overstayed visa and want to leave and re enter

[helen123]

Hi there,
So was just wondering what the situation is with someone who went to Canada on a visa for one year in May 2010, then renewed it for a year bringing him to May 2012. He then missed the deadline to reapply to have visa extended and is now there the last 2 years with no visa. If he returns to ireland on vacation will he get back in to Canada again? Is there any way if he comes home and then applies all over again for a visa pretending he was not there illegally at all that he would get back in? Any idea what the penalties are?

 

[rhcohen2014]

there's really no way people on this forum can tell you for sure what will happen. it's always a case-by-case basis, and depends on the border agent you get. some people get lucky, and some people don't.

generally, if they know someone has been there illegally, they can deny entry if they feel there has been misrepresentation or there is risk for overstaying. at that point, the person would need to apply for authorization to return to canada, also known as an ARC. I believe the application fee for that is about $200-$250 CA.

it's never a good idea to lie to CBSA or CIC. That can cause further problems. It's always best to answer the questions that are asked, and not elaborate on answers. Most of the time, when it comes to overstays or whatnot, they already know the answer, and they are testing the person to see how they will respond.

 

[Regina]

If he returns to ireland on vacation will he get back in to Canada again?

He will be denied entrance. When he returns to Ireland he gets a stamp in his passport at POE in Europe, so when coming back to Canada at POE they will know how long he stayed in Canada. Besides they will suspect him right away that he stayed in Canada long enough to have to work without work permit for supporting himself all those years. So I suppose if he tries to enter Canada in such circumatances in best case scenario he will get a ban for 1-2 of years , in the worst case- for 3 (5)years.

 

[Msafiri]

He will be denied entrance. When he returns to Ireland he gets a stamp in his passport at POE in Europe, so when coming back to Canada at POE they will know how long he stayed in Canada. Besides they will suspect him right away that he stayed in Canada long enough to have to work without work permit for supporting himself all those years. So I suppose if he tries to enter Canada in such circumatances in best case scenario he will get a ban for 1-2 of years , in the worst case- for 3 (5)years.

1. On the presumption he/she is an Irish Citizen then under EU legislation no EU national is stamped in or out as per treaty rights on free movement when they travel to any other EU country so no stamps.

2. Even if there was an Irish entry stamp who is to say where he/she may have travelled from....for all CBSA know that stamp could have been from a trip to a 3rd country other than Canada.

 

[Ponga]

With the `Beyond the Border' program that was put into place (3 phase project), it's possible that we are being tracked as we enter AND/OR leave Canada or the US.

http://actionplan.gc.ca/en/page/bbg-tpf/beyond-border-action-plan

Particularly, this section:

Next Steps: To establish coordinated entry and exit systems at the common land border, we commit to develop a system to exchange biographical information on the entry of travellers, including citizens, permanent residents and third-country nationals, such that a record of entry into one country could be considered as a record of an exit from the other. Implementation will be phased in:

By September 30, 2012, we will begin implementation of a pilot project exchanging the data of third-country nationals, permanent residents of Canada and lawful permanent residents in the United States, at two to four automated common land border ports of entry;
By June 30, 2013, we will begin implementation of a program exchanging the data of third-country nationals, permanent residents of Canada and lawful permanent residents in the United States, at all automated common land border ports of entry; and
By June 30, 2014, we will expand the program to include the exchange of data on all travellers at all automated common land border ports of entry.

With respect to air travel, by June 30, 2014, Canada will develop a system to establish exit, similar to that in the United States, under which airlines will be required to submit their passenger manifest information on outbound international flights. Exploratory work will be conducted for future integration of entry and exit information systems for the marine and rail modes. Canada and the United States will share appropriate entry and exit information in these other modes in order to achieve our goals as set out in this action plan.

 

[rhcohen2014]

With the `Beyond the Border' program that was put into place (3 phase project), it's possible that we are being tracked as we enter AND/OR leave Canada or the US.

yep, we sure are! when i entered canada in March, i had this conversation with the border agent. He told me both countries now share entry information. Just add this to list of questions they already know the answer to!

 

[Regina]

On the presumption he/she is an Irish Citizen then under EU legislation no EU national

You are wrong. If you are a EU country citizen you may travel within EU without stamps but coming FROM non- EU country you get a stamp in you passport at the very first POE in Europe.

