FSW WORLDWIDE

[Deleted member 1050918]

If you’re inland I imagine you’ll get it 2022. And you’ll also have an excuse to remain where you are until you graduate at least.

"Where you are" is a piss poor grad student that has to count his bites or he might end up starving lol. Anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on somebody else's dime (read your supervisor's) is a fool who's about to face true poverty. And anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on their own dime is a fool who's only looking to waste their money on a useless Canadian degree (since nobody gives a shit about most Canadian degrees). Basically anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student is a fool.

Luckily I'm somewhere else now and can go back to that shithole (never thought I'd call any country a shithole besides mine but here we go lmao) whenever I want; but my choice will be to "wait it out" until I have a PR so I can fucking work and live like a human and not like a rat.

 

[kloppity]

"Where you are" is a piss poor grad student that has to count his bites or he might end up starving lol. Anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on somebody else's dime (read your supervisor's) is a fool who's about to face true poverty. And anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on their own dime is a fool who's only looking to waste their money on a useless Canadian degree (since nobody gives a shit about most Canadian degrees). Basically anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student is a fool.

Luckily I'm somewhere else now and can go back to that shithole (never thought I'd call any country a shithole besides mine but here we go lmao) whenever I want; but my choice will be to "wait it out" until I have a PR so I can fucking work and live like a human and not like a rat.

This could only have been written by an absolute idiot and I wasn't surprised when I saw the poster. For such a shithole place you do spend alot of your time debating moving there.

Give it a rest already, Canada is not paradise, no place is, and degrees from run of the mill schools in those other countries piss on those from top Canadian universities, we know. No need evangelizing about it here. Looks like all you do is remind everyone about how poor Canada is compared to your ideal country - again we know. But coming up with outright ridiculous statements like this does nothing for the profile of a well-read professional you are trying to portray here, matter of fact it shows you as the opposite.

 

[Deleted member 1050918]

This could only have been written by an absolute idiot and I wasn't surprised when I saw the poster. For such a shithole place you do spend alot of your time debating moving there.

I'd talk numbers, salary, rent etc but for a hopeless fella like you who has no other options than Canada to make it out of his shithole country, I don't have the time. Roll on lil chap

 

[kloppity]

I'd talk numbers, salary, rent etc but for a hopeless fella like you who has no other options than Canada to make it out of his shithole country, I don't have the time. Roll on lil chap

I'd be happy to indulge you. Maybe even share professional profiles too. How about that?

 

[dankboi]

From reddit (dm)

FSW- Outland CRS- 474 Web developer (Family of 3)
Country of residence- U.S.A
Nationality- U.S.A
VO- Ottawa
AOR- January 2020
PPR- November 15 2021

 

[boilercat]

From reddit (dm)

FSW- Outland CRS- 474 Web developer (Family of 3)
Country of residence- U.S.A
Nationality- U.S.A
VO- Ottawa
AOR- January 2020
PPR- November 15 2021

Hope the trend will continue

 

[Islander216]

That's one way of looking at it, what I was pointing out is that a Conservative government would most like choose immigrants that have an economic benefit, while a Liberal government would most likely choose immigrants for humanitarian reasons. As for reducing immigration, studies show this would have a negative impact to Canada's overall economy, for immigration to be stopped or reduced, there should first be an economic penalty for Canada. You might argue, it could be a sociopolitical reason, but with the PPC essentially being excluded in Parliament. I see no present evidence, that Canada might suddenly turn populist.

It's subjective, but many times it's not really about how it affects the economy but more about how people perceive immigration.

Morrison won another election against the odds by promising to reduce immigration and it worked in Australia.

People don't vote on economic benefits as a whole, it's about how they perceive the affects immigration has on the society they live in.

Like i said, Canada has avoided right wing populism for now, but just a normal right of center candidate could just say we need to reduce immigration levels by some extent and it could work, especially post-covid. It's one thing O'Toole failed to take advantage of because he was moving to the center a lot to try to gain mass appeal.

For the record i don't think immigration will ever stop, it'll just be at lower levels. It could be 150k a year for example, which was the average not long ago.

 

[Deleted member 1050918]

I'd be happy to indulge you. Maybe even share professional profiles too. How about that?

Eh I'm not gonna play if you're gonna throw insults around like a kid again. Shared some numbers before but I'll do it again for those interested:

All dollars I'll talk about are Canadian dollars. Now if you're some 23 year old kid who's never been out of school let alone his/her country, you can stop reading here now; because what I'll share is not necessarily a concern for 25- year olds since they are still kids who wouldn't mind sleeping under a bridge calling it "yo dude I crashed somewhere so weeeiiiirrdddd".

