PR Status Obligations

[jithucan123]

Hello Guyz,

My self my wife and our elder son are holding Canadian PR Status since March 4, 2014. We are in Canada since March 4, 2014. Our younger son is a Canadian Citizen and he is 7 months old. We are going back to our Home country (India) in an indefinite period. I know we will lose our PR Status if we couldn't physically present in 730 days within a five years period. But I have read in CIC website that "Time spent outside Canada may also count towards the two years if you are: a child travelling with a father or mother who is a Canadian citizen," So my question is that can we stay in India as till our second son turns 18 or do we have to come to Canada once we spend 3 years in India. My apologies if this confused you guyz.

I also have another question, can we go back to Canada after spending 3 years in India and again back to India after spending 1 or 2 weeks in Canada?

Thanks in Advance

 

[zardoz]

Hello Guyz,

My self my wife and our elder son are holding Canadian PR Status since March 4, 2014. We are in Canada since March 4, 2014. Our younger son is a Canadian Citizen and he is 7 months old. We are going back to our Home country (India) in an indefinite period. I know we will lose our PR Status if we couldn't physically present in 730 days within a five years period. But I have read in CIC website that "Time spent outside Canada may also count towards the two years if you are: a child travelling with a father or mother who is a Canadian citizen," So my question is that can we stay in India as till our second son turns 18 or do we have to come to Canada once we spend 3 years in India. My apologies if this confused you guyz.

I also have another question, can we go back to Canada after spending 3 years in India and again back to India after spending 1 or 2 weeks in Canada?

Thanks in Advance

No, you have it backwards. Your Canadian citizen child will not protect your PR status. It's the other way round.
You can travel to Canada but only the physical presence days will be counted for the residency obligation requirements. Once you have failed to meet the residency obligation, you are at risk of having your PR status revoked, after due process of course.

 

[jithucan123]

Thanks a lot. So in short I can stay in India 3 Years plus the days I have spend in Canada right?

 

[zardoz]

Thanks a lot. So in short I can stay in India 3 Years plus the days I have spend in Canada right?

If any of you fail to spend 730 days in Canada in the 1825 days since March 4th 2014, your PR status is at risk.
What you do in that period is up to you. Just visiting Canada doesn't reset the clock.

 

[jithucan123]

Thanks a lot for this information.

So our advantage of spending 485 days in Canada is that once we back to Canada, we can renew our PR Cards after spending only the remaining 245 days isn't it?

 

[dpenabill]

Thanks a lot for this information.

So our advantage of spending 485 days in Canada is that once we back to Canada, we can renew our PR Cards after spending only the remaining 245 days isn't it?

If you spend more than 1095 days abroad during the first five years following the day you landed, you will be in breach of the PR Residency Obligation and at risk for being adjudicated to be inadmissible, resulting in loss of PR status.

In your scenario you would be cutting it so close as to be putting yourselves at significant risk. Moreover, if you actually wait to return to Canada after being abroad exactly 1094 days (say), you could not leave Canada for more than two days in the next two years without breaching the PR RO. That is, even if you stayed in Canada for a full year, upon your return, if you left Canada for more than two days your presence in Canada will be less than 730 days within the preceding five years (as of that time, which is what counts). In particular, even if you apply for and are issued a new PR card within the first year after you return, if you leave again before spending a full two years in Canada you will be in breach of the PR RO.


Some (longer) explanation for the above:

Technically, you will be in compliance with the PR RO if you return to Canada at least the day before you have been abroad 1096 days. But if you cut it close to 1095 days remember that the burden of proving compliance is on YOU, so if CIC has any reason to question, to doubt, you were actually present in Canada some of the time you declare you have been present in Canada, that can be a problem.

Thus, applying for a PR card with less than 800 days of presence within the preceding five years risks CIC having questions, which should be for obvious reasons (such a person obviously has been spending more time outside Canada than in Canada, so for any time there is less than a clear showing of presence, it is readily inferred that the PR was outside Canada, since, after all, that has been where the PR usually has been). Thus, there is a risk CIC will refer the PR to Secondary Review, with a potential for a full-blown Residency Determination which would not only result in a long delay in processing the PR card application but will require the PR to document (including evidence of activity in Canada such as employment, filing taxes in Canada, and so on) the time present in Canada, again the burden of proving presence on the PR.

