisions governing the grant of naturalized citizenship in a QUARTER-Century, even though experts, lawyers, and Federal judges were all clamoring for needed changes for decades.



With regards to the PR Residency Obligation, to maintain your PR Status you must be present in Canada for 730 days (2 years) in the past 5 years. So assuming you became eligible and applied for Citizenship today, for most applicants their PR status will be valid for at least 2-3 years. Given that the whole process takes 1-1.5 years until you receive your grant, you are pretty safe. Of course, that might not be the case anymore and one will have to be watchful of maintaining their PR status as there maybe delays.
"Given that the whole process takes 1-1.5 years until you receive your grant, you are pretty safe."​

Of course only PRs who move abroad (or go abroad for extended periods of time and think that describing that as "travel" abroad changes the nature and character of what really amounts to residing abroad), while the application is pending, have any reason to be concerned about complying with the PR Residency Obligation pending their application for citizenship.

But for those who have moved abroad while the application is pending:

For the next year or so, or more, my sense is that a large number of citizenship applicants are going to see timelines significantly longer than a year and a half. How long is near impossible to forecast. But it seems rather obvious that at the very minimum EIGHT to TEN months has for sure already been added to the timeline that was already pushing one-year for many citizenship applicants. My guess is that it is going to go longer before it begins to lessen again. And for those who encounter non-routine processing, the timeline could easily increase to two-to-three years. In the meantime, those who move abroad while the application is pending quite likely have a much bigger RISK of non-routine processing, and as the timeline goes longer, and thus they are outside Canada longer, that fact will become more obvious and likely to increase the risks even more.
 

limits

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But for those who have moved abroad while the application is pending:

For the next year or so, or more, my sense is that a large number of citizenship applicants are going to see timelines significantly longer than a year and a half. How long is near impossible to forecast. But it seems rather obvious that at the very minimum EIGHT to TEN months has for sure already been added to the timeline that was already pushing one-year for many citizenship applicants. My guess is that it is going to go longer before it begins to lessen again. And for those who encounter non-routine processing, the timeline could easily increase to two-to-three years. In the meantime, those who move abroad while the application is pending quite likely have a much bigger RISK of non-routine processing, and as the timeline goes longer, and thus they are outside Canada longer, that fact will become more obvious and likely to increase the risks even more.
I agree with you on all parts except that, moving abroad after you have met the eligibility criteria and applied for citizenship in Canada does not automatically increase your risk for non-routine processing. Non-routine processing is triggered when there is lack of clarity in your application or the officer is not able to verify your physical presence. If you have met eligibility criteria correctly and documented all your travel and are able to come back to Canada as and when required (for oath, fingerprints etc), there should not be any difference between the risk for non-routine processing between a person who has moved abroad vs a person who is still residing in Canada. If there is evidence contradicting the same, I would love to see it because I cannot find any.
 
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royce110

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I agree with you on all parts except that, moving abroad after you have met the eligibility criteria and applied for citizenship in Canada does not automatically increase your risk for non-routine processing. Non-routine processing is triggered when there is lack of clarity in your application or the officer is not able to verify your physical presence. If you have met eligibility criteria correctly and documented all your travel and are able to come back to Canada as and when required (for oath, fingerprints etc), there should not be any difference between the risk for non-routine processing between a person who has moved abroad vs a person who is still residing in Canada. If there is evidence contradicting the same, I would love to see it because I cannot find any.
I agree with this, the 5 year time period in the crucial one and once you have proven eligibility and provided a detailed account of trips and shown you have paid taxes inland, no other adverse activity, then you being abroad after submitting the application does not really matter as long as you receive and respond to any correspondence on time.
 
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dpenabill

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Note, this addresses a very narrow tangent of the primary subject in this thread. The vast majority of citizenship applicants do NOT move abroad after applying. Thus, the influence on how things go, the impact moving abroad after applying might have, has NO relevance for the vast majority of applicants. This tangent is relevant ONLY for those applicants who move abroad (or who say they are "traveling" abroad but who in fact are living abroad, or otherwise staying abroad for an extended period).

