"Staying" with my fiance in Canada on visitor status: ADVICE needed!!

[kcorbin]

Hello everyone!! I have been an avid reader of this forum ever since my fiance migrated to Canada from the Philippines and have been exploring all possible options for me to legally live in Canada with him.

I would like to know if I would encounter problems if I "move" in with my fiance in Canada even before we get married. I am a US citizen, as well. We are planning to apply for spousal sponsorship as soon as we get married. I understand that I am not legally allowed to live in Canada until I get my PR status. But I have read that others have stayed with their partners with their visitor status until they get approved for PR then applying for extension when needed. How do I get a visitor's record? Are there certain things that I should avoid doing if I "move" in with my fiance to make everything as legal as possible?

I am also considering finding work as a foreign worker when I "move" to Canada while waiting for my PR status. But I know it'll be challenging for me to find work because of the need for a positive LMO and Canadian employers only hire foreign workers as their very very last resort.

Do you guys see any issues with my plans here? =\ This time apart has been really frustrating for me. We really just want to get together the soonest possible and ideally, it would be so much better if I could also get work in Canada while waiting for my PR status. My fiance has just migrated and he's also starting off so his current income isn't enough to support the both of us. My other issue is that he is living in metro vancouver, and I really doubt if I could find an employer willing to hire a foreign worker. =|

*siiiiiggghhhh* this ordeal is driving me nuts!!! I would really appreciate all help... Thank you thank you!!!

 

[scylla]

Well I suppose the first thing is that you're not actually allowed to move to Canada - you're only allowed to visit. Even if you were married, you would only be allowed to visit. You can't actually move to Canada until you have PR.

If you want to come for a longer visit to Canada then you will want to make sure you look like you are just visiting - not moving here. This means that you shouldn't pack like a visitor (don't bring everything you own or possessions that a person would normally bring if they are moving rather than visiting - such as furniture). If you are flying, make sure you have a return ticket. Ideally you should also bring proof that demonstrates you have strong ties to the US (in the event you are questioned about your intentions). Example of proof are: proof of employment, proof of property ownership, proof of property rental, proof of business ownership, proof of school enrollment, proof of bank accounts / other assets, etc. You also want to make sure you can demonstrate that you have sufficient funds to pay for your visit.

Hope this helps.

 

[kcorbin]

Well I suppose the first thing is that you're not actually allowed to move to Canada - you're only allowed to visit. Even if you were married, you would only be allowed to visit. You can't actually move to Canada until you have PR.

If you want to come for a longer visit to Canada then you will want to make sure you look like you are just visiting - not moving here. This means that you shouldn't pack like a visitor (don't bring everything you own or possessions that a person would normally bring if they are moving rather than visiting - such as furniture). If you are flying, make sure you have a return ticket. Ideally you should also bring proof that demonstrates you have strong ties to the US (in the event you are questioned about your intentions). Example of proof are: proof of employment, proof of property ownership, proof of property rental, proof of business ownership, proof of school enrollment, proof of bank accounts / other assets, etc. You also want to make sure you can demonstrate that you have sufficient funds to pay for your visit.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for this syclla!! It makes sense that I should simply look like I'm visiting him. I definitely wont be bringing any furniture with me, just clothes actually.

I've visited him twice since he migrated to Canada and honestly, I cant remember what questions I've been asked by the officer.. And I havent really brought any proof that I have ties with the US. I guess, I never thought about this until we decided to be together and all the possible concerns are just popping up... =|

Would you know how I can get a visitor record? Do I get this at the port of entry?

 

[QuebecOkie]

I didn't get a visitor record at all. When I entered Canada (by car, with my husband), I just got a stamp in my passport. That gave me six months in Canada. A little over a month before that six months was to expire, we requested an extension to my visitor status online, stating I wished to continue to stay with my husband while my inland PR application was in progress. We requested and received a one-year extension.

