Status: "its complicated"

[confused2014]

Married in Philippines 1999
Couple migrated to Canada with kids 2006
Couple Get separated 2009
Ex-couple Became Canadian citizen 2011
Filled divorce 2012
Divorce granted (Final) 2013

Ex-Spouse met someone – from Philippines2013
New relationship gifted with baby. (registered to Canadian parent) “Revilla law”
Went back to Philippines to re-marry ( a Filipino citizen)2014
As Canadian citizen, Required by Local Civil registrar office to get Permit to Marry from Canadian Embassy in Manila Legal capacity to marry (done)2014
Marriage license granted by Local Civil Registrar 2014
Wedding Done. 2014
New couple gifted with 2nd baby. . (registered to Canadian parent) “Revilla law”
2nd marriage registered at NSO (copy with sealed by NSO) 2014


Questions:

Is CIC will recognize the 2nd marriage as LEGAL ?
And I quoted this from another forum/blogs:

“Here's another angle for you. I believe a Canadian, just like an American all you would need is a notarized letter from your Embassy (legal capacity to marry) to get a marriage license.You would show your Canadian Divorce papers in your Embassy. It's a formality to get the legal capacity to marry document. That document would allow you to get married in the Philippines. Philippines computerization/records documents are not so organized that they catch the technicality. Since you are now applying as a Canadian it should be fine. Your new wife's family would see the wedding and be happy. It should be fine. The Canadian Embassy doesn't care about Philippines policies. They are more concerned with their policies. As long as you do your procedures.”

Confused.
Mixed information’s. What to do. And what not.

What are the chances of 2nd wife to enter Canada with spousal visa?

Thank you in advance ... for your advise and guidance.........

 

[scylla]

As long as the divorce from your first partner was granted before you got married to your second partner (which it seems like it was) - I don't think you should have any issues.

 

[screech339]

I think the problem is that while the divorce was legal in Canada, one can remarry. Philippine does not recognize divorce. So in theory the canadian divorce person should not have been allowed to remarry in Philippine since the first marriage is still valid there. If he had brought the Filipino fiancé to Canada and gotten married in Canada, then the marriage would be legal in Canada's legal law.

It is one of the reason common law application is common practical route when one partner is a married Filipino that cannot get a divorce.

 

[scylla]

I think the problem is that while the divorce was legal in Canada, one can remarry. Philippine does not recognize divorce. So in theory the canadian divorce person should not have been allowed to remarry in Philippine since the first marriage is still valid there. If he had brought the Filipino fiancé to Canada and gotten married in Canada, then the marriage would be legal in Canada's legal law.

It is one of the reason common law application is common practical route when one partner is a married Filipino that cannot get a divorce.

Ah - I see.

I had assumed the divorce was granted in the Philippines. But now I see that it was probably granted in Canada. That may change things...

Having said that, like you said, if they lived together for at least a year then common law may be the way to go.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

From what I've read, a foreign divorce is only recognized in the Philippines when it is a non-Filipino spouse who initiates the divorce outside of the Philippines, i.e. Non-Filipino Mike marries Filipina Marta, they split, Mike initiates a divorce in Canada, Canada grants divorce, Marta petitions the Philippines court to recognize the Canadian divorce, Philippines court grants her petition.

In this case, I believe that unless the divorced person renounced their Filipino citizenship prior to filing for divorce in Canada and petitioned the Philippines court to recognize the foreign divorce, s/he is actually still legally married to the first spouse in the Philippines and therefore the second marriage is invalid under Philippine law.

Bit of a legal mess.

 

[screech339]

Yes. A legal mess for sure.

So unless the OP provided a little more detail like whether only one was non-Filipino and the other was Filipino or both were Filipinos. We don't know.

The other question is how easy one can renounce Filipino citizenship. The ex-couple gotten canadian citizenship only to get divorced 1 year later. So can one officially renounce and lose Filipino citizenship as easy as less than 1 year?

One can only make assumptions based on what the OP has posted.

 

[Alurra71]

The couple became Canadian citizens before filing for and being granted a divorce.

Whichever ex spouse (husband/wife) went to the Philippines and got a legal marriage certificate from the Philippines and THEN married a new spouse. According to what the OP stated

As Canadian citizen, Required by Local Civil registrar office to get Permit to Marry from Canadian Embassy in Manila Legal capacity to marry (done)2014
Marriage license granted by Local Civil Registrar 2014
Wedding Done. 2014
2nd marriage registered at NSO (copy with sealed by NSO) 2014

I don't see how that could pose any problem at all for the new spouse to immigrate, provided CIC doesn't assume the first marriage was one of convenience for immigration purposes.

 

[screech339]

The couple became Canadian citizens before filing for and being granted a divorce.

Whichever ex spouse (husband/wife) went to the Philippines and got a legal marriage certificate from the Philippines and THEN married a new spouse. According to what the OP stated
I don't see how that could pose any problem at all for the new spouse to immigrate, provided CIC doesn't assume the first marriage was one of convenience for immigration purposes.

As canuck mentioned. The one that gotten remarried to second wife is probably a non-Filipino Canadian.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

Based on the OP saying that the first couple married in the Philippines and migrated to Canada together, I assume both are Filipino.

If the person was not a Filipino, then there is no issue in this situation.


The issue is if the person is Filipino. As I said above, I believe that the ONLY situation in which the Philippines will recognize foreign divorce when it's initiated by a non-Filipino citizen in a different country.

If this person was still a Filipino citizen when s/he got divorced in Canada, then the were still subject to Philippine law (regardless of being a dual citizen); the divorce would be recognized by the rest of the world but not by the Philippines. That means that s/he was still considered legally married to the first spouse in the Philippines at the time of the second marriage, which means that the second one wouldn't be valid.