Moreover, as suggested above, there is a significant pitfall lurking in your scenario. Again technically, yes, if you have been in Canada 485 days following the date of landing, and you return to Canada in time to avoid being outside Canada more than 1095 days, you will be in compliance and eligible for a new PR card. (To apply for the new card you would not have to wait, until being present 245 days, since the days remaining until the fifth anniversary of landing still count as days toward compliance . . . right up to the day of the fifth year anniversary of the day you landed . . . not the date the PR card expires but the date that is exactly five years from the day you landed.)

But in this scenario you will not have more than 730 days presence counting toward compliance with the PR Residency Obligation until you have been in Canada, after your return, for at least two years. Remember, days more than five years previous drop out of the residency calculation.

So, if for example you are abroad exactly 1095 days before returning to Canada, once you reach the fifth year anniversary, for every day you remain in Canada after that you lose a day from that initial 485 days spent in Canada. That is, if you go abroad for 1095 days, the presence that counts toward compliance will remain at 730 for a full two years following the date you return. Possession of a newly issued PR card will not allow you travel abroad without slipping into a breach of the PR RO during those two years.



Note, to be clear, zardoz has it right about credit toward presence: PR child accompanying a Canadian citizen parent gets credit toward the PR RO while abroad . . . NOT the other way around . . . that is, there is NO credit for the PR parent who is living with a Canadian citizen child abroad.

 

[scylla]

Thanks a lot for this information.

So our advantage of spending 485 days in Canada is that once we back to Canada, we can renew our PR Cards after spending only the remaining 245 days isn't it?

As explained above in detail - you would need to spend two straight years in Canada once you return to renew your PR cards.

 

[jithucan123]

Hi,

Million thanks for the detailed reply.

So finally we have decided like this: We will go to India by September 2015. We will spend two years and 9 months (1000 days) in India. We will return by 2018 June. Then we will spend 730 days (2 years) in Canada and once we have completed the 730th day, we will apply for the PR Card renewal.

Does it work? Or do you have any other suggestions.

My apologies if I am disturbing you.

Thanks a lot

 

[keesio]

Hi,

Million thanks for the detailed reply.

So finally we have decided like this: We will go to India by September 2015. We will spend two years and 9 months (1000 days) in India. We will return by 2018 June. Then we will spend 730 days (2 years) in Canada and once we have completed the 730th day, we will apply for the PR Card renewal.

Does it work? Or do you have any other suggestions.

My apologies if I am disturbing you.

Thanks a lot

That should work. Just start collecting proofs of the time you spend in Canada up until the date you leave. It will be useful when you try to return top Canada 1000 days later and CBSA isn't sure if you still meet you RO. Having solid proof with you can help you avoid getting reported for investigation. If you get into Canada without issue, just stay in Canada until you meet the 730+ days in 5 years requirement and you should be good.

 

[jithucan123]

Thanks a lot

 

[eileenf]

So finally we have decided like this: We will go to India by September 2015. We will spend two years and 9 months (1000 days) in India. We will return by 2018 June. Then we will spend 730 days (2 years) in Canada and once we have completed the 730th day, we will apply for the PR Card renewal.

Does it work? Or do you have any other suggestions.

That works as long as nothing unexpected ever happens in your life.

This forum is filled with posts from people who barely meet their RO and then lack wiggle room when faced with important and unpredictable life events. Many have to decide whether a family member's funeral, a good job with a bit of travel or a best friend's wedding will result in loss of PR.

It's risky.

 

[jithucan123]

Thanks a lot for your reply

 

[Leon]

Also keep in mind that the RO is not just for the first 5 years, it's for any rolling 5 year period so after you have renewed your PR cards, you must still continue to have at least 730 days in Canada in the past 5 years. If you leave for almost 3 years, you must spend at least 2 years straight to make up for it. After that, you can leave for almost 3 years again, then must spend another 2 in Canada etc.

 

[Gravity]

HELLO EXPERTS,

please enlighten me .

I have PR STATUS ;a new immigrant. I know we have to live in Canada for 2 yrs in 5 yrs time. Want to know these 2 yrs are continuous?
and it is MUST to live 183 days continuous in an year? OR in 5 yrs time we can come and go outside Canada such that days living in Canada ADDS up to 183 in an year?

as I have heard if we don't 183 in a row in one yr and we leave Canada before 183 days than our days that we lived in Canada WILL NOT add up to 2 yrs time in five yrs pr status ?

 

[keesio]

To keep PR, you need 730 days out of any 5 year period. That's it. It doesn't have to be continuous.

You getting mixed up with Citizenship requirements where out of a 6 year period, you need 4 years where you spend at least 183 days in the year in Canada (doesn't have to be continuous)