Adults and young adults aged 25+ who are actually looking for "skilled immigration" or "professional immigration" to build more upon their existing careers, read on.

My lab mates and I are kinda on the better end of the grad student pay in BC. There are some very slight variations but let's average them to $1800 / month. You gotta put aside about $700 / mo to pay the next instalment of your tuition. $75 / mo is mandatory for government insurance thingy. So you're essentially getting paid $1025/ mo.

All you can do with this kind of money is rent a single room in a shared house where you probably have 5+ other tenants to share the kitchen and bathroom(s) with. I can't even begin to discuss how shitty of a situation house sharing is for an adult, but that's for another talk. An okay room in an okay house that's not a complete dump is about $800 / mo. --> $225 left

Your phone bill is probably $50 something but I'll cheat and say you're paying $25 / mo for phone. --> $200 left

Your shampoo, soap, tooth paste, deodorant and various other hygiene expenses will be about $100 / mo actually but let's assume you're a stinky piece of shit and get away with $50 / mo spending on hygiene. --> $150 left

Feeling hungry? You haven't spent on food yet. Eating properly at home like a human and not like a rat usually costs about $250 / mo, but you don't have that kind of money. See? As a grad student you don't get to eat as much as you like, but as much as $150 / mo allows you and that means you are never trully full after a meal and have to count your bites and embrace the stress inbetween those bites.

Oh you wanted to have a social life in Canada? Go to bars? Events? Pick up a hobby? Do something with friends? Maybe buy new clothes? Electronics? Just stuff you need? Dude you're barely not starving; you cannot have a social life, hobbies, or any sort of entertainment in Canada as a grad student.

"Kangaroo I can work as a teaching assistant and make life a bit easier how about that?" Yes you can. I'll do the math for you. For TAs, 1 standard course with standard hours and standard pay gets you $200 / mo if you divide it by 12 (all months of that year). So now add that $200 to the last $150 / mo you had in your pocket after spending on hygiene; you have $350 / mo if you TA once every single year. With $350 / mo, you can afford to eat okay for $250 and have $100 left for social life, hobbies, entertainment. Now you're at least not starving but $100 is not enough for social life. A typical Saturday night out at the local bar is $25 if you wanna go cheap and 2-3 student beers and leave. So all social life you get is you go out to the local bar once a week and drink 3 glasses of that piss called student beer (lager with a lot of water in it). I personally put down 3 glasses in an hour or two; so your "night out" is limited to 2 hours unless people are buying you drinks (lol). So forget about dating, events, hobbies, just keep drinking that piss at the local bar once a week and go back home half tipsy (trust me it has a lot of water in it) at fucking 10 PM (you went out at 8 and have only 2 hours in the bar).

This story ignores so many unexpected, unforeseen expenses, especially unexpected medical expenses.

I could go on and give more details but yeah that's the idea.

 

[Islander216]

I know many people who had it easy. Went to the UK on study visa and kept on renewing their student visas until they had spent enough time to apply for PR. I think it was a combination of abuse and some racist sentiment generally that made the situation so dire. Should have thought more about choosing my destination but hindsight is always perfect. I also heard that the UK is trying to adopt a similar point based system as Canada. Also heard about (word of mouth) a possible agreement between Canada, UK and Australia for free movement of PR holders.

There've been a lot of abuses over the years if we're being honest, a lot. I don't blame the British for making it much stricter, a lot of people abused the system.

Also, there is a lot of demand for immigration to the UK, i think only the US tops it. So they have to draw the line somewhere.

 

[Deleted member 1050918]

*Longass post of mine. Click to go to it.*

I could go on and give more details but yeah that's the idea.

Now on to the best case scenario for adults aged 25+ who are considering the grad student life in Canada on their supervisor's dime. I said you have $350 / mo if you're TAing once a year. Make it once a term (twice a year) and you have $550 / mo. This is the kind of money where you'll just about "float". You'll always be stressed, always hovering above $0 at the end of the month if you're looking to keep a somewhat bearable life in Canada as an adult (with some social life hobbies etc as discussed above). Oh and don't forget; you're still living in that shared house. You never appreciated your personal bathroom or kitchen in your or your family's home as an adult? Canada will teach you to appreciate it.