At the border, we had a sort of "cover story." I told the immigration officer that I was driving up with my husband to help him get settled in a new home in Québec (true), that after three weeks, he would have to leave that home for a 4.5-month course in Ontario (true), and that I would then fly back to my home state to stay with my sister while my husband and I filed an outland PR application for me (false, we filed inland, and I stayed in Québec).

Working will be the biggest problem.

 

[kcorbin]

I didn't get a visitor record at all. When I entered Canada (by car, with my husband), I just got a stamp in my passport. That gave me six months in Canada. A little over a month before that six months was to expire, we requested an extension to my visitor status online, stating I wished to continue to stay with my husband while my inland PR application was in progress. We requested and received a one-year extension.

At the border, we had a sort of "cover story." I told the immigration officer that I was driving up with my husband to help him get settled in a new home in Québec (true), that after three weeks, he would have to leave that home for a 4.5-month course in Ontario (true), and that I would then fly back to my home state to stay with my sister while my husband and I filed an outland PR application for me (false, we filed inland, and I stayed in Québec).

Working will be the biggest problem.

So I could simply extend my visitor stay 1 month before my 6 months is up? I guess that could make things easier at the border...

Did you show a return ticket to the immigration officer? Looks like I have to come up with my own cover story. =/

Were you able to find work while waiting for your PR status?

 

[QuebecOkie]

I think it would be a good idea to get a PR app filed before you request the visitor extension (and CIC says to file it at least 30 days before your status is to expire). I don't know the rate of approval/denial for extension requests, but as you're not visa-exempt, having an active app on file probably lends some weight to your request.

I didn't show a return ticket. We entered by car, and we said we would purchase a ticket for me to fly back to stay with my sis after we learned the exact dates of my husband's course (we really didn't know when he would have to leave, just kind of had a two to three-week window when we knew the course would be starting).

No, I didn't even look for work for the duration of my inland PR process. One, it's very difficult to find an employer willing to do an LMO to hire a foreign worker. Two, we're in a very French area, so even now, I haven't started to look for work. Three, we didn't apply for an OWP (open work permit) to be issued after stage one approval, as again, I didn't speak any French when we arrived, so we knew I would have a hard time finding work. Even if we had applied for an OWP, we received AIP and DM (stage one and two approval) at the same time, so the OWP would not have helped much.

If you apply inland, you are looking at 6-8 months at a minimum before it's possible to get an OWP, and quite possibly even longer (6 months is very, very optomistic), as many have waited 10 or 11 months for stage one approval. You *could* work before that if you can find a company willing to do an LMO, but you can't count on that.

I don't want to rain on your parade, but you may want to do some reading on citizens from the Philippines and Canada visitor visas. I have no idea of the rate of approval/denial. There's no guarantee you can get to Canada in the first place. Having a fiancé here actually weakens your case, as it makes it more likely you would overstay your visa. If you have visited before and never overstayed, that helps. If you can demonstrate that you still have strong ties to the Philippines, such as property you own, a job to return to, family ties, that helps too. Again, not trying to be negative, just want to make sure you're realistic about what you're up against, and all of the possible outcomes/challenges.

 

[kcorbin]

Im sorry if I wasnt clear about my status. It is a bit confusing... XD I am a US citizen since I was born in the US. My family moved back to the Philippines when I was younger and I was given recognition of being Filipino. I dont actually have a Philippine passport. Lol! But I guess in all countries, except the Philippines, I am a US citizen..

But yes, I do understand what you're saying... It really seems there is a 99.9% certainty of me not finding an employer who is willing to do an LMO for me. *sigh* and my fiance is in Vancouver, as if that could strenghten my chances...

It seems like Im looking at 2 scenarios if I want to be with my fiance during the process even if I cant find work..
1) If I apply inland it could take 6-8 months to as long as 10-11 months before I could get an OWP and I am not allowed to travel outside of Canada until I get my PR, which could last as long as 2 years (right?). Or...
2) I could apply outland, stay as a visitor and extend my visitor status as needed until I get my PR...

Ohh the choices!!!

