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What is the entry point from usa to Vancouver.

canuck78

VIP Member
Jun 18, 2017
52,969
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Thank you so much for your reply.I was under the impression that if a person is reported at the border then he can renew his pr card for one year..I don't know where I read it.But now I understand that it can't be renewed.Kindly share the process after being reported at the border.How does a person survive without pr card,sin card and health card till the time appeal is heard.Thanks n regards.
The one year is PR card is usually given to enter Canada to attend the appeal interview. I have usually seen a PRTD given for a person to travel back to Canada to attend their interview if they qualify. I would not count on receiving a one year PR card if you are already in Canada after getting reported since you won’t need the PR card to travel back to Canada.

Canada isn’t trying to make it easy for those who haven’t met their RO. Many apply for PRTD based on H&C from their home country so they have some certainty in their lives and if approved they can apply for a new PR card, sponsor a spouse or child, apply for healthcare after receiving their PR card. If you don’t have a SIN# it becomes incredibly hard to survive in Canada since you can’t work legally for 2.5+ years.
 
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rose_20

Full Member
Jun 8, 2012
34
2
The one year is PR card is usually given to enter Canada to attend the appeal interview. I have usually seen a PRTD given for a person to travel back to Canada to attend their interview if they qualify. I would not count on receiving a one year PR card if you are already in Canada after getting reported since you won’t need the PR card to travel back to Canada.

Canada isn’t trying to make it easy for those who haven’t met their RO. Many apply for PRTD based on H&C from their home country so they have some certainty in their lives and if approved they can apply for a new PR card, sponsor a spouse or child, apply for healthcare after receiving their PR card. If you don’t have a SIN# it becomes incredibly hard to survive in Canada since you can’t work legally for 2.5+ years.
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Hi, thank you so much for your reply.I was under the impression that if a person is reported at the border,then while he has applied for an appeal ,he can after entering canada apply for renewal of the pr card and on the basis of the same he can renew other cards too while the appeal is pending.kindly correct me where I am wrong.Once again thank you so much for shedding light on this topic.Regards.
 

canuck78

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Jun 18, 2017
52,969
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Never heard of someone applying for a PR card renewal while waiting for an appeal and being granted a 1 year PR card while already in Canada. If you have been in Canada in the past year and want to attend your hearing in person you can be granted a PRTD of 1 year PR card to reenter the country. If you are already in the country I don’t see why you would be granted a 1 year PR card.
 

rose_20

Full Member
Jun 8, 2012
34
2
Never heard of someone applying for a PR card renewal while waiting for an appeal and being granted a 1 year PR card while already in Canada. If you have been in Canada in the past year and want to attend your hearing in person you can be granted a PRTD of 1 year PR card to reenter the country. If you are already in the country I don’t see why you would be granted a 1 year PR card.
Thank you so much for your reply.can you please elaborate on what happens when a person who has not met his RO enters from land border after being reported and after he files for appeal.How does he survive in Canada with expired pr ,sin and health cards during the pendancy of his appeal.Can he apply for temporary renewal of his pr card and other cards too.I understand that his stay during pendency of appeal does not count towards his RO.
Lastly just want to know your opinion is it a right thing trying to come to canada this way ? I don't have any other option since due to age factor I don't stand a chance to get selected for pr.Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on this.Regards.
 

canuck78

VIP Member
Jun 18, 2017
52,969
12,768
Thank you so much for your reply.can you please elaborate on what happens when a person who has not met his RO enters from land border after being reported and after he files for appeal.How does he survive in Canada with expired pr ,sin and health cards during the pendancy of his appeal.Can he apply for temporary renewal of his pr card and other cards too.I understand that his stay during pendency of appeal does not count towards his RO.
Lastly just want to know your opinion is it a right thing trying to come to canada this way ? I don't have any other option since due to age factor I don't stand a chance to get selected for pr.Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on this.Regards.
If they have a SIN# they can work. It may be dormant but you can reactivate it easily. The system isn’t set up to allow people to renew things like a health card without meeting their RO or else people could reenter to use healthcare after being outside Canada for a significant amount of time. Others take out private insurance for emergency healthcare and pay for routine care out of pocket for 2-3 years until they get their PR card if they are not reported. Whether it makes sense to try to enter Canada via the US border depends on many things. If you have a decent job in your home country, good family life, home, etc. does it make sense to risk leaving everything for uncertainty in Canada? Have you had children or gotten married since leaving Canada? If so, you can’t sponsor until you are compliant with your RO so that could mean a long separation. Do you have any health issues where you need to access the healthcare system on a regular basis. That will be very difficult and expensive without provincial healthcare coverage. You may not be able to access the care you need since priority goes to those without provincial health coverage. If you don’t get reported you won’t be able to leave Canada for 2.5-3 years. Will you be ok with being separated from your extended family for that long? If you go through an appeal I would also not suggest leaving Canada but you will likely have an answer in a shorter amount of time (around 1-2 years). If you do get reported you should hire a lawyer. If you have children their lack of a valid PR card may create issues registering for public school. Some school boards are strict about showing valid PR cards. Your other option is to apply for a PRTD based on H&C. You would need to prove that you have an H&C reason that prevented you from being able to return throughout the whole period and you must submit a lot of evidence. That option would allow you to know whether you will be able to return to Canada and remain while in your home country. If approved you can apply for a new PR card on arrival.