For anyone considering living abroad while their application is pending, it warrants remembering that ANY applicant, no matter how well qualified, no matter how strong their case is, can be subject to RQ-related non-routine processing and the delays that inherently causes. At various times, for example, CIC/IRCC has done quality assurance exercises which include RANDOMLY issued RQ. Mere coincidences have triggered RQ. And, there are still indications that living abroad increases the risk of getting RQ'd.

In particular, IRCC does NOT need to have justification for issuing RQ. Its reasons for issuing RQ are NOT subject to review for procedural fairness.

But for those who have moved abroad while the application is pending:

For the next year or so . . . for those who encounter non-routine processing, the timeline could easily increase to two-to-three years. In the meantime, those who move abroad while the application is pending quite likely have a much bigger RISK of non-routine processing, and as the timeline goes longer, and thus they are outside Canada longer, that fact will become more obvious and likely to increase the risks even more.
I agree with you on all parts except that, moving abroad after you have met the eligibility criteria and applied for citizenship in Canada does not automatically increase your risk for non-routine processing. Non-routine processing is triggered when there is lack of clarity in your application or the officer is not able to verify your physical presence. If you have met eligibility criteria correctly and documented all your travel and are able to come back to Canada as and when required (for oath, fingerprints etc), there should not be any difference between the risk for non-routine processing between a person who has moved abroad vs a person who is still residing in Canada. If there is evidence contradicting the same, I would love to see it because I cannot find any.
I agree with this, the 5 year time period in the crucial one and once you have proven eligibility and provided a detailed account of trips and shown you have paid taxes inland, no other adverse activity, then you being abroad after submitting the application does not really matter as long as you receive and respond to any correspondence on time.
Does residing abroad pending citizenship application processing affect the risk of RQ-related non-routine processing?

This is one of those matters for which there tends to be quite a lot of confusion between How-It-Should-Be and How-It-Is.

In particular, there appears to be a tendency to confuse whether living abroad, after applying, SHOULD affect (increase) the risk of RQ-related non-routine processing, with whether, in practice, living abroad while the application is pending will increase the RISK of RQ.

That is . . . Even IF Living Abroad After Applying Should NOT Elevate the RISK of RQ, It Very Likely Does:

There is a lot of reporting, and a great deal of history, signalling that living abroad after applying increases the RISK of RQ. Consider the following post made just a couple days ago, in response to one participant indicating a plan to move abroad after applying, another participant assuring that individual it was, essentially, OK, and then this:
. . . just for your information, people who leave the country before being granted citizenship and who just return for the test and interview will have a very huge question mark on their case that in many cases would lead to further investigations and delays. they are looked at like being not committed and willing to stay in the country. I have a friend whose citizenship application process took 2.5 years just because he did that. I recommend not giving people misleading advice that could mess up their life.
Reports consistent with that post are NOT at all uncommon in this forum.

Perhaps this particular post overstates it some. Many who go abroad after applying do not encounter RQ-related non-routine processing or delays because of it. But many others do.

At the very least there appears to be a strong statistical correlation between extended time abroad after applying and encountering RQ-related non-routine processing.

And then there is the history. The history looms large. The criteria employed by IRCC, for identifying if there are reasons-to-question-residency, are confidential, not disclosed to the public, and have been essentially secret for many years now. When the criteria was not secret, and was publicly disclosed information, that included an appendix to the Operational Manual CP 5 "Residence," in which indications of living abroad were explicit reasons-to-question-residency, where, for example, it stated that a passport stamp indicating the applicant had returned to Canada shortly before the test and interview was, all by itself, a reason-to-question-residency. Here is a quote from the CP 5 list of "indications that further inquiry into declared residence may be required:"
"When coming to write an exam or to have a quality assurance interview, the client’s passport shows recent entry stamp to Canada or an exit stamp from another country."​

Since the specific criteria were deemed confidential, when Harper was PM, we've only had limited access to what criteria is still employed. To the extent we've been able to extrapolate, from multiple various sources, in conjunction with anecdotal reports, it appears quite likely that extended absences after applying, and especially a change of residence to outside Canada, either is a particular factor which can trigger RQ or is at least considered in conjunction with other factors in determining whether RQ is issued.