 

[QuebecOkie]

Ah, I didn't understand that you were an American citizen. Getting in isn't nearly as big deal, then. You're pretty much right on your two options. I'd say two years is on the long end, though it's definitely not impossible (some on this forum have been waiting that long and longer), and you can't predict what CIC will do. From what I've seen in this forum, 1-1.5 years is pretty average for an inland app with no major complications.

I went inland, but if I had to do it over again (in whatever sort of he11ish universe would allow that!), I'd definitely choose outland. It tends to be much faster, so odds are that you'll be done with your PR in about the time it takes you to get stage one approval/OWP with an inland app. Also, you can then land at your convenience, instead of waiting for a landing appointment, which can add a few more months to the inland process. I think Vancouver landings are pretty slow, at around 2 months between DM and landing. Also, with outland, while there is always a risk that you can be denied entry at the Canadian border, you aren't as "trapped" in Canada as with inland. If you do leave and get denied reentry, it doesn't invalidate your entire application.

 

[Soleil2020]

Hello everyone!! I have been an avid reader of this forum ever since my fiance migrated to Canada from the Philippines and have been exploring all possible options for me to legally live in Canada with him.

I would like to know if I would encounter problems if I "move" in with my fiance in Canada even before we get married. I am a US citizen, as well. We are planning to apply for spousal sponsorship as soon as we get married. I understand that I am not legally allowed to live in Canada until I get my PR status. But I have read that others have stayed with their partners with their visitor status until they get approved for PR then applying for extension when needed. How do I get a visitor's record? Are there certain things that I should avoid doing if I "move" in with my fiance to make everything as legal as possible?

I am also considering finding work as a foreign worker when I "move" to Canada while waiting for my PR status. But I know it'll be challenging for me to find work because of the need for a positive LMO and Canadian employers only hire foreign workers as their very very last resort.

Do you guys see any issues with my plans here? =\ This time apart has been really frustrating for me. We really just want to get together the soonest possible and ideally, it would be so much better if I could also get work in Canada while waiting for my PR status. My fiance has just migrated and he's also starting off so his current income isn't enough to support the both of us. My other issue is that he is living in metro vancouver, and I really doubt if I could find an employer willing to hire a foreign worker. =|

*siiiiiggghhhh* this ordeal is driving me nuts!!! I would really appreciate all help... Thank you thank you!!!

ahhhh...! Whatever you do, DO NOT use the words "moving in" when referring to your visits with your husband. You HAVE to let them know at the border that you know that you are a visitor...and that you can't work or go to school while you are here.

I just went through this process so I learned quite a bit during that time. I made a fairly long checklist for someone who had similar questions about crossing the border to visit a spouse who was their sponsor.
I was trying to figure out how to link it to you, but I guess I'm not savvy enough to figure it out. :-O

Let me know if you would like me to, and I'll copy and paste the checklist message to you.

Best,

Soleil2020

 

[kcorbin]

@QuebecOkie

You presented a new scary situation there for me. =)) I kinda had the idea that there's a possibility of being denied entry at the border (for some reason) but I didnt really think about its consequences for the application. Lol!! I guess thats a big plus for outland then! But JUST in case that happens, what's going to happen...to me? LOL!

You see, my fiance's family has the habit of crossing the border by car to buy groceries at Bellingham since its apparently cheaper there. If I go with them during my visit then come back after a few hours, could I be denied entry? Would you recommend me going with them?

They should create an official list of reasons for denying entry to someone, for our sake. But of course, that wouldnt happen in a million years for security reasons. Or do they...???

@Soleil2020

Oh my gosh, you are heaven sent!! You have finally found the reason for creating that checklist!! =)) I would love to read that.. Copy and paste away! =)) uber duper appreciate it!

And definitely never in a million years will i say anything about "moving in" to any immigration officer. So even though in my head, its like im moving in with him, i just have to make the officer believe that my visit is just temporary... If i tell them we'll be getting married, wont that be a sign for them that I might not leave my would-be hubby anymore? =S

 

[Soleil2020]

@ QuebecOkie

You presented a new scary situation there for me. =)) I kinda had the idea that there's a possibility of being denied entry at the border (for some reason) but I didnt really think about its consequences for the application. Lol!! I guess thats a big plus for outland then! But JUST in case that happens, what's going to happen...to me? LOL!

