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PR card Expires before the 730 days required

Leon

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Jun 13, 2008
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You would not go to court, you would go to an interview with immigration. If you are unable to prove to immigration that you stayed 730 days, they can refuse to renew your PR card. If that happens, they may not believe the same 730 days for citizenship either. To try to avoid this interview in the first place, send all proof you have of you staying in Canada, especially a letter from your employer or university records, tax records, a history of doctors and dentist visits as well as bank and phone records. This is especially important if you have been travelling in and out. Also don't forget copies of all pages of your passport and a corresponding list of your travels that match. If you have many trips, order your CBSA information so you can make sure that your list matches theirs and send that along.
 

andyhuhero

Member
Jan 16, 2013
18
0
Hi Leon,
Thanks very much for your explainations. They are very helpful.
Here is my case,
I became a PR in July, 2006. I stayed in canada for about 15days. Then I came back to my hometown with my parents (i was under 22 years old at that time) to finish undergraduate study until June 2011. I arrived again in Canada in July 2011 because i decided to begin my new life here and i got a graduate school offer in canada as well (to my surprise, they let me in and didn't report. I thought i left too long time before i came to canada. Actually on my arrival day, they did tell me i left Canada too long. But they ultimately let me in without reporting anything which i really appreciated it).Then i studied in the graduate school in Canada until now and didn't go anywhere. Now i am facing renewing the PRC this year. According to your explaination, i decide to apply the renewal around September 2013. That means in the past 5 years, i stay in Canada for about 2 years and 2 months, definitely over 730 days.
But i still feel risky, because in the new requirements for PRC renewal, i have to submit the copies of all the pages of all my passports in the past 5 years. I changed my passport before i came back to canada in 2011. So it means i need to submit two passports. What i concern about is that the old passport has my landing date and leaving date in 2006, they could easily know that i didn't fulfill the residency obligation in the first five year though i fulfill the requirement in the recent 5 years. Would it affect my PRC renewal? Could i just submit the second passport and tell them i miss the first passport to avoid the risk? (I know it is really dishonest but i am so stressful right now because i spend nearly two years here without going anywhere to remain PR status.I am really afraid of losing it )Thanks very much!
Andy
 

Leon

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Jun 13, 2008
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andyhuhero said:
What i concern about is that the old passport has my landing date and leaving date in 2006, they could easily know that i didn't fulfill the residency obligation in the first five year though i fulfill the requirement in the recent 5 years. Would it affect my PRC renewal? Could i just submit the second passport and tell them i miss the first passport to avoid the risk? (I know it is really dishonest but i am so stressful right now because i spend nearly two years here without going anywhere to remain PR status.I am really afraid of losing it )Thanks very much!
Andy
If you look at the page 1 of this thread, message http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/pr-card-expires-before-the-730-days-required-t118357.0.html;msg1854232#msg1854232 you will see that immigration own rules forbid them from going back in time further than the last 5 years. If they did not report you when you arrived again after your long stay abroad, they missed their chance. When you apply to renew your PR card now, the only 5 year period they can consider is the past 5 years.
 
A

aasma

Guest
HI i need ur advice please. I am a PR since 2009 n have lived in canada for around 3 months in last 3 years n now planning to settle there from march 2013 still got 1.6 years left in my Residency status. i am lack of around 3.75 months in meeting PR obligation. very disturbed with the thought of getting caught by IO at airport.
wt should i reply if they ask me .
how many chances are that i get caught at airport for not meeting 730 days obligation.

thanks
 

Rahul7

Newbie
Oct 4, 2012
4
0
human53 said:
Hi Leon

I have been in and out of Canada for about 3 1/2 years since my landing in 2007. Currently, i am staying permanently since one year. I still need about 9 months to fulfill the required 730 days to renew my PR. Can I stay with my expired PR until I fulfill the 730 days ?. I have a valid passport and a valid Canadian driver license. In case that the best for me is to wait till I complete the 730 days, Will I be subject to question about my absence by the officials, on applying for renewal? And what should I prepare if this will be the situation ?. I really appreciate the help and advice you and the others are offering to the new immigrants
N.B. My family were staying in Canada during the periods of my absence.

thank you and have a good day.
 

DVR

Full Member
Feb 13, 2013
30
1
Hi Leon,

I have been reading your replies to all members. You are really helping them and doing a great job.
I also have a similar case with little difference. can you please help here?

My case:
=======

I am an existing PR card holder of Canada. When I did my landing in 2008, I did not find any job due to recession and hence I returned to UAE where I had my old job. As my job was going well here, we virtually dropped the idea of settling in Canada. Unfortunately, couple of months ago I lost my job here in UAE and hence I am rethinking to going back to Canada. I found that my PR card is getting expired in September 2013.