 

[screech339]

Based on the OP saying that the first couple married in the Philippines and migrated to Canada together, I assume both are Filipino.

If the person was not a Filipino, then there is no issue in this situation.


The issue is if the person is Filipino. As I said above, I believe that the ONLY situation in which the Philippines will recognize foreign divorce when it's initiated by a non-Filipino citizen in a different country.

If this person was still a Filipino citizen when s/he got divorced in Canada, then the were still subject to Philippine law (regardless of being a dual citizen); the divorce would be recognized by the rest of the world but not by the Philippines. That means that s/he was still considered legally married to the first spouse in the Philippines at the time of the second marriage, which means that the second one wouldn't be valid.

Plus assuming that it was the Filipino Canadian that applied through the Canadian Embassy, the Filipino authorities may have overlooked this loophole thinking that it was a Canadian that was applying for the request to marry/remarry. The Filipino Canadian basically bypassed the Philippines law that all Filipinos will not be granted a divorce by law.

This is where it can get complicated. Canada says it is a legal marriage since he was legally divorced. Philippines says opps we didn't know he is also Filipino citizen thus his divorce in Canada is not legal, thereby making the 2nd marriage invalid or void since as a Filipino he is still married to the first wife according to our law.

 

[Alurra71]

I understand the nuance behind it all, but if he/she was granted a marriage certificate and then it was recognized and stamped/sealed by the NSO, wouldn't that make it a legal marriage in the Philippines and in Canada? I guess I don't quite understand how they could after it's all been issued and stamped/signed/sealed/delivered and all that happy jazz and then be told "oh, sorry, nope, it's not legal after all. Ooopsie" ...

 

[canuck_in_uk]

I understand the nuance behind it all, but if he/she was granted a marriage certificate and then it was recognized and stamped/sealed by the NSO, wouldn't that make it a legal marriage in the Philippines and in Canada? I guess I don't quite understand how they could after it's all been issued and stamped/signed/sealed/delivered and all that happy jazz and then be told "oh, sorry, nope, it's not legal after all. Ooopsie" ...

As screech said, a dual Canadian-Filipino national who had previously married in the Philippines would have had to lie to the Filipino authorities, stating that s/he was only a Canadian, thereby obtaining the second marriage certificate by fraud and knowingly committing bigamy.

Had the person declared that s/he was also Filipino-Canadian, the authorities would have required proof of no marriage in the Philippines. Upon seeing that the person had been previously married in the Philippines, the authorities would have refused to issue the marriage certificate on the basis that s/he was already married.


Soooooo, end of the day, the recognized and stamped/sealed marriage certificate would have been obtained by fraud.

It would be so much easier on my tired brain if the Philippines would just legalize divorce

 

[confused2014]

Thank you for the quick response, I really appreciate………..
And I also apologise for some missing link/information that I missed to post…..

These are the FACTs:

Ex-couple were both Filipinos
Migrated 2006
I don’t know with (EX) and my children’s Citizenship has been file or not . I’m not sure. I don’t know these information because we’ve been parted since 2009.
I was granted Canadian Citizenship (2011). not dual citizen
Divorce filed (2012) ….. by that time I was already Canadian Citizen.
Divorced by 2013. Divorce decree. custody.. etc. of whatever conditions (final order) 2013

Went back to manila to re-marry…..

With my Divorced Certificate and divorced decree. I assumed that is enough requirements to re-marry since I am already foreign national. I was thinking/planning to do anything that is legal to make this 2nd marriage possible. And don’t want to by-pass any Philippine law and make my life miserable at the end.

No.1
I went to Local Civil Registrar to inquire about the LEGAL requirements regarding my case. (FORMER Filipino, Was Married in Manila, Canadian, Divorced.) I asked them what do I need to do.. Do I need to go to court? or file annulment? So that I could apply for Marriage License. LCR told me that my divorce certificate is good enough, but I need to get the LEGAL CAPACITY TO MARRY from Canadian Embassy.

On the other note:
I think impossible for me to file annulment since I’m no longer Filipino, and most probably my EX and children is not living in Philippines anymore. I don’t know their whereabouts.

No.2
I went to Canadian Embassy in Makati, Apply for permit to marry. Requirements: Canadian passport, and if divorced , Divorced Certificate, Paid $CAD 50. Granted with Legal Capacity to marry.

No. 3.
Went back to LCR with the required permit, then I was been told to attend some seminars and that’s it.
Marriage License. Granted (was so Happy) I thought everything was alright and legal.

No.4
Wedding (done)

No.5
Request for MARRIAGE CERTIFICATE from NSO. That’s correct Sealed and Delivered.

And after all this said and done, we started to gather documents, passport, etc. Fill-outs some forms for CIC spousal and dependents VISA, Took Medical Exam. And I’m about to pay the sponsor fee and right to permanent resident fee of $CAD1300. ETC. ETC.
Until this forum crossed my way and started reading. And get confused. And hope that there might be the same case as my case out there. That will help me and guide me to this journey. I know this is not unique, it’s really complicated.

And so, if this scenario will not be favorable on my side. What do I need to do? Since 2nd marriage was done. If 2nd marriage is illegal or not valid, how is the Philippine Law can file a bigamy case against me? … Since I am foreign national. And for sure my ex-spouse is don’t care about it. What is the most possible way to get my spouse and children here in Canada?

 

[truesmile]

Well I was going to say earlier, your marriage license was issued in Philippines. And NOW, your marriage certificate has been issued by NSO ! ! I think you're good to go. If you're worried however, simply file a common-law application. It's not as complicated as you think.

 

[screech339]

From what I gather here, he stated that he is not dual. Sounds like he doesn't have Filipino citizenship. I think he is good to go then. No issues I see here.

Screech339