You see, my fiance's family has the habit of crossing the border by car to buy groceries at Bellingham since its apparently cheaper there. If I go with them during my visit then come back after a few hours, could I be denied entry? Would you recommend me going with them?

They should create an official list of reasons for denying entry to someone, for our sake. But of course, that wouldnt happen in a million years for security reasons. Or do they...???

@ Soleil2020

Oh my gosh, you are heaven sent!! You have finally found the reason for creating that checklist!! =)) I would love to read that.. Copy and paste away! =)) uber duper appreciate it!

And definitely never in a million years will i say anything about "moving in" to any immigration officer. So even though in my head, its like im moving in with him, i just have to make the officer believe that my visit is just temporary... If i tell them we'll be getting married, wont that be a sign for them that I might not leave my would-be hubby anymore? =S

Ok..here is the list. It is rather long..so be prepared for some reading. It was in response to a person who was sponsoring her spouse and had questions about crossing the border. Their situation was a little different than yours in that they were married. When do you and your fiance plan to be married? ( congrats, by the way) I advised them to tell the guards they are in the middle of their immigration process. You guys, of course, can't tell the guard that until you actually are.
1. Rule 1 - Always tell the guard the truth. Don't offer up your life story, but do answer truthfully what they ask you.
2. He needs to explain to the guard that he is married to a Canadian and directly in the middle of the immigration process and would like to visit as much as possible while it`s going on. He can ask to stay for 6 months.

3. He understands he is just a visitor and cannot work. ( or attend school )

4. Your husband should make sure he has with him at all times when crossing the border :
a.) Your letter stating that you have been approved as a sponsor. (VERY important.)
b.) Any other documentation about your application..particularly receipts for fees paid in the process.
c.) EXTREMELY IMPORTANT : Your marriage certificate. Not the license, but the actual certificate.
d.) If your husband still has a means of income in the States, he should bring proof of that. ( Maybe a bank statement wouldn`t hurt. ) --I know..you are approved as his sponsor so this seems like it should be a moot point. But they have asked me that before. Being as I actually had to quit my job so that we can sort of live like a married couple, I was just honest with them and it didn`t have any bearing on whether or not I was allowed to visit.
e.) Any other thing that shows that he still has ties to the States. ( registration for class or workshop or something that is to take place at a future date.)
f. ) Often they have asked if I have travel health insurance. ...So..that`s good to have and of course, carry the proof of insurance doc.

5. Your husband should always make sure he`s traveling fairly lightly. A couple of suit cases is normal. Do not pack any boxes of stuff in the car. They do NOT like that.

Lastly, tell him not to freak out if they make him come inside for secondary questioning. ( they may or they may not- kind of depends on the guard he gets, I guess. I don`t really know how they decide on this.

If they ask him to come in for secondary questioning, he will just have a conversation about his documents ( the aforementioned docs) that he will present to them. They may give him a paper stating the date by which he has to leave. If they do, he has to make sure he abides by that date, even if he just goes back to the States for a few days and comes back to Canada. ( I don`t know how far from the border he lives in the States, so I don`t know if this is practical for you. )


Also, if they give him that paper, he needs return the paper to the Canadian border station upon exiting Canada. He needs to stop by the CANADIAN border and give it to them at the desk when he is exiting Canada. If he just gives it to the American side to give to the Canadian side, it might confuse matters. ( I learned this the hard way.)

Also concerning that paper they may or may not give him, if they give him the paper that says he can stay for 6 months and he comes to Canada and goes back to the States before 6 months are over and returns to Canada within the same 6 months time period, he does not need to return it to the border upon exiting, but he can show it at the entrance next time to ask to stay the remainder of the time left on it. NOTE: if he doesn`t know if he will come back within the same 6 months time, it is best that he hand the document over at his exit..even if there are 3 months left on it.