I have not met the 730 days requirement of staying in Canada. In fact, we just stayed there for initial 25 days and came back to UAE. Can you please answer the below questions?

1. If I still go to Canada, will there be any problem at the airport? I mean the immigration officer at the airport will allow entering? I read in the forum that officer may report it and we have to explain the case in a month. If we are not able to convince then, will they deport us or is there any penalty which we can pay and stay there for next 2 years to fulfill the requirement?

2. If I am allowed to enter then is it better to relocate once with entire family or I can go alone first, find home, schools etc. and then come back again and take the family together. My point here is that can I do multiple entries before September 2013?

3. Last one, as initially we had dropped the idea, I never did the PR application for my younger daughter (2.5 years) born here in UAE. So now she does not have PR card where rest of the family has it. How do I apply for her PR? If I apply then will the entire family's PR will be in jeopardy? is there any way to arrange any other visa for her and rest of the family has their PR and we all travel together and enter Canada? We are kind of prepared to stay nonstop 730+ days.

Appreciate your kind advice here to help me to take the right decision.

Many thanks in advance.

Regards,
DVR
 

smuktevi

Member
Oct 5, 2009
12
0
My status is almost same as reported by DVR as below. Leon and other experts, could you please comment on this which could help many of us in such a situation. DVR, do you have any updates?
 

zardoz

VIP Member
Feb 2, 2013
13,325
2,159
Canada
Category........
FAM
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
16-02-2013
VISA ISSUED...
31-07-2013
LANDED..........
09-11-2013
If you can't meet the residency obligation requirements you run the risk of being reported on every entry. So, if you get in without being reported, don't leave until you have the right number of days again. Also, don't make any attempt to remind CIC that you exist by, for example, trying to renew your PR card or sponsoring someone for PR.
 

nazia nadeem

Newbie
Jul 19, 2013
2
0
I have been in and out of Canada forPR card Expires before the 730 days required

I have been in and out of Canada for about 4 1/2 years since my landing in 2008. Currently, i am staying permanently since two months. I still need about 17 months to fulfill the required 730 days to renew my PR. Can I stay with my expired PR until I fulfill the 730 days ? I have a valid passport and a valid Canadian driver license. In case that the best for me is to wait till I complete the 730 days, Will I be subject to question about my absence by the officials, on applying for renewal? And what should I prepare if this will be the situation ?. I really appreciate the help and advice you and the others are offering to the new immigrants
one more question can i apply for renewal of pr card before the completion of 730 days.

thank you and have a good day.
 

canuck_in_uk

VIP Member
May 4, 2012
31,596
7,111
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
06/12
Re: I have been in and out of Canada forPR card Expires before the 730 days required

nazia nadeem said:
I have been in and out of Canada for about 4 1/2 years since my landing in 2008. Currently, i am staying permanently since two months. I still need about 17 months to fulfill the required 730 days to renew my PR. Can I stay with my expired PR until I fulfill the 730 days ? I have a valid passport and a valid Canadian driver license. In case that the best for me is to wait till I complete the 730 days, Will I be subject to question about my absence by the officials, on applying for renewal? And what should I prepare if this will be the situation ?. I really appreciate the help and advice you and the others are offering to the new immigrants
one more question can i apply for renewal of pr card before the completion of 730 days.

thank you and have a good day.
Yes, you can stay in Canada with your expired PR card and renew it once you meet the 730 days. That absence won't really matter once you satisfy the residency requirement, so they most likely won't question it.

Do not apply for renewal before the 730 days, as it will be denied unless you can prove strong H&C reasons for not meeting the residency requirement, ie taking care of dying parent
 

Sanket

Newbie
Jul 19, 2013
7
0
Hi;

I am Sanket currently in India. I received PR under skilled worker category in year 2011 Dec. I landed in Canada in May 2012 and stayed there for 3 months. during this period i completed all my formalities got a job in my field of expertise and served in that company for three months. Than i had to return to india for some family problems. In my PR card its mentioned that i can travel any number of times upto 2017 but i need to show a stay of 1070 days before i can renew my PR.

Fact is i cannot move back to canada before two years i.e 2015. then when i enter in canada would i face some difficulties at the time of immigration? if yes what proof should i carry and how to tackle this issue. also by the time my present PR card expires i wont have completed a stay of 1070 days in canada. what should i do in this case to renew my permanent residency and continue my stay in canada.

Hope to have a quick reply.
 

Msafiri

Champion Member
Nov 18, 2012
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Sanket said:
Hi;

I am Sanket currently in India. I received PR under skilled worker category in year 2011 Dec. I landed in Canada in May 2012 and stayed there for 3 months. during this period i completed all my formalities got a job in my field of expertise and served in that company for three months. Than i had to return to india for some family problems. In my PR card its mentioned that i can travel any number of times upto 2017 but i need to show a stay of 1070 days before i can renew my PR.

