PR Validity - Time Spent outside Canada

[sami5385@gmail.com]

Can anyone please help with the information?

My situation:

My wife, daughter and I became canadian PR on July 2018.

We returned to india in 5 days after completing landing formalities in July 2018.

I went back alone to canada in July 2019 to search job, I got the job in canada.

Our plan was to get my family to canada early 2020 but Covid happened.

Now we are planning to get my wife and daughter to canada in March 2021.

Does my wife and daughter's PR status still Valid or will there be any issue when they would travel from India to canada?

Our PR card expiring in July 2023.

 

[armoured]

My wife, daughter and I became canadian PR on July 2018.

We returned to india in 5 days after completing landing formalities in July 2018.
...
Now we are planning to get my wife and daughter to canada in March 2021.

Does my wife and daughter's PR status still Valid or will there be any issue when they would travel from India to canada?

Still valid, and they should not have any issues returning. (The simple calc is that from March 2021 to July 2023 is more than 730 days, and they will be given 'prospective credit' as if they were to stay in Canada from the day of return to their five year anniversary of landing).

A bit more detailed explanation in the post here (including the relevant part of the law):
https://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/traveling-2-weeks-with-valid-pr-card-but-short-1-mo-on-ro-buffer-spouse-and-2-children-all-ro-compliant.714105/#post-9066240

A few notes:
-it's possible they will get asked a bit more info at border. Just tell the truth - particularly that they are arriving to reside in Canada, not for a visit.
-going forward, they will face the issue that if they leave Canada or travel much, then they may fall out of compliance. The residency obligation is very lenient in requiring only two of five years in Canada (at any five year period) - but they have used up most of the lenience (or buffer) by staying more of the last almost-three years out of Canada. If they fall out of compliance by not staying in Canada, there will be some risk at each re-entry into Canada and eventually in renewing the PR card.
-they will likely not have health insurance on arrival (although need to check details for the province).

 

[sami5385@gmail.com]

Still valid, and they should not have any issues returning. (The simple calc is that from March 2021 to July 2023 is more than 730 days, and they will be given 'prospective credit' as if they were to stay in Canada from the day of return to their five year anniversary of landing).

A bit more detailed explanation in the post here (including the relevant part of the law):
https://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/traveling-2-weeks-with-valid-pr-card-but-short-1-mo-on-ro-buffer-spouse-and-2-children-all-ro-compliant.714105/#post-9066240

A few notes:
-it's possible they will get asked a bit more info at border. Just tell the truth - particularly that they are arriving to reside in Canada, not for a visit.
-going forward, they will face the issue that if they leave Canada or travel much, then they may fall out of compliance. The residency obligation is very lenient in requiring only two of five years in Canada (at any five year period) - but they have used up most of the lenience (or buffer) by staying more of the last almost-three years out of Canada. If they fall out of compliance by not staying in Canada, there will be some risk at each re-entry into Canada and eventually in renewing the PR card.
-they will likely not have health insurance on arrival (although need to check details for the province).

Thank you @armoured , this is really very informative though I got confused by looking at one of the recent incident happened at Ahmedabad Airport India.

Incident as below ----------------------

Current Situation: My parents received were denied by Indian Immigration (Ahmedabad airport) saying their PR status is invalid because they have been out of Canada for more than 2 years (730 days). Infact my parents PR status is valid till 13 Oct 2022 and their passport is valid till 15th April 2028.
PR History:
- Received Canadian Permanent Residency Immigration visa stamp in passport - 03rd Aug 2016 which was valid till 21st June 2017.
- Arrived to Canada on 1st June 2017.
- Received PR Card with Validity - 1st June 2016 till 13 Oct 2022.
- Went back to India after staying 175 days on 23rd Nov 2017. (Reason - My sister got divorced she was in need of help on her emotional & mental aspects.)
- After my sister got stable we made plans for them to return to their home in Canada but then COVID hit in April2020. Due to their old age we were waiting for things to calm down which never happened.
- Since they were planning to come to Canada, they applied for US visitor visa on 04th March 2020. After getting the appointment, we got an email from US embassy on 14th March 2020, informing their application is delayed due to COVID.
- In order to maintain Canadian Permanent Residency, we did the calculation that they need to stay another 555 days in Canada, which means they have to be in Canada before 1st Apri 2021 and stay till 13th Oct 2022.
- Hence, we decided them to come back on 14Dec2020, where they were denied leaving for Canada at the Indian airport of Ahmedabad, as they have been outside Canada for more then 730 days.
Their PR is valid till 13Oct2022. Hence if they get the approval to come back to their home before 01st April 2022, they can still meet the requirement of 730 days to continue their PR. We are in a sad & heartbreaking situtation where my parents have no permanent place to stay in India & they have a home in Canada.
Please guide us with the options so we can bring them back to Canada as soon as possible.
Thanks in advance
----------------------------------------

This was posted by one of the guy on Facebook forum.