There is a reason, and it is not mere paranoia, why so many of those who move abroad after applying, or are considering doing so, come to a forum like this looking for assurance it is OK to NOT inform IRCC they have changed their home address, where they actually live, to an address outside Canada. Many apprehend that the RISK of RQ-related scrutiny and non-routine processing looms large if IRCC is aware the applicant has moved abroad since applying.

Some of the apprehension about a negative impact is based on recognizing the extent to which many in Canada, and quite likely in the government including IRCC, do not favour granting citizenship to those perceived to be passport shopping, applying for a passport of convenience, or as sometimes described, applying-on-the-way-to-the-airport.

Currently, none of these constitutes grounds for denying a citizenship application. Currently, living abroad after applying does NOT directly affect the applicant's eligibility UNLESS the applicant remains abroad so long that there is a PR Residency Obligation compliance issue. (Note: as a clue regarding the extent of negative sentiments, for a short time, however, until repealed by the Liberal government, there was a provision in the Citizenship Act, as adopted in 2014, which did give the government grounds for denying citizenship if the applicant was determined to be residing abroad after applying, even if the applicant otherwise met ALL other requirements.)

Which brings this to emphasizing the distinction between what might trigger RQ, and what will be grounds for denying the application. As long as the applicant meets all the requirements for a grant of citizenship, which includes actual physical presence during the relevant five year "eligibility period," the fact the applicant is living abroad after applying is NOT a ground for denying the application. So sure, the applicant who moves abroad who can prove actual presence, if requested, if issued RQ, and who can otherwise respond timely to requests and appear as scheduled for events, including the test, interview, and oath, remains qualified and is entitled to the grant of citizenship despite living abroad after applying.

But that does not diminish the RISK that IRCC will elevate scrutiny and subject the applicant to RQ-related non-routine processing . . . which in turn can add a rather long delay to the processing time. Which until Covid-19, and this year's circumstances, would not likely be so long that RO compliance could become an issue. Now we do not know how long things are going to go for those bogged down in RQ. Going forward, the processing time could again go so long (as it did in the 2009 to 2013 period) that those living abroad encounter PR RO compliance issues.
 
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limits

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@dpenabill Great illuminating post. So, in your opinion, how do you suggest that people who did indeed "travel abroad" after applying for citizenship, reduce their RISK of getting RQd? It would be ridiculous to expect them to come back to Canada permanently. There must be a better solution. Also, afaik you do not even get a stamp on your passport these days when you come into Canada. They stopped that procedure.

Further, it would be great if you could cite more than ONE reference. The one you did cite was talking about an anecdotal experience about his friend, and not his own. I used the search function to try to find other people getting RQs due to being abroad for extended periods of time but I couldn't find much other than your comments.
 
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dpenabill

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Again: this is a very narrow tangent regarding how it goes, or how it MIGHT go, for applicants living abroad after applying --

. . . it would be great if you could cite more than ONE reference. The one you did cite was talking about an anecdotal experience about his friend, and not his own. I used the search function to try to find other people getting RQs due to being abroad for extended periods of time but I couldn't find much other than your comments.
As I noted, such anecdotal reports are not uncommon in this forum. Using a double negative ("not uncommon") to describe quantity is far from ideal. But such anecdotal reports are also not common.

A similar quantitative description, just as vague, is applicable to anecdotal reports about the impact of moving abroad generally. Somewhere in between common and uncommon. That is, overall the number is few, so not enough to be common, but not so few as to be uncommon. Too few to draw firm conclusions based on them alone (which is part of why I reference the history and last known criteria for questioning residency). Enough, nonetheless, to see a range of reports, from no problems to some problems, including RQ or otherwise some non-routine delays, and thus enough to see that how it goes VARIES. Among those reporting *issues* there appears to be at least a few still outstanding, already delayed (before Covid) and subject to non-routine processing, and now very much in limbo as even the most routine applications are for the time being.