Fact is i cannot move back to canada before two years i.e 2015. then when i enter in canada would i face some difficulties at the time of immigration? if yes what proof should i carry and how to tackle this issue. also by the time my present PR card expires i wont have completed a stay of 1070 days in canada. what should i do in this case to renew my permanent residency and continue my stay in canada.

Hope to have a quick reply.
Between May 2012 and May 2017 you must have 730 days of physical presence in Canada to meet the Residence Obligation as per the current immigration legislation. As a new PR (landed less than 5 years) you are lucky that your RO review has a forward looking component i.e. you could in theory stay out for 3 years and stay in for the last 2 years or any other combination that will meet the 730 days criteria. At PR Card renewal time you will fill out a form and provide the required documentation as proof of presence in Canada. 2017 is some way away so nobody knows what CIC will want but the trend is to ask for employment related proof to include Notices of Tax Assessments. You need to keep a record of all your entries and exits from Canada.
 

Msafiri

Champion Member
Nov 18, 2012
2,667
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DVR said:
......
I am an existing PR card holder of Canada. When I did my landing in 2008, I did not find any job due to recession and hence I returned to UAE where I had my old job. As my job was going well here, we virtually dropped the idea of settling in Canada. Unfortunately, couple of months ago I lost my job here in UAE and hence I am rethinking to going back to Canada. I found that my PR card is getting expired in September 2013.

I have not met the 730 days requirement of staying in Canada. In fact, we just stayed there for initial 25 days and came back to UAE. Can you please answer the below questions?

1. If I still go to Canada, will there be any problem at the airport? I mean the immigration officer at the airport will allow entering? I read in the forum that officer may report it and we have to explain the case in a month. If we are not able to convince then, will they deport us or is there any penalty which we can pay and stay there for next 2 years to fulfill the requirement?

2. If I am allowed to enter then is it better to relocate once with entire family or I can go alone first, find home, schools etc. and then come back again and take the family together. My point here is that can I do multiple entries before September 2013?

3. Last one, as initially we had dropped the idea, I never did the PR application for my younger daughter (2.5 years) born here in UAE. So now she does not have PR card where rest of the family has it. How do I apply for her PR? If I apply then will the entire family's PR will be in jeopardy? is there any way to arrange any other visa for her and rest of the family has their PR and we all travel together and enter Canada? We are kind of prepared to stay nonstop 730+ days.

Appreciate your kind advice here to help me to take the right decision.

Many thanks in advance.

Regards,
DVR
1. Your chances of not being reported depend on how thorough the CBSA agent is on the day and if they decide to deal with you strictly in accordance with the law or to give you a break and let you off with a stern warning. If reported you have the right of appeal within 30 days but your chances of success IMHO is nil as your breach of the Residence Obligation is extensive and for a lifestyle reason. Many PRs live and work in Canada. If you get in without being reported hang tight for 2 years without any dealings with immigration so no sponsorship, PR Card renewals, travel outside Canada.

2. In your shoes I'd count my lucky stars with the one re-entry and no reporting and not chance leaving Canada for 730 days. What happens if you get reported at second re-entry? Or if you lose your PR Card while in UAE and have to apply for a TD?

3. You have a major problem. If your daughter is non visitor visa exempt she needs a Temporary Resident Visa (TRV) but she doesn't meet the eligibility as she is not intending to stay in Canada temporarily. She would need to get a Temporary Resident Permit (TRP). This requires you to submit a regular TRV application and clearly state in it you are applying for a TRP and that you intend to sponsor once you arrive in Canada. Linked to this however will be a review of your PR status and if you meet the RO which you clearly don't. In this case you have to go to Canada first and either meet the 730 days then sponsor your family again on the premise that one parent stays with the child in UAE or go first and let your spouse try for the TRP. This way one of you is safely on Canadian soil. Not sure how feasible the former is given the UAE need you out if you don't have a job.

4. If your daughter is visitor visa exempt then just travel to Canada and explain your situation to the CBSA agent but again this will likely bring attention to your RO breach. Several posters report that using self check automated entry gates currently available at airports in Toronto and Vancouver eases entry into Canada for PR Card holders that fail the RO. My understanding is that in this cases the declared date of leaving Canada may not always be truthful. There is a CBSA agent at the gate exit to collect your customs declaration card and he/she could decide your situation doesn't add up and refer you to Secondary where when the truth comes out you have misrepresentation issues.

Sorry but your PR was really for you to live in Canada. Its not some kind of glorified visitors visa to let you enter Canada at your whim and now you likely must face family separation.
 

zardoz

VIP Member
Feb 2, 2013
13,325
2,159
Canada
Category........
FAM
Visa Office......
London
App. Filed.......
16-02-2013
VISA ISSUED...
31-07-2013
LANDED..........
09-11-2013
Well said...