A conflict between Statutory Questions in EE and Schedule A, misrepresentation ?

[iceage]

Hey Guys!

There is big issue we can see in case of Statutory Questions in EE PR application. The Question No. E is different in EE compare to Schedule A.

Like:
In EE:
• Has <xyz> ever been refused a visa or permit, denied entry or ordered to leave Canada or any other country?

But in Schedule A:
• been refused admission to or ordered to leave canada or any other country.

WHY ONLY this question is different?

The previous question in EE:
• Has <xyz> been refused refugee status, an immigrant or permanent resident visa (including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial Nominee Program) or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?

The first part of the question in Q. E is similar with this previous question.

Some people got confused what to answer when they asked to submit Schedule A which may bring them to Misrepresentation. Let's discuss about it and find any solution.

A case:
When someone has a rejection in visitor visa then he may select YES in Q. E in EE but when CIC request Schedule A then he may write in NO in Q. E this brings a misrepresentation though I guess it is error on CIC side.

 

[dobes]

Hey Guys!

There is big issue we can see in case of Statutory Questions in EE PR application. The Question No. E is different in EE compare to Schedule A.

Like:
In EE:
• Has <xyz> ever been refused a visa or permit, denied entry or ordered to leave Canada or any other country?

But in Schedule A:
• been refused admission to or ordered to leave canada or any other country.

WHY ONLY this question is different?

The previous question in EE:
• Has <xyz> been refused refugee status, an immigrant or permanent resident visa (including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial Nominee Program) or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?

The first part of the question in Q. E is similar with this previous question.

Some people got confused what to answer when they asked to submit Schedule A which may bring them to Misrepresentation. Let's discuss about it and find any solution.

A case:
When someone has a rejection in visitor visa then he may select YES in Q. E in EE but when CIC request Schedule A then he may write in NO in Q. E this brings a misrepresentation though I guess it is error on CIC side.

OK, this is a little technical, but stay with me.

The EE application basically asks the same question twice - if you have ever been denied a visa - and then adds, the second time, a question of whether you have ever been denied entry to any country, or have been removed from any country. The second part addresses those people who do not need a visa to enter many countries, but who may be denied entrance for various reasons when they present themselves at the border.

If you needed a visa to enter a country or change or renew status in that country and were denied, you have to answer 'yes' to both questions in the EE application. If you didn't need a visa to visit Canada or some other country, but were denied entry at the border, or if you had a visa but when you arrived they refused to admit you anyway, or if you were admitted to any country but then asked to leave, deported, or removed - answer yes to the second question only.

On schedule A, the questions are a little different. The first, d, is clear - if you applied for a status in Canada or elsewhere and were turned down, answer yes. In (e), they are not repeating the question of a visa denial as they did in the EE application. Here, they are only asking if you were ever denied entry at the border of a country, whether you needed a visa to enter or not, or if you were ever removed from a country.

The only difference is that in the EE questionnaire, the denial of a visa means answering yes to both questions, and on schedule A it means answering yes only to the first, unless the denial was at the border, as you tried to enter the country.

The terms used in these questions are legal terms (disclosure: my mother was a US immigration attorney - NOT CANADIAN) that are often misunderstood by applicants, and yes, a wrong answer can result in a charge of misrepresentation, as we have seen on this board.

The best course of action, then, is to say YES to these questions if you are not sure whether you should answer yes or no, and then explain. It may be that CIC will read your explanation and think, "That wasn't a visa denial!" and you will be fine. But if you answer NO when the answer should have been yes, because you didn't think whatever happened counted, then you could be in real trouble.

 

[iceage]

OK, this is a little technical, but stay with me.

The EE application basically asks the same question twice - if you have ever been denied a visa - and then adds, the second time, a question of whether you have ever been denied entry to any country, or have been removed from any country. The second part addresses those people who do not need a visa to enter many countries, but who may be denied entrance for various reasons when they present themselves at the border.