This all comes down to personal choice dependent on your own situation.
 
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dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
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I was under the impression that if a person is reported at the border, then while he has applied for an appeal ,he can after entering canada apply for renewal of the pr card and on the basis of the same he can renew other cards too while the appeal is pending. kindly correct me where I am wrong.
You have it right. PRs who have an appeal pending, and who are IN Canada, can apply for and will ordinarily be issued a "status card," that is a PR card, valid for one (1) year.

This applies to those who were issued a 44(1) Report (typically but not always issued by border officials at a Port-of-Entry). This is governed by Section 54(2)(b) in the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) which are here: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/page-9.html#h-686316 and also by 54(2)(c) IRPR . . . the latter covers the more common scenario where not only has a 44(1) Report been issued but a Removal Order as well (again, this is the more typical "getting reported" scenario at a PoE).

Similarly, a PR who has been denied a PR Travel Document AND who is IN Canada, who is appealing the PR TD decision, can likewise apply for and will ordinarily be issued a PR card valid for one (1) year. This is provided for in 54(2)(a) IRPR.

Getting to Canada can be an issue for the PR abroad denied a PR TD unless, as @canuck78 noted, the PR has been in Canada within the previous year. In the event the PR has been in Canada within the previous year, the PR can apply for and will ordinarily be issued a special PR TD allowing the PR to travel to Canada pending the appeal. As often discussed in the forum, PRs who can travel via the U.S. have the alternative of traveling to Canada via the U.S. These individuals, whether in Canada via a special PR TD, or having traveled via the US., and then while IN Canada they can then apply for and will ordinarily be issued the one year PR card.

What is not clear is the timeline for these applications. Clearly qualified PRs with no RO compliance or other status related issues, whose PR card applications are otherwise processed routinely, are currently seeing a timeline of four to five months between the date the application was sent and when the PR card is received. There are very few anecdotal reports here by PRs who have applied for the one year PR card, so we have virtually no information about how long the process takes, but it is perhaps easy to predict it is not an expedited process.

It also warrants noting that the one year cards are specifically coded to show the PR is "under enforcement" and are designed, for example, to automatically trigger the PR's referral to an Immigration Secondary examination at a PoE.

While we might quibble about the fine print, I largely concur in the observations @canuck78 makes outlining the situation for many PRs who are in breach of the RO. The observations about getting by without a PR card apply, of course, to the PR who manages to get waived through at the border, who wants to avoid transactions with CBSA or IRCC in order to avoid taking another chance of triggering a formal RO compliance examination, at least UNTIL the PR is back in RO compliance.

As for the observations by @canuck78 regarding the possibility of obtaining a one year card, while my observations regarding this are somewhat contrary, it is true that we see very few reports about PRs actually doing this. Indeed, I think it may have been two years or more since I last saw someone report doing this in this forum, and again that would be one among a very small number.

Never heard of someone applying for a PR card renewal while waiting for an appeal and being granted a 1 year PR card while already in Canada. If you have been in Canada in the past year and want to attend your hearing in person you can be granted a PRTD of 1 year PR card to reenter the country. If you are already in the country I don’t see why you would be granted a 1 year PR card.
As noted above, the rules do provide for issuing one-year PR cards pending an appeal of either a denied PR TD or an appeal following a 44(1) Report and Departure Order issued at a PoE. But as far as I have seen in this forum, reports from PRs doing this are at the least very uncommon, so it is no surprise that even someone who follows these discussions has not seen anyone doing this.

Not sure why we do not see more reports of this, if not about it but at least in a passing reference to it. My guess, just a guess, is that this derives from the paucity of reports by PRs engaged in the appeal process. We see some but not many. Rather few actually. I suspect there is an inherent reluctance to share much when someone gets to that stage.