Any TAing more than once a term will delay your graduation because it takes a lot of time and you won't be able to focus on your thesis enough. Your supervisor will also not allow you more than 1 TA per term because of this reason; they want you to graduate asap.

So yeah, happy living the Canadian dream with your $550 / mo.

Crucial advice for lunatics who read and understand all I shared but still wanna go study in Canada on a stipend: Go for a master's dude, and NEVER go for a PhD. PhD is much longer and directly makes you overqualified for literally all jobs in Canada.

 

[kloppity]

Eh I'm not gonna play if you're gonna throw insults around like a kid again. Shared some numbers before but I'll do it again for those interested:

All dollars I'll talk about are Canadian dollars. Now if you're some 23 year old kid who's never been out of school let alone his/her country, you can stop reading here now; because what I'll share is not necessarily a concern for 25- year olds since they are still kids who wouldn't mind sleeping under a bridge calling it "yo dude I crashed somewhere so weeeiiiirrdddd".

Adults and young adults aged 25+ who are actually looking for "skilled immigration" or "professional immigration" to build more upon their existing careers, read on.

My lab mates and I are kinda on the better end of the grad student pay in BC. There are some very slight variations but let's average them to $1800 / month. You gotta put aside about $700 / mo to pay the next instalment of your tuition. $75 / mo is mandatory for government insurance thingy. So you're essentially getting paid $1025/ mo.

All you can do with this kind of money is rent a single room in a shared house where you probably have 5+ other tenants to share the kitchen and bathroom(s) with. I can't even begin to discuss how shitty of a situation house sharing is for an adult, but that's for another talk. An okay room in an okay house that's not a complete dump is about $800 / mo. --> $225 left

Your phone bill is probably $50 something but I'll cheat and say you're paying $25 / mo for phone. --> $200 left

Your shampoo, soap, tooth paste, deodorant and various other hygiene expenses will be about $100 / mo actually but let's assume you're a stinky piece of shit and get away with $50 / mo spending on hygiene. --> $150 left

Feeling hungry? You haven't spent on food yet. Eating properly at home like a human and not like a rat usually costs about $250 / mo, but you don't have that kind of money. See? As a grad student you don't get to eat as much as you like, but as much as $150 / mo allows you and that means you are never trully full after a meal and have to count your bites and embrace the stress inbetween those bites.

Oh you wanted to have a social life in Canada? Go to bars? Events? Pick up a hobby? Do something with friends? Maybe buy new clothes? Electronics? Just stuff you need? Dude you're barely not starving; you cannot have a social life, hobbies, or any sort of entertainment in Canada as a grad student.

"Kangaroo I can work as a teaching assistant and make life a bit easier how about that?" Yes you can. I'll do the math for you. For TAs, 1 standard course with standard hours and standard pay gets you $200 / mo if you divide it by 12 (all months of that year). So now add that $200 to the last $150 / mo you had in your pocket after spending on hygiene; you have $350 / mo if you TA once every single year. With $350 / mo, you can afford to eat okay for $250 and have $100 left for social life, hobbies, entertainment. Now you're at least not starving but $100 is not enough for social life. A typical Saturday night out at the local bar is $25 if you wanna go cheap and 2-3 student beers and leave. So all social life you get is you go out to the local bar once a week and drink 3 glasses of that piss called student beer (lager with a lot of water in it). I personally put down 3 glasses in an hour or two; so your "night out" is limited to 2 hours unless people are buying you drinks (lol). So forget about dating, events, hobbies, just keep drinking that piss at the local bar once a week and go back home half tipsy (trust me it has a lot of water in it) at fucking 10 PM (you went out at 8 and have only 2 hours in the bar).

This story ignores so many unexpected, unforeseen expenses, especially unexpected medical expenses.

I could go on and give more details but yeah that's the idea.

Now here is the thing, all of this sounds relatively familiar. I myself had to deal with some of this, definitely not as extreme because I got multiple funding and some extras from a personal research grant.

However, besides the states, no other "western" country gives much more than this. I also considered that when deciding to accept the Canadian offer. It's not the best, no honest person will say it it, but for most people it is more than they could get from their countries, or similar countries not called the USA.

 

[Deleted member 1050918]

Now here is the thing, all of this sounds relatively familiar. I myself had to deal with some of this, definitely not as extreme because I got multiple funding and some extras from a personal research grant.