If you needed a visa to enter a country or change or renew status in that country and were denied, you have to answer 'yes' to both questions in the EE application. If you didn't need a visa to visit Canada or some other country, but were denied entry at the border, or if you had a visa but when you arrived they refused to admit you anyway, or if you were admitted to any country but then asked to leave, deported, or removed - answer yes to the second question only.

On schedule A, the questions are a little different. The first, d, is clear - if you applied for a status in Canada or elsewhere and were turned down, answer yes. In (e), they are not repeating the question of a visa denial as they did in the EE application. Here, they are only asking if you were ever denied entry at the border of a country, whether you needed a visa to enter or not, or if you were ever removed from a country.

The only difference is that in the EE questionnaire, the denial of a visa means answering yes to both questions, and on schedule A it means answering yes only to the first, unless the denial was at the border, as you tried to enter the country.

The terms used in these questions are legal terms (disclosure: my mother was a US immigration attorney - NOT CANADIAN) that are often misunderstood by applicants, and yes, a wrong answer can result in a charge of misrepresentation, as we have seen on this board.

The best course of action, then, is to say YES to these questions if you are not sure whether you should answer yes or no, and then explain. It may be that CIC will read your explanation and think, "That wasn't a visa denial!" and you will be fine. But if you answer NO when the answer should have been yes, because you didn't think whatever happened counted, then you could be in real trouble.

Thanks for your reply!

What should we do if someone misunderstood the 2nd question (e) in EE with the Schedule A and answered NO? Should s/he send CSE with explanation? Will that help?

 

[CEC_DEC_27]

I am having the same issue. Can anyone suggest on this one plz. I have answered No to question "d" in express entry and Yes to question "E" as i have been rejected a US visa. How should i explain it now.

Thanks for your reply!

What should we do if someone misunderstood the 2nd question (e) in EE with the Schedule A and answered NO? Should s/he send CSE with explanation? Will that help?

 

[iceage]

The question are clear now. We have to look on the sentence structure of both the questions:

First one- 6 (d):
Has <xyz> you been refused refugee status, or an immigrant or permanent resident visa (including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial nominee Program) or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?

- The main concentration is on OR just after , (comma). If a OR is used just after ,(comma) then that sentence before ,OR is a individual clause and the next clause is not depend on the previous one. like we can state the message in case of only refugee status refusal person:

Has <xyz> you been refused refugee status, to Canada or any other country?

The answer would be YES.
...... , or ........ , ...... .

This structure is used which can use to mean: either part is true ....., OR ...... ,

In the same way, we can state the question as

Has <xyz> you been refused an immigrant or permanent resident visa (including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial nominee Program) or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?

OR

Has <xyz> you been refused , permanent resident visa (including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial nominee Program), to Canada?

Excluding the OR optional parts.

NOW.. let's look at the next question 6 (e):

Has <xyz> ever been refused a visa or permit, denied entry or ordered to leave Canada or any other country?:

We can see that after the first clause "refused a visa or permit", there isn't any OR written that means next clause is depend on it like:

Has <xyz> ever been refused a visa or permit, denied entry to leave Canada?:
- That's if anyone refused to entry Canada on port of entry he should say YES. Actually this question is SAME as in Schedule A 6 (e) just rephrased the Admission word which was:

been refused admission to or ordered to leave canada or any other country.

Hope this would help everyone who are straggling to answer those tricky questions. I am still going to discuss it with other lawyers to get more clearance about those.

Thanks!

 

[EFK]

But I think for many of us, we have been denied visas for certain countries (Visit visa etc)...am talking about non-visa exempt passport holders...

So for us, I understand that we mark Yes to both questions, in the EE profile as well as Schedule A, right?

 

[Asivad Anac]

But I think for many of us, we have been denied visas for certain countries (Visit visa etc)...am talking about non-visa exempt passport holders...

So for us, I understand that we mark Yes to both questions, in the EE profile as well as Schedule A, right?

Yes.

 

[se7en]

But I think for many of us, we have been denied visas for certain countries (Visit visa etc)...am talking about non-visa exempt passport holders...