 

[armoured]

@sami - i'm not sure I follow all of the details on the facebook post here (it seems to me there are some errors in there but likely of no consequence).

I think unfortunately there are only two things that can be said about this case:
1) For those travelling to Canada by air, what the airlines think can be a real, practical problem for those trying to travel - especially in covid times. If all of the above is true at least on the important points, I think it is a case of manifest error - the airline was clearly mistaken in believing that the requirement is that a PR cannot be out of Canada for more than 730 days. Unfortunately this is not always easy to show.

2) What the airline should have done is both check carefully the requirements and contacted IRCC/CBSA to confirm that they are allowed to board the airline (as admissible to Canada). Also the travellers should have checked carefully with the airline beforehand - frankly it's not surprising that the check-in agents do not always know what they're talking about and they tend to be punished for mistakes rather than rewarded for correct decisions (it costs the airline real money if they let someone board who is not entitled to).

3) More knowledgeable members here may wish to comment, but: I think the airline was even more wrong than indicated here. By Canadian law, (I think) any PR with a valid PR card should be allowed to enter Canada (and also to board a plane) and will not be denied entry at the border. Upon examination (i.e. at the border) can start the formal process to show that the PR is not in compliance with the residency obligation and (after appeals, review, etc., etc) potentially revoke the PR status - but that's not the airline's concern, and while the process goes on, the individual will be allowed into Canada. Or briefly: a PR card that's still valid (by date) should be sufficient for a PR to board a flight to Canada.

But: I'm assuming the info above from the person who had the problem is all correct. Airlines screw up, it does happen. But also, internet versions of what happened are not always correct.

I think you can see hwere the recommendations for you lead here: check with the airline before.

(And as a side note, it's probably obvious, but some airlines and staff at some airports are better informed than others - I doubt this would have occurred with an Air Canada flight from Frankfurt - a big hub for Air Canada from much of Eurasia - for example).

 

[sami5385@gmail.com]

@sami - i'm not sure I follow all of the details on the facebook post here (it seems to me there are some errors in there but likely of no consequence).

I think unfortunately there are only two things that can be said about this case:
1) For those travelling to Canada by air, what the airlines think can be a real, practical problem for those trying to travel - especially in covid times. If all of the above is true at least on the important points, I think it is a case of manifest error - the airline was clearly mistaken in believing that the requirement is that a PR cannot be out of Canada for more than 730 days. Unfortunately this is not always easy to show.

2) What the airline should have done is both check carefully the requirements and contacted IRCC/CBSA to confirm that they are allowed to board the airline (as admissible to Canada). Also the travellers should have checked carefully with the airline beforehand - frankly it's not surprising that the check-in agents do not always know what they're talking about and they tend to be punished for mistakes rather than rewarded for correct decisions (it costs the airline real money if they let someone board who is not entitled to).

3) More knowledgeable members here may wish to comment, but: I think the airline was even more wrong than indicated here. By Canadian law, (I think) any PR with a valid PR card should be allowed to enter Canada (and also to board a plane) and will not be denied entry at the border. Upon examination (i.e. at the border) can start the formal process to show that the PR is not in compliance with the residency obligation and (after appeals, review, etc., etc) potentially revoke the PR status - but that's not the airline's concern, and while the process goes on, the individual will be allowed into Canada. Or briefly: a PR card that's still valid (by date) should be sufficient for a PR to board a flight to Canada.

But: I'm assuming the info above from the person who had the problem is all correct. Airlines screw up, it does happen. But also, internet versions of what happened are not always correct.

I think you can see hwere the recommendations for you lead here: check with the airline before.

(And as a side note, it's probably obvious, but some airlines and staff at some airports are better informed than others - I doubt this would have occurred with an Air Canada flight from Frankfurt - a big hub for Air Canada from much of Eurasia - for example).

Thank you @armoured for your valuable time. I will surely try to get confirmation from authorities beforehand.

 

[armoured]

By Canadian law, (I think) any PR with a valid PR card should be allowed to enter Canada (and also to board a plane) and will not be denied entry at the border.

To clarify a point that's perhaps not clear above (e.g. why a traveller with a valid PR card should be allowed to board the flight): airlines have to pay penalties if they let someone board a flight who is sent back (e.g on the next flight).

I don't think that applies to an airline that lets someone on a flight with a valid PR card who is (after being reported as non-compliant, let into Canada, full appeal process, etc) then subject to having PR status revoked; I think in such cases airlines are not subject to penalties.

But I've phrased this broadly and haven't checked the regulations airlines are subject to (presumably extremely detailed and painful language), and I've ignored things like stolen passports and PR cards which may have been cancelled (in some database) or criminality or no-fly (terrorism) blacklists and the like, i.e. all we can do is take at face value the case above that there weren't other issues and that all was as reported by the individual.