Hmmmm... I guess that`s all the advice I have right now.
I hope my words were helpful. Let me know if you don`t understand something I said or have any questions regarding it.

Good luck in your process. "

 

[QuebecOkie]

@ QuebecOkie

You presented a new scary situation there for me. =)) I kinda had the idea that there's a possibility of being denied entry at the border (for some reason) but I didnt really think about its consequences for the application. Lol!! I guess thats a big plus for outland then! But JUST in case that happens, what's going to happen...to me? LOL!

You see, my fiance's family has the habit of crossing the border by car to buy groceries at Bellingham since its apparently cheaper there. If I go with them during my visit then come back after a few hours, could I be denied entry? Would you recommend me going with them?

They should create an official list of reasons for denying entry to someone, for our sake. But of course, that wouldnt happen in a million years for security reasons. Or do they...???

I really don't know what happens if you get denied at the border. If you have an inland app in progress, it gets tossed at that point. I don't know how likely it is that you could be denied, either. Many have no problems, but denials do happen.

I know all too well the frustration and uncertainty. My husband was on course in Cornwall, ON, near the U.S. border. During one of my visits, a bunch of his coursemates wanted to go to a place just across the border for cheap wings and beer. And it was ME, the only American, that prevented us from making a quick trip to the States. :-[

If I were you, inland or outland, I wouldn't risk a quick border crossing for groceries. It all depends on the attitude of the individual border agent on that day. It's a giant pain, but that's part of the price of immigration.

 

[kcorbin]

@Soleil2020

Thank you thank you!! Originally, we wanted to get married in October because its going to be our 6th anniversary! <3 <3 <3 But then again, practicality is calling us to get married as early as May to get on the sponsorship right away so I can get a foothold in Canada as early as possible as PR. And we're planning to get married in Canada and my immediate family will fly from the Philippines. But nothing's final yet.. XD

Definitely a long list! Finally got myself to absorb everything. =))

For my 2 visits last year, I never thought about bringing with me any evidence that I'm still tied to the US. At least, I wasn't brought in for a 2nd questioning.. That would have scared me!

So if I'll be telling them the truth and they will ask me of my purpose of visiting Canada.. I can tell them I am visiting my fiance to get married. If they ask me how long I am visiting him, I will tell them that we wanted to stay together for the duration of the sponsorship application. Is this okay?

Last time, I managed to bring with me 1 big luggage and 1 carry-on luggage and I'm not sure if I should bring another big luggage if I'll be visiting him for a long time. XD

@QuebecOkie

Gosh, that's so terrible. =( I can imagine how heavy that feels... I don't like being the reason why a plan should not push through.. =/ But at least now, you can easily cross the border? =) You can get all the cheap wings and beer you want!

I forgot how moody border agents can get.. Thanks for reminding me not to push my luck against their mood swings. I guess I wont be responsible anymore for cross-border grocery shopping!! I'd rather stay at home than get denied entry coz my relatives live in NY and California, both areas are faaar away from Vancouver.

 

[Soleil2020]

@ Soleil2020

Thank you thank you!! Originally, we wanted to get married in October because its going to be our 6th anniversary! <3 <3 <3 But then again, practicality is calling us to get married as early as May to get on the sponsorship right away so I can get a foothold in Canada as early as possible as PR. And we're planning to get married in Canada and my immediate family will fly from the Philippines. But nothing's final yet.. XD

Definitely a long list! Finally got myself to absorb everything. =))

For my 2 visits last year, I never thought about bringing with me any evidence that I'm still tied to the US. At least, I wasn't brought in for a 2nd questioning.. That would have scared me!

So if I'll be telling them the truth and they will ask me of my purpose of visiting Canada.. I can tell them I am visiting my fiance to get married. If they ask me how long I am visiting him, I will tell them that we wanted to stay together for the duration of the sponsorship application. Is this okay?