But the reports are, indeed, relatively few, and scattered. While you should be able to find some of the other anecdotal accounts if you searched and found other comments by me about this subject, at least if you read back through the older topics and read through the posts of others in the topics, those would be a mere slice. In contrast, many references to this pop up in other contexts, including topics for complaining about delays, topics about non-routine processing, especially those about RQ-related non-routine processing. This includes a number of times, a number of reports, by forum participants who only incidentally reference being abroad AND the issues they have encountered.

I do not keep a collection of these reports. There are enough periodically to recognize the pattern that a significant number of applicants abroad for an extended length of time are still encountering problems. There are typically enough that one can be readily found and cited, such as the one I cited here . . . which I quoted and linked merely as a representative example of these kinds of reports . . . I chose that example simply because it was the most recent, posted less than two days earlier (at the time), and it is worth noting it was in a topic that had NOTHING to do with traveling or moving abroad.

In contrast, there are also enough to see that quite a few do NOT encounter a problem. Which is why, in reference to the anecdotal report I cited, I suggested that perhaps it overstates things a bit.

Overall, over the course of recent years, there have been enough of both kinds, with sufficient context, to infer that in general living abroad after applying still tends to increase the risk of RQ-related non-routine processing.

That said, a substantial percentage of this anecdotal reporting tends to be shy in detail, lacking follow-up, and otherwise subject to the weaknesses inherent in anecdotal reporting here generally. Especially since most of these anecdotal reports arise in topics that are not specifically related to issues or questions about moving abroad after applying.

One of the most common weaknesses in the anecdotal reporting is the extent to which those involved are not altogether honest in how they characterize things. Many, and perhaps a majority of questions about going abroad and staying abroad after applying, refer to "traveling" abroad. A few will outright reference "moving" abroad. More reference "travel" abroad. As if the label changes anything.

A very high percentage of the queries here ask whether an applicant needs to notify IRCC about "traveling" abroad. The real question typically is whether an applicant needs to notify IRCC if the applicant changes the address where she lives. Which is a question so easily answered it is rarely asked. Of course the applicant needs to notify IRCC of a change in "home" address.

Except many (probably most) of those changing where they reside to an address abroad generally do not want to let IRCC know that. So, while those who change their home address within Canada routinely update this information with IRCC, with no doubt about the need to notify IRCC, in contrast many of those headed abroad are looking for alternatives which will not alert IRCC they have moved abroad. For obvious reasons.

Which leads to the lack of details in the anecdotal reporting about how it goes. Let's be honest. There is a likely explanation for this. Most are probably NOT truthfully notifying IRCC of the address where they are actually residing, abroad, but giving IRCC the address of a family member or close friend IN Canada. As fraud goes, this is not particularly egregious, and it is not something IRCC appears to focus on or pursue much. Perhaps it is a bit like going 10k or even 20k over the speed limit on the 401. No ticket, no offence, no problem. That is, as fraud goes, there is probably a lot of getting-away-with-it among the relatively small number of applicants who move abroad after applying.

As relatively minor a fraud it is, and easy to get-away-with, still not something most will go broadcasting much, even anonymously in a forum like this. After all, if the applicant is concealing where he actually resides from IRCC, even if that is a minor fraud, it is still fraud.

Which brings this to what your question, asking me to do the homework to identify and cite some of the other anecdotal reports here, is really about.

Framing the Question: Is your question about --
-- verifying that living abroad while the application is pending increases the RISK of RQ-related scrutiny and thus RQ-related non-routine processing, or​
-- seeing other reports in order to identify or at least discern some factors which influence the nature or scope of the RISK of RQ​

If the first, you'll have to trust me (in saying that such reports are not uncommon here) or go ahead and do the homework for yourself. I have very little doubt that living abroad while the application is pending increases the RISK of RQ-related non-routine processing. I regularly, even if only occasionally, see reports here of this happening.