Added in Edit: In regards to . . . "If you are already in the country I don’t see why you would be granted a 1 year PR card." And noting some irony.

The obvious reason is that the law (Section 31(1) IRPA; see here: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/I-2.5/page-8.html#h-274660) and regulations (Sections 53 to 60), prescribe the issuance of a status card, which pursuant to Section 53(1) IRPR (same link to regulations as above) means a "permanent resident card," to persons with PR status. That is, by law IRCC has to.

The caveat is the timeline. Like applications for PR cards generally, and applications for citizenship, there is no fixed or definite timeline for making decisions on these applications.

The irony is that the PR who I often describe as cutting-it-close, or who is otherwise in compliance but there is some concern or issue resulting in the PR card application being referred to non-routine processing, which can take up to another YEAR, will likely run into more problems and a longer timeline than the PR who has already been formally determined to be inadmissible, in breach of the RO, and issued a decision terminating PR status. The latter will likely be issued a one year card more or less routinely . . . while the first, those who application has been referred for Secondary Review in particular, face the prospect of not getting a PR card for significantly longer.
 
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YVR123

VIP Member
Jul 27, 2017
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Thank you so much for your reply.can you please elaborate on what happens when a person who has not met his RO enters from land border after being reported and after he files for appeal.How does he survive in Canada with expired pr ,sin and health cards during the pendancy of his appeal.Can he apply for temporary renewal of his pr card and other cards too.I understand that his stay during pendency of appeal does not count towards his RO.
Lastly just want to know your opinion is it a right thing trying to come to canada this way ? I don't have any other option since due to age factor I don't stand a chance to get selected for pr.Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on this.Regards.
Did he ever have a permanent SIN card/number? He can re-activate the SIN card if it's not active. If he never applied for a SIN after landing, then no, he won't be able to apply for a SIN card/number with expired PR card and old COPR.
 

rose_20

Full Member
Jun 8, 2012
34
2
Did he ever have a permanent SIN card/number? He can re-activate the SIN card if it's not active. If he never applied for a SIN after landing, then no, he won't be able to apply for a SIN card/number with expired PR card and old COPR.
Thank you so much for your help.I can tell you from your personal experience when I entered from land border after expiry of my pr card.The officers asked abt the reason for my staying outside canada.He was kind enough to allow me entry with out being reported.But it's really really tough to survive there.Sin card can not be reactivated with out a valid pr card ,so it was refused at services canada.The kids do not get admission without valid pr card or without new copr .The old copr 's are not recognised by these people.Hence health card can't be renewed too.So with kids and old parents how can anyone survive in Canada.
If anyone is having a similar situation,pls pay attention to my personal experience.Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts.
 

rose_20

Full Member
Jun 8, 2012
34
2
If they have a SIN# they can work. It may be dormant but you can reactivate it easily. The system isn’t set up to allow people to renew things like a health card without meeting their RO or else people could reenter to use healthcare after being outside Canada for a significant amount of time. Others take out private insurance for emergency healthcare and pay for routine care out of pocket for 2-3 years until they get their PR card if they are not reported. Whether it makes sense to try to enter Canada via the US border depends on many things. If you have a decent job in your home country, good family life, home, etc. does it make sense to risk leaving everything for uncertainty in Canada? Have you had children or gotten married since leaving Canada? If so, you can’t sponsor until you are compliant with your RO so that could mean a long separation. Do you have any health issues where you need to access the healthcare system on a regular basis. That will be very difficult and expensive without provincial healthcare coverage. You may not be able to access the care you need since priority goes to those without provincial health coverage. If you don’t get reported you won’t be able to leave Canada for 2.5-3 years. Will you be ok with being separated from your extended family for that long? If you go through an appeal I would also not suggest leaving Canada but you will likely have an answer in a shorter amount of time (around 1-2 years). If you do get reported you should hire a lawyer. If you have children their lack of a valid PR card may create issues registering for public school. Some school boards are strict about showing valid PR cards. Your other option is to apply for a PRTD based on H&C. You would need to prove that you have an H&C reason that prevented you from being able to return throughout the whole period and you must submit a lot of evidence. That option would allow you to know whether you will be able to return to Canada and remain while in your home country. If approved you can apply for a new PR card on arrival.

This all comes down to personal choice dependent on your own situation.
Thank you so much for your reply.I truly appreciate that explained everything very elaborately.I totally agree with your point of view.I have experienced once what happens when pr card is expired.Canada no doubt is great country but surely is not giving second chance to PPL like us.Thank you again for sharing your thoughts on this .Much regards.
 

rose_20

Full Member
Jun 8, 2012
34
2
You have it right. PRs who have an appeal pending, and who are IN Canada, can apply for and will ordinarily be issued a "status card," that is a PR card, valid for one (1) year.

