Length of relationship advisable before sponsoring Thai spouse

[maikan]

Hi,

I'm a (French) Canadian citizen, I came to Thailand 8 months ago and I'm still living there at the present. I'm engaged to a Thai woman. Our relationship is six months old now. We've been living together for three months, everything is going perfectly fine. We're talking about moving together to Canada, and since we know this is going to be a long process, we're ready to get married soon in Thailand and start the sponsorship application, which we would send to Singapour Canada Immigration Office.

My question is not : "Is it a good idea to marry a Thai girl?" I know many people have an opinion about it, I don't need to ear it. My question rather is : for the immigration officers, could a seven or eight months relationship (the time we get married, our relationship will be older!) seems too short? Could it play against us? Should we be better waiting a few months more? (Once again, remember I'm not asking for a life coach advise, but for an administrative one).

Here's some details about the candidate... Thai, 30 years old, master degree in business, have been working as a manager in a good company for five years (and still is), very good salary in Thai standarts, speaks English and German fluently.

What do you think the chances of success would be? Thanks.

 

[maikan]

(Sorry, I just notice there is a topic about "Sponsoring of Spouse", I moved my question there, but I'm not able to delete this topic... Feel free to remove it, or answer me here. Thanks.)

 

[kevwoodfine]

My question is not : "Is it a good idea to marry a Thai girl?"

What do you think the chances of success would be? Thanks.

You marry someone because you love them .. It should never matter what people will think.


If your relationship is real ... CIC will approve your application.


the question you should ask yourself is do you love her... Or does she and you just want a PR card.

 

[Rob_TO]

There is no right or wrong answer, as every VO sees things a little bit differently. There is no guideline they are following that says a relationship before marriage of X years is OK, but anything less is automatic red flag.

I would say in general, the longer the relationship before marriage the better. A very quick process of meeting, relationship, engagement, marriage, apply for PR... results in a quick red flag and more scrutiny of your application. IMO i think the standard is around a 1 year relationship before marriage to not look suspicious... but there are thousands of cases all over the place that get approved with less, or denied with more.

I know for a fact also though that in many asian cultures, people get engaged and married pretty quickly after starting to date. Especially with women that are in their 30's, as there is a social stigma in many countries that after 30 a single woman is looked down upon and encouraged to marry and settle down asap. So in your case it may not be an issue at all. When the wedding happens, try and make sure as many of your family/friends as well as her family/friends are there to take lots of pictures for proof... as friends/family support is very important to a VO (if a fraudulent marriage, there is less chance you would want to share with other people).

Thai residents need to go through the Singapore office for PR processing outland. Unfortunately they have a pretty bad wait time... with 50% of applications (spouse/partner) taking a worst case time of 15 months. 20% of cases see a max time of 8 months. So prepare for a long wait. If there is a chance to get your fiancee a visa and get her to Canada, you might be better off applying inland in your case. Good luck.

 

[blueangel371115]

I agree with the posts here. From what I understand, they scrutinize relationships less than two years "old", especially with no children. To protect Canadians from marriage fraud. But I'd say, yes apply just be prepared with the info to verify your relationship. The CIC website has quite of info, if you haven't already, check it out it wouldn't hurt. Again, anyone feel free to correct me.

 

[Rob_TO]

You marry someone because you love them .. It should never matter what people will think.
If your relationship is real ... CIC will approve your application.
the question you should ask yourself is do you love her... Or does she and you just want a PR card.

That is a nice romantic thought, but not always correct. It does matter what just 1 person thinks - the VO assigned to process your application. CIC rejects thousands of applications every year, many of which are genuine loving couples... and approves many from fraudulent marriages of convenience. It's best to always be prepared and understand the reality and requirements of how to do a proper application.

 

[Kiwi12]

It is true, I believe that the CIC would prefer to see a relationship that has been ongoing for more than a year and would likely be more comfortable with a relationship where the couple has spent a significant amount of time or significant bouts of time living together.

The big question for you is: are you willing to live permanently in Thailand if your application gets rejected?

This is not a question for your to answer on this forum, just for you to think about yourself.

 

[maikan]

There is no right or wrong answer, as every VO sees things a little bit differently. There is no guideline they are following that says a relationship before marriage of X years is OK, but anything less is automatic red flag.