Last time, I managed to bring with me 1 big luggage and 1 carry-on luggage and I'm not sure if I should bring another big luggage if I'll be visiting him for a long time. XD

Well, let's think this through...Do you know if you plan to apply inland or outland? Inland is where you state that you will stay in the Canada for the duration of the application. ( I think, but I am not very informed about the Inland application- You will want to do a little more research about that before you decide.) Outland is where you are still situated outside of Canada- but you visit your spouse or fiance. Outland is said to be faster. I don't know for sure. Outland, you are also more free to move back and forth in between countries Canada and USA , for example. Outland does not mean you can't visit for long periods of time. As an American citizen, you are generally allowed to remain in Canada for 6 months at a time.

I would suggest that you use words something like, " We are getting married at such and such date, time, place. ( have evidence of set dates etc if you do) After we are married, we are going to start the sponsorship application family class right away. During the application process, I would like to visit him as much as possible. ( You could outright ask for 6 months.) Always make sure you let them know that you are aware that your status is that of a visitor and that you know you cannot work or attend school.

Now..Don't be afraid if they call you in for second questioning. Okay? It will be alright. Just remain honest and tell them your plan. They might give you a paper that tells you when you have to leave. If they do, ALWAYS ABIDE BY THIS TIME LINE. ( If they do give you a paper, let me know and I'll give you some advice about this paper etc.- that's what they did with me.)

All that is required of you is to cross the border back into the usa by the time you it says so on the paper ..if they give you this paper. I do believe there is a way you can extend a visitor visa without crossing back over the border. I think it costs $75 and needs to be applied for 30 days at least before the end of your time limit.

In the meantime, before you cross the border into Canada, purchase travel insurance. Bring your proof of insurance with you. ( if you need some ideas for travel insurance, i can tell you who i went with. They were not so expensive.)

Also, once you tell them that you are getting married or you are married, it sort of puts you in a category of people to keep an eye on, to make sure you don't over stay your time and that you do things according to the law. It's okay. Let them keep an eye on you if they feel they need to. Just go by their rules and don't take it personally. Don't let this deter you from telling them the truth though, as you will have to at one point or another. It's just best to be on the level with these guys.

This is why I advised you to make sure you have some evidence that you still have some connections in the states..some business to do. (bank accounts, registration for some class in the states taking place in the future etc.) A home address--even if it's with family for friends, have a home base in the states. This address could be and should be a place where you could receive mail or stay in the States, when you are in the States.

They will want to know that you have a home address in the States still....even if you are married to a Canadian. ( if you are doing an outland application.)

As far as the inland application goes, I am not so versed in all the details of it. I'm sure the Canadian immigration website has information about how long you can stay ( it may be for the duration of the application for all i know) and what you have to do if you need to go out of the country. That would not have worked for me because I have young adult children in the States and I needed to be able to come and go without rules telling me I can or can't leave, in case they needed me or I wanted to visit them.

One more thing I should tell you. Don't ever pack your things in boxes to bring across the border. They do not like that. Even if it's not a lot. I learned that the hard way. They see boxes, they think..."moving in". (2-3 suitcases is not unusual for a 6 month stay. ) --- I know..I had to learn to back lightly..not an easy task for me.

That pretty much sums up my advice for now. Remember, every case can be different, but chances are similar cases will have similar commonalities. I am very happy to tell you about my experience if it helps you through yours. I hope this helps.


Soleil2020

 

[kcorbin]

Errr...

I've started to answer the general application form and I have a couple of questions..

1. If I plan to stay with my would-be-hubby during my visit while waiting for my PR status, can I put his address as my current mailing address instead of my residential address?? If I do, that won't raise any red flags for them..?

2. So I've stayed in the Philippines for a veeery long time despite being a US citizen, like since I was 4 yrs old.. and I'm 24 right now. LOL And the form asked for my previous country of residence for the past 5 years... do I have to indicate the date when I entered the Philippines 20 years ago? or is it okay if I write the date 5 years from today since they were only asking for the past 5 years?

This is going to take me so LOOOOONG to fill out these forms... T_T