This applies to those who were issued a 44(1) Report (typically but not always issued by border officials at a Port-of-Entry). This is governed by Section 54(2)(b) in the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations (IRPR) which are here: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2002-227/page-9.html#h-686316 and also by 54(2)(c) IRPR . . . the latter covers the more common scenario where not only has a 44(1) Report been issued but a Removal Order as well (again, this is the more typical "getting reported" scenario at a PoE).

Similarly, a PR who has been denied a PR Travel Document AND who is IN Canada, who is appealing the PR TD decision, can likewise apply for and will ordinarily be issued a PR card valid for one (1) year. This is provided for in 54(2)(a) IRPR.

Getting to Canada can be an issue for the PR abroad denied a PR TD unless, as @canuck78 noted, the PR has been in Canada within the previous year. In the event the PR has been in Canada within the previous year, the PR can apply for and will ordinarily be issued a special PR TD allowing the PR to travel to Canada pending the appeal. As often discussed in the forum, PRs who can travel via the U.S. have the alternative of traveling to Canada via the U.S. These individuals, whether in Canada via a special PR TD, or having traveled via the US., and then while IN Canada they can then apply for and will ordinarily be issued the one year PR card.

What is not clear is the timeline for these applications. Clearly qualified PRs with no RO compliance or other status related issues, whose PR card applications are otherwise processed routinely, are currently seeing a timeline of four to five months between the date the application was sent and when the PR card is received. There are very few anecdotal reports here by PRs who have applied for the one year PR card, so we have virtually no information about how long the process takes, but it is perhaps easy to predict it is not an expedited process.

It also warrants noting that the one year cards are specifically coded to show the PR is "under enforcement" and are designed, for example, to automatically trigger the PR's referral to an Immigration Secondary examination at a PoE.

While we might quibble about the fine print, I largely concur in the observations @canuck78 makes outlining the situation for many PRs who are in breach of the RO. The observations about getting by without a PR card apply, of course, to the PR who manages to get waived through at the border, who wants to avoid transactions with CBSA or IRCC in order to avoid taking another chance of triggering a formal RO compliance examination, at least UNTIL the PR is back in RO compliance.

As for the observations by @canuck78 regarding the possibility of obtaining a one year card, while my observations regarding this are somewhat contrary, it is true that we see very few reports about PRs actually doing this. Indeed, I think it may have been two years or more since I last saw someone report doing this in this forum, and again that would be one among a very small number.



As noted above, the rules do provide for issuing one-year PR cards pending an appeal of either a denied PR TD or an appeal following a 44(1) Report and Departure Order issued at a PoE. But as far as I have seen in this forum, reports from PRs doing this are at the least very uncommon, so it is no surprise that even someone who follows these discussions has not seen anyone doing this.

Not sure why we do not see more reports of this, if not about it but at least in a passing reference to it. My guess, just a guess, is that this derives from the paucity of reports by PRs engaged in the appeal process. We see some but not many. Rather few actually. I suspect there is an inherent reluctance to share much when someone gets to that stage.

Added in Edit: In regards to . . . "If you are already in the country I don’t see why you would be granted a 1 year PR card." And noting some irony.

The obvious reason is that the law (Section 31(1) IRPA; see here: https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/I-2.5/page-8.html#h-274660) and regulations (Sections 53 to 60), prescribe the issuance of a status card, which pursuant to Section 53(1) IRPR (same link to regulations as above) means a "permanent resident card," to persons with PR status. That is, by law IRCC has to.

The caveat is the timeline. Like applications for PR cards generally, and applications for citizenship, there is no fixed or definite timeline for making decisions on these applications.

The irony is that the PR who I often describe as cutting-it-close, or who is otherwise in compliance but there is some concern or issue resulting in the PR card application being referred to non-routine processing, which can take up to another YEAR, will likely run into more problems and a longer timeline than the PR who has already been formally determined to be inadmissible, in breach of the RO, and issued a decision terminating PR status. The latter will likely be issued a one year card more or less routinely . . . while the first, those who application has been referred for Secondary Review in particular, face the prospect of not getting a PR card for significantly longer.
Thanks a lot for explaining everything thing in details.I genuinely appreciate this.From your post things are very clear and I truly think that it's very tough to survive here. And I also feel tht the chance of winning the appeal are very slim.Once again thank you so much for shedding light on this topic.Much regards.