I would say in general, the longer the relationship before marriage the better. A very quick process of meeting, relationship, engagement, marriage, apply for PR... results in a quick red flag and more scrutiny of your application. IMO i think the standard is around a 1 year relationship before marriage to not look suspicious... but there are thousands of cases all over the place that get approved with less, or denied with more.

I know for a fact also though that in many asian cultures, people get engaged and married pretty quickly after starting to date. Especially with women that are in their 30's, as there is a social stigma in many countries that after 30 a single woman is looked down upon and encouraged to marry and settle down asap. So in your case it may not be an issue at all. When the wedding happens, try and make sure as many of your family/friends as well as her family/friends are there to take lots of pictures for proof... as friends/family support is very important to a VO (if a fraudulent marriage, there is less chance you would want to share with other people).

Thai residents need to go through the Singapore office for PR processing outland. Unfortunately they have a pretty bad wait time... with 50% of applications (spouse/partner) taking a worst case time of 15 months. 20% of cases see a max time of 8 months. So prepare for a long wait. If there is a chance to get your fiancee a visa and get her to Canada, you might be better off applying inland in your case. Good luck.

Thanks a lot for your answer Rob_TO! Very helpful and accurate.

Yes, I know the timeline in Singapour is very bad, that's why we think about making the application soon. I guest we'll have to find a compromise between applying late and risking a red flag (and, therefore, delay).

I read a lot of posts about the pros and cons of inland vs outland application. Some people say inland process can be longer, others not. On CIC site, the processing time in Singapour is said to be 24 months (!) and in Canada something like 14 months. I don't really know what to believe anymore... To make an inland application, my fiancée would have to get a tourist visa first, not so easy to get I heard (need to prove she plans on returning to Thailand). Other thing about inland is she wouldn't be allowed to work for a while in Canada. Waiting in Thailand, at least she has a good job. I don't know...

As for kevwoodfine post, I couldn't give a better answer than Rob_TO. Love is not a problem, thank you, but I'm not here to discuss that. I just want to make sure that it will be possible for us to live together in Canada, as soon as possible.

 

[Rusty53]

Hi,

I'm a (French) Canadian citizen, I came to Thailand 8 months ago and I'm still living there at the present. I'm engaged to a Thai woman. Our relationship is six months old now. We've been living together for three months, everything is going perfectly fine. We're talking about moving together to Canada, and since we know this is going to be a long process, we're ready to get married soon in Thailand and start the sponsorship application, which we would send to Singapour Canada Immigration Office.

My question is not : "Is it a good idea to marry a Thai girl?" I know many people have an opinion about it, I don't need to ear it. My question rather is : for the immigration officers, could a seven or eight months relationship (the time we get married, our relationship will be older!) seems too short? Could it play against us? Should we be better waiting a few months more? (Once again, remember I'm not asking for a life coach advise, but for an administrative one).

Here's some details about the candidate... Thai, 30 years old, master degree in business, have been working as a manager in a good company for five years (and still is), very good salary in Thai standarts, speaks English and German fluently.

What do you think the chances of success would be? Thanks.

My wife is thai please pm me

 

[amikety]

My brother married a woman from Thailand. I love my sister-in-law. She's awesome.

Their situation was a little different. She was a live-in caregiver and completed her masters in the USA. Either way, they got married and she got status very quickly. (They live in the USA, so it's a little different, but she got her green card within a year.) They dated about two years before getting married.

That being said, if you get married quickly, CIC will look at the application a little harder. She'll also be subject to Conditional PR status for the first two years after landing. That just means if you two break up for any reason, she may lose her PR. This is a new rule, so we don't know how it will work yet (no experiences to share).

Make sure to include plans to re-locate to Canada since you're overseas

 

[Rob_TO]

I read a lot of posts about the pros and cons of inland vs outland application. Some people say inland process can be longer, others not. On CIC site, the processing time in Singapour is said to be 24 months (!) and in Canada something like 14 months. I don't really know what to believe anymore... To make an inland application, my fiancée would have to get a tourist visa first, not so easy to get I heard (need to prove she plans on returning to Thailand). Other thing about inland is she wouldn't be allowed to work for a while in Canada. Waiting in Thailand, at least she has a good job. I don't know...