So for us, I understand that we mark Yes to both questions, in the EE profile as well as Schedule A, right?

I believe, on Schedule A only question 6(d) be marked YES if only visas/permits/PRs/PNPs were refused to Canada or any other countries . 6(e) applies to the situation where someone has been denied entry, or deported from Canada or any other country.

 

[Banff2015]

I am glad I am not alone on this I too made that mistake I submitted my schd a this morning and a 2 page explanation of how I misundertood the question and was not trying to miss represnet I have got 2 ghost emails since that I will keep all updated on outcome

 

[EFK]

I believe, on Schedule A only question 6(d) be marked YES if only visas/permits/PRs/PNPs were refused to Canada or any other countries . 6(e) applies to the situation where someone has been denied entry, or deported from Canada or any other country.

Isnt denied entry the same as rejected visa?for exp, if UK rejected my application for visit visa, I automatically understand that they deny me entry into the country as well..

 

[sraj07]

omg, we applicants are not attorneys to break these sentences in legal words and understand .... better answer YES for any visa rejection and then write a big explanation .. is that a right approach ? Instead of in dilemma in YES or NO , better put YES and explain ????

 

[chintanpatel11184]

Hi All,

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestion.

I have applied in SINP Express entry and got monination.While filling the PR application I came to know that My father-in-law has applied for Canada PR in 2002
when my spouse age was 14 year and that file was refused in 2007 when my spouse age was 19 year.My father-in-law has included my spouse as a dependent child.

Now the questions are
1)While submiting the SINP Application in Schedule A Background_Declaration from in point 6(d).

"Has <xyz> been refused refugee status, an immigrant or permanent resident visa
(including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial Nominee Program)
or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?"

I have selected NO.
Do I need to select yes and sent to SINP before submitting the PR file?

2)In the Express entry Profile,there is one question in spouse section.

"Do you ever applied for permanent resident?"

I have select No.

What to do in this while submitting the PR file?

 

[Asivad Anac]

Hi All,

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestion.

I have applied in SINP Express entry and got monination.While filling the PR application I came to know that My father-in-law has applied for Canada PR in 2002
when my spouse age was 14 year and that file was refused in 2007 when my spouse age was 19 year.My father-in-law has included my spouse as a dependent child.

Now the questions are
1)While submiting the SINP Application in Schedule A Background_Declaration from in point 6(d).

"Has <xyz> been refused refugee status, an immigrant or permanent resident visa
(including a Certificat de sélection du Québec (CSQ) or application to the Provincial Nominee Program)
or visitor or temporary resident visa, to Canada or any other country?"

I have selected NO.
Do I need to select yes and sent to SINP before submitting the PR file?

2)In the Express entry Profile,there is one question in spouse section.

"Do you ever applied for permanent resident?"

I have select No.

What to do in this while submitting the PR file?

Answer No to both questions.

 

[ybjianada]

No, they are quite different.

Visa allows you to travel to the port of entry of the country.

The immigration officer at the port of entry then has his/her discretion to allow you entry into the country or not. For instance, if they found that you lied in your visa application, or that you do not have sufficient funds with you, they may refuse you entry, despite the fact that your visa was approved at the overseas consulate.


If your visa was refused, and you state that you were denied entry, this would mean that you traveled to the port of entry of the country despite not possessing a visa (and the airline somehow allowed you to board), and the immigration officer denied you entry as a result.

Isnt denied entry the same as rejected visa?for exp, if UK rejected my application for visit visa, I automatically understand that they deny me entry into the country as well..

 

[warquezho]

2)In the Express entry Profile,there is one question in spouse section.

"Do you ever applied for permanent resident?"

I have select No.

What to do in this while submitting the PR file?

Hi,

1. Is this question under Spouse or Primary Applicant?
2. Also, this is when you received ITA and filling up the forms right?

Because I cannot see this section under spouse, this is only available to us under Primary Applicant. Can you verify? Or does the form differs in each applicants profile?