If the question is about the latter, the second, looking for influential factors, that is a very difficult and complex question. At times I have tried to gather and collate and analyze enough of these reports to identify patterns in who gets RQ and who doesn't. The reports are simply too few, too scattered, and too lacking in detail, to support this, and that is apart from the fudging-element typical in these reports (such as characterizing moving abroad as "travel" abroad), which makes it especially difficult to extrapolate reliable conclusions from them.

If one goes back several years, back to the years when Harper was PM and CIC (as then named) was engaged in a very overt effort to identify and intensely scrutinize any applicants perceived to have applied-on-the-way-to-the-airport, or otherwise perceived to be seeking a passport-of-convenience, there was a stronger, more stark contrast, between those applicants living abroad after applying who encountered NO problems versus those dragged into what was then seemingly an endless delay; those who did NOT encounter problems generally seemed to obviously be abroad TEMPORARILY . . . such as, for example, students attending a special graduate program abroad. But there was, even then, a lot of inconsistency and incongruity, relative to which applications went one way and which went the other . . . except back then, it was FOR-SURE the risk of RQ-related non-routine processing was MUCH HIGHER for any applicant who moved abroad after applying. Much-much-higher. The Harper era government was actually rather aggressive in targeting those perceived to be applying-on-the-way-to-the-airport in those days (and for a brief time the Harper government had amended the Citizenship Act, until the new Trudeau government repealed it, to give CIC a basis to outright deny an application based on the a determination the applicant was residing outside Canada while the application was pending).
 

dpenabill

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So, in your opinion, how do you suggest that people who did indeed "travel abroad" after applying for citizenship, reduce their RISK of getting RQd? It would be ridiculous to expect them to come back to Canada permanently. There must be a better solution. Also, afaik you do not even get a stamp on your passport these days when you come into Canada. They stopped that procedure.
There is NO increased risk of RQ for those who "travel abroad" after applying. No need to do anything to reduce their risk of getting RQ'd.

For those who have moved abroad (however they personally label it), it is what it is. Their decision. Most recognize the risks. As noted before, many (probably most) engage in a bit of fraud and misrepresent to IRCC (by omission or otherwise) the address where they actually reside.

I do not follow or understand the statement "It would be ridiculous to expect them to come back to Canada permanently." Who besides themselves "expect" them to do anything? I doubt anyone "expects" them to come back to Canada even temporarily, to take the test, be interviewed, or take the oath. They certainly are not required to do so. It is their choice. There is no requirement to follow through with the application process UNLESS that is what the applicant chooses to do. There is no penalty for abandoning a citizenship application.

Otherwise, remember, getting RQ'd does not mean the application is denied. Just means the applicant must provide competent evidence to prove his or her actual physical presence IN Canada during the five year eligibility period. Just because the applicant is living abroad after applying does not change where the applicant was during the eligibility period, and it does not affect let alone preclude any other qualification . . . UNLESS, the applicant is abroad so long after applying as to not comply with the PR Residency Obligation.

"Also, afaik you do not even get a stamp on your passport these days when you come into Canada."​

Also not clear why you mention this. Are you trying to suggest that it is not the case that living abroad after applying increases the risk of RQ?

BUT yes, indeed, of course the mechanics related to information gathering, record-keeping, and fact-checking have evolved considerably since the 2005 publication of the reasons-to-question-residency that were included in CP 5. So, yeah, the physical way in which IRCC will NOW note or be aware an applicant is living abroad and has just come back to Canada in time to attend the test, for example, is not the same as it was when passports were routinely stamped.

What the last publicly disclosed criteria (in CP 5) reveals is that the government was looking for indicators of living abroad. Fact that how the government discerns an applicant has been living abroad is not, and cannot be the same now, since for example they do not routinely stamp passports upon arrival now, does not mean, not at all, they are not using other means for discerning who is not living in Canada . . . let alone what effect it has if and when a processing agent or citizenship officer simply recognizes, realizes, the applicant is someone living outside Canada.