2. Even if there was an Irish entry stamp who is to say where he/she may have travelled from

He will have a stamp (or two) from EACH country where he was. So if there is only a stamp "Entered Canada in 2010" and then stamp "entered EU in 2014" there are NO questions that he was nowhere except Ireland-Canada-Ireland.

 

[Ponga]

yep, we sure are! when i entered canada in March, i had this conversation with the border agent. He told me both countries now share entry information. Just add this to list of questions they already know the answer to!

In the case of the OP, it's the EXIT information that is in question. Will CBSA know when s/he leaves Canada?

 

[rhcohen2014]

In the case of the OP, it's the EXIT information that is in question. Will CBSA know when s/he leaves Canada?

yes, this is what i meant by sharing information between US and Canada. I am always asked, "when was the last time you were in canada". I told them, then asked him how he would know. the agent confirmed they now share entry information. So if the OP left canada and went to the us, canada may know when he left (depending on when he left and if this was prior to or after the information sharing). if he left canada and went somewhere else, i would imagine they would only be able to tell by looking at any stamps in his passport. mind you, they can also have him in their system as suspected for overstay. we don't know the information they keep in their systems.

 

[Ponga]

I believe that is what phase III of the BTB program captures; Exit information (from Canada and/or The US) for ALL travelers, no matter their global destination.

So, I think they would (or will, as of next month) certainly know...even without a passport stamp.

 

[Regina]

Will CBSA know when s/he leaves Canada?

Canada does not care about exit. BUT when you come BACK to Canada CBSA WILL LOOK when you get to the next (previous) place . So if you get to Ireland on May 31 and do not have any other entry stamps in you passport except one Canadian from 2010 and EU in May 2014, that means you left Canada on May 31 or May 30(depends on time of departure and because of time zone difference)- that's all they need to know.

So there will be two stamps- entrance to Canada in May 2010 with a VISITOR VISA, entrance to EU in May 2014- that means you stayed in Canada from May 2010 to May 2014 on what? Visitor visa? And now in June 2014 you are at POE in Canada AGAIN going back to Canada "for a visit"? For another 4 years?

 

[Ponga]

It can't be based solely on a passport stamp.

What happens if a person loses their passport? The replacement passport arrives without any stamps, since it is, in essence, a new passport.

This person attempts to re-enter Canada, with their new passport.

Since there are no stamps in his/her passport, are you saying that CBSA would be clueless as to if/when they had overstayed previously in Canada?



If that were true, there would be a lot of `lost' passports.

 

[Regina]

It can't be based solely on a passport stamp.

It is. It is as CBCA works.

What happens if a person loses their passport? The replacement passport arrives without any stamps, since it is, in essence, a new passport.

Then his chances to enter are higher; HOWEVER, they will look into their systems and see him having entered Canada in 2010. They they will ask him about what he was doing in Ireland? Is he traveling to Canada on vacation? How long he is going to visit Canada? How much money he has? Where he is going to stay? Did he make some friends in Cnada in 2010? Could they look at his cell? What is phone number of his employer in Ireland? His friends in Canada? and so on.

Watch Border Security Canada or Border Control Australia on youtube. . There are some differences in some procedures in Australia and Canada but you could definitely see how Border Offers work.

 

[scylla]

It's definitely not based on passport stamps alone.

Several years ago (3?) my husband had to go to secondary and the CBSA agent was able to name all of his exits and entries into Canada within the last six month (we think he had access to more but only discussed the last six months with my husband). The travel during this six months include multiple entries and exits to Canada, trips to the US and several trips overseas. Some trips were by land - others by air. My husband obviously had no exit stamps since Canada doesn't do exit stamps and he also didn't have entry / exit stamps for most of his Canada / US travel. CBSA seemed to have no issues seeing all of them.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

You are wrong. If you are a EU country citizen you may travel within EU without stamps but coming FROM non- EU country you get a stamp in you passport at the very first POE in Europe.

This is not true. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passport_stamp#Schengen_Area

When travelling to/from a non-Schengen country (i.e. crossing the external borders of the Schengen Area), the rules on stamping travel documents are as follows:

Persons whose travel documents are not to be stamped

- EU, EEA and Swiss citizens exercising the right of freedom of movement
- Family members travelling with a residence card issued under Article 10 of Directive 2004/38/EC who are accompanying EU, EEA and Swiss
citizens exercising the right of freedom of movement
....

My British partner never receives a stamp when re-entering the UK, regardless of the origin country.