First of all thanks for not throwing insults and actually discussing it. Not to brag but I research in a pretty famous lab under a superstar prof and the students are obviously competitive and very bright. I can assure you funding from multiple sources is indeed possible but very rare so we can't view it as the average to set the expectations to. Even our students don't get funds from multiple resources; just one.

However, besides the states, no other "western" country gives much more than this.

Have you looked at the EU? Germany, Sweden, Netherlands etc. They pay students properly. Of course they get paid less than professionals there but they are in a much, much better shape; it's so well known actually.

or similar countries not called the USA.

The grad life in USA is quite like the grad life in Canada so I think the distinction is North America vs Europe. The UK is I think closer to North America than the rest of Europe but yeah you get the idea.

Grad in EU is a much better choice. It takes shorter, gives better pay, gives better connection with industry so job prospects are much better after graduating. Looks like we both are too late to think about that though lol.

 

[kloppity]

Have you looked at the EU? Germany, Sweden, Netherlands etc. They pay students properly. Of course they get paid less than professionals there but they are in a much, much better shape; it's so well known actually.

I might be ignorant here but isn't the German model one where you basically have to pay money upfront and they pay you a fraction of that monthly. Or is this unique to just PhD programs? I know the Netherlands offer some sort of stipends, but again I never considered it so much soni might be wrong there. Don't think I could have ever gone anywhere in the EU after those two (Finland at a push) so it would never have mattered if the likes of Sweden paid better.

The UK, yes, you can get some fairer stipend. I met postdocs who completed PhDs in the UK and they didn't have much good to say about the money either, so pay is not equally represented.

Thing is though, alot of these grad students are coming from countries where even a monthly saving of $200 is seen as good enough, so most would jump at that chance. I definitely didn't think I was underpaid then - my province is much more generous with research funding - but I can sure say now that the stipends are poor.

 

[Deleted member 1050918]

I might be ignorant here but isn't the German model one where you basically have to pay money upfront and they pay you a fraction of that monthly. Or is this unique to just PhD programs?

I think it's the same for all grad programs, not just PhD. Yeah you lock the amount asked by the government into a bank account and they pay you monthly over that. But time is easier for grad students in Germany because tuition is usually pretty close to zero and life expenses (rent food etc) are generally lower. Also I believe students have higher chances of getting additional pay from their supervisors to do some extra for industry and/or the university. Haven't heard poverty stories from my grad friends in EU as brutal as my stories.

The UK, yes, you can get some fairer stipend. I met postdocs who completed PhDs in the UK and they didn't have much good to say about the money either, so pay is not equally represented.

As far as I know UK is pretty tough in terms of grad student finances. Tuition there is crazy too. I'd say overall it's close to North America (perhaps a bit better, closer to EU a bit).

Thing is though, alot of these grad students are coming from countries where even a monthly saving of $200 is seen as good enough, so most would jump at that chance. I definitely didn't think I was underpaid then - my province is much more generous with research funding - but I can sure say now that the stipends are poor.

Agreed. The moment I signed my research assistantship contract and saw the money on it, I went up on google and looked up tuition, rent, grocery cost etc and thought to myself "man I'm so fucked but let's see how it goes". Just a month into my "Canadian dream" as a grad student, bam, reality wakes me up one morning bashing me in the face screaming "you were right dumbass". I got a bit lucky later and found stability outside of Canada but my intention was to provide an image of "the standard" that would be waiting for most fellas in Canada if they wish to live on a stipend.

 

[FurioGiunta]

"Where you are" is a piss poor grad student that has to count his bites or he might end up starving lol. Anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on somebody else's dime (read your supervisor's) is a fool who's about to face true poverty. And anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student on their own dime is a fool who's only looking to waste their money on a useless Canadian degree (since nobody gives a shit about most Canadian degrees). Basically anyone who comes to Canada as a grad student is a fool.

Luckily I'm somewhere else now and can go back to that shithole (never thought I'd call any country a shithole besides mine but here we go lmao) whenever I want; but my choice will be to "wait it out" until I have a PR so I can fucking work and live like a human and not like a rat.

It depends on where you go and what your field of study is. If you go to a top school in Canada (Waterloo, UofT, McGill) and get a degree in a in-demand field, then it is absolutely worth it. A machine learning (ML) PhD from UofT, for example, is as good as a ML PhD from a top 5 US school, given the immense research talent there. Of course getting in is also as difficult. You are not going to live like a king during your PhD, no one does, but depending on your research area and talent, you can secure additional scholarships (on top of base RA + TA) to live quite comfortably. You seem to be projecting a lot here lol.