Or, are you suggesting that for those who have moved abroad after applying, and are concealing this from IRCC, that the absence of stamps in passports indicating arrival in Canada makes it easier to, in effect, get-away-with-it, to avoid IRCC learning the applicant has been living abroad and just came to Canada in time to attend the test? Maybe. I don't tend to explore let alone expand on details in how to get-away-it.

I will also observe, however, that the amount of concern about applicants living abroad after applying has probably diminished a good deal. For sure a lot since the Liberal government replaced Harper's more severe almost draconian effort to find cause to deny citizenship to almost every applicant perceived to be applying-on-the-way-to-the-airport (while never confirmed, there were a lot of indicators back then that CIC would overtly stall and delay such applicants for basically as long as they could, deliberately trying to stall long enough the applicant abroad would run into a Residency Obligation compliance problem).

I suspect there is, currently, significantly less concern than the previous Liberal government had regarding this, when under a Liberal government indications of living abroad after applying were adopted as a reason-to-question-residency (in 2005). In particular, it appears that an extended absence after applying is not the hard trigger for RQ it was back then. But, nonetheless, over the course of the last eight years, since the criteria for issuing RQ became confidential, that is secret, in following all the relevant sources of information available it remains fairly clear that an elevated risk of RQ continues for those who move abroad after applying . . . even though it does not always trigger RQ.
 

limits

Hero Member
May 13, 2015
209
48
Framing the Question: Is your question about --
-- verifying that living abroad while the application is pending increases the RISK of RQ-related scrutiny and thus RQ-related non-routine processing, or
-- seeing other reports in order to identify or at least discern some factors which influence the nature or scope of the RISK of RQ

If the first, you'll have to trust me (in saying that such reports are not uncommon here) or go ahead and do the homework for yourself. I have very little doubt that living abroad while the application is pending increases the RISK of RQ-related non-routine processing. I regularly, even if only occasionally, see reports here of this happening.
To make the statement you have, quoted in bold, you have to keep this in mind:
Only people who have RQ related problems report them on this forum, there are countless who's process goes smoothly who don't report it at all on here because there is nothing to report. So, there is an inherent selection bias involved due to which RQ related reports here are not a good indication for making the statement that I have emboldened.

But, if indeed you wanted to make the claim you made about travel/moving abroad increasing the chance of RQ based on the data you can find on this forum, you would have to ask your self the following question: Out of ALL the RQ related questions you see on this forum, is a large proportion of them travel/moving abroad related? If YES, then one can say with some certainty that traveling/moving abroad after applying for citizenship increases ones chance of RQ as compared to normal. From my prelimnary research on this forum, this does not seem to be the case i.e. out of the total RQs reported on this forum, only a VERY SMALL MINORITY of reports are RQs related to traveling / moving abroad.

However, I am open to changing my mind about this, hence I asked you to cite more examples than the ONE anecdotal example you cited. If you are able to say, cite 10 examples, then one can at least have some confirmation that traveling/moving abroad increases the RISK of RQs. From my searching on this forum, I could not find much but since you have been on this forum much longer, maybe you are able to come up with at least a few examples that you DISTINCTLY remember of travel related RQs post Harper govt.

"Also, afaik you do not even get a stamp on your passport these days when you come into Canada."

Also not clear why you mention this. Are you trying to suggest that it is not the case that living abroad after applying increases the risk of RQ?

BUT yes, indeed, of course the mechanics related to information gathering, record-keeping, and fact-checking have evolved considerably since the 2005 publication of the reasons-to-question-residency that were included in CP 5. So, yeah, the physical way in which IRCC will NOW note or be aware an applicant is living abroad and has just come back to Canada in time to attend the test, for example, is not the same as it was when passports were routinely stamped.
I mentioned this because you had said in your earlier posts in this thread, one of the risk factors for RQ from the previous government was "When coming to write an exam or to have a quality assurance interview, the client’s passport shows recent entry stamp to Canada or an exit stamp from another country." However, since passport stamps are not performed anymore, this cannot be a risk factor at all unless they are looking at your travel history at the time of the interview from another source. From reading reports of the test interview, it does not seem to be the case that they are.
 
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