Note the time on the CIC sites are NOT average processing times. They are the "80%" maximum times which is basically telling you the time it took to complete the worst 20% of applications. It is a useless number not reflective of average at all, so i have no idea why CIC uses this. I think the "50%" stat gives more of an average which is why i quoted that one at 15 months.

Anyways, in most cases outland is much quicker than inland. However in most cases the outland visa office usually takes 6-8 months to process an application. The only reason i suggested inland is because Singapore seems to be one of the worst offices in the world for length of time, so there isn't really much advantage there for speed.

If you apply inland, your wife could get a SIN and start working after the first stage approval which is sometime over 6 months (not sure about healthcare at this point). But if she already had a good job in Thailand, and not to mention it's difficult for Thai citizens to get visitor visas, you are right it might be better to apply outland and be prepared to live in Thailand for a couple more years. I can think of worse things that being forced to live in a beautiful climate country with amazing food and beaches for a few years Hopefully you have a decent job there also!

 

[maikan]

Note the time on the CIC sites are NOT average processing times. They are the "80%" maximum times which is basically telling you the time it took to complete the worst 20% of applications. It is a useless number not reflective of average at all, so i have no idea why CIC uses this. I think the "50%" stat gives more of an average which is why i quoted that one at 15 months.

Anyways, in most cases outland is much quicker than inland. However in most cases the outland visa office usually takes 6-8 months to process an application. The only reason i suggested inland is because Singapore seems to be one of the worst offices in the world for length of time, so there isn't really much advantage there for speed.

If you apply inland, your wife could get a SIN and start working after the first stage approval which is sometime over 6 months (not sure about healthcare at this point). But if she already had a good job in Thailand, and not to mention it's difficult for Thai citizens to get visitor visas, you are right it might be better to apply outland and be prepared to live in Thailand for a couple more years. I can think of worse things that being forced to live in a beautiful climate country with amazing food and beaches for a few years Hopefully you have a decent job there also!

Yes, there certainly is worst things in the world than living in Thailand!

Thanks for clarifying things about processing times. When you see 24 months on the site it's kind of depressing...

Normally, we would apply outland without hesitation. But ya, as you say, waiting time in Singapour is so bad, it makes the inland option appealing. Both have pros and cons really...

If we apply in Singapour, I still hope it will take lest than a few years, because at some point we want to begin our life in Canada. I think that, although the relationship is young, my future wife is a good candidate : education, language skills, working experience... I know that for a sponsorship the genuineness of the relationship is the most important criterion, but the quality of the candidate probably counts too, no?

 

[CanadaNow]

at the risk of stating some obvious things.....

make sure you have already started collecting evidence of your relationship being real. examples:
- photos of the two of you together (not just wedding) at a variety of activities over a period of time
- if you are living together now do any of your bills (rent? utilities? transportation?) have both of your names on them?
- movie ticket, dinner receipts, other paperwork one could collect from events/places a couple would go to
- living together or not if you have emails you could copy/paste your emails into a word document (including time stamps and to/from lines), then when time comes to submit your application you simply print the document.
- what said above for emails could be used for Text messages and/or chat sessions (ie: Yahoo messenger)
- we also typed out a short (bullet form) and long description of our relationship timeline and details (including such information as when we went and did certain activies and when we met each others' family and friends)

bottom line is start collecting paperwork now to show evidence of the relationship. I am sure some will disagree with me but our application package included 700+ pictures, 500 pages of email, 450 pages of yahoo chats, and scanned/printed copies of any tickets/receipts supporting our relationship. Was this overkill? maybe but the website says 31 months for part 2 of Nairobi processing time and we were just asked for her passport after less than 3 months so I think we did some things right.

we also found the info in this link to be very well thought out.....
http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/how-i-organized-our-applcation-and-a-summary-of-all-helpful-tips-i-have-learned-t92449.0.html

Best of luck to you.

 

[maikan]

My wife is thai please pm me

I'm not able to send PM yet, probably because I'm new here... Maybe if you PM me then I can answer? Your help would be appreciated.

 

[CanadaNow]

I'm not able to send PM yet, probably because I'm new here... Maybe if you PM me then I can answer? Your help would be appreciated.

you currently have 9 posts. once you reach 10 (just reply to this) you should be able to PM as well as configure a lot of your profile and signature.

welcome