More than 181 days abroad within last 4 years: do I need to submit Criminal Record?

[sa592]

Hi.

I am filing now my Citizenship Application.

Looking at days calculators, I spent 230 days (more than 181 days) in China for business trips, visiting customers in several cities, within last 4 years: do I need to submit the Criminal Record for the time spent in China?

In each of the 4 years, I have never exceeded 6 months. In fact the max was in 2016 with 82 days. So in each calendar year I have NOT exceeded 181 days.

Can you kindly provide me your recommendation, as the citizenship application is not clear for me.

Thank you!
SA

 

[sa592]

Hi.

I am filing now my Citizenship Application.

Looking at days calculators, I spent 230 days (more than 181 days) in China for business trips, visiting customers in several cities, within last 4 years: do I need to submit the Criminal Record for the time spent in China?

In each of the 4 years, I have never exceeded 6 months. In fact the max was in 2016 with 82 days. So in each calendar year I have NOT exceeded 181 days.

Can you kindly provide me your recommendation, as the citizenship application is not clear for me.

Thank you!
SA

The reason I am worried is that virtually nobody knows which authority in China do release such a document, (Criminal Record) considered that I
- I am a foreigner (European)
- I stayed in hotels, I have not resided there. I do not have a stable address in China.
- China embassy in Canada is useless as they do not deal with criminal proofs nor they provide suggestions

 

[KRP]

The reason I am worried is that virtually nobody knows which authority in China do release such a document, (Criminal Record) considered that I
- I am a foreigner (European)
- I stayed in hotels, I have not resided there. I do not have a stable address in China.
- China embassy in Canada is useless as they do not deal with criminal proofs nor they provide suggestions

http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/china-chine/consular_services_consulaires/beijing-pekin/Canadian_Criminal_Record_Checks.aspx?lang=eng

 

[uncomfortable]

http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/china-chine/consular_services_consulaires/beijing-pekin/Canadian_Criminal_Record_Checks.aspx?lang=eng

This is not what the OP is looking for: the link provides information on how to get a Canadian Criminal Record Certificate to be submitted to Chinese authorities, while the OP is looking for a Chinese Certificate to be submitted to Canadian Authorities.

The only indications provided by the IRCC website are quite vague and do not provide specific advice. My feeling is that this will be a long, tedious and expensive undertaking, involving most likely an intermediary who will have to apply on your behalf in China.
I would suggest to find a lawyer/consultant normally dealing with Chinese administrative and bureaucratic issues: the Consulate/Embassy should have a list of names they can give you, and they really should know how this is done. Maybe try asking the same question multiple times to multiple people, maybe you will get different answers.

A quick research in Google reveals several agencies providing this service, and describing some situations when the certificate cannot be obtained. If that is the case, normally the requirement would be waived by IRCC.

Best of luck.

 

[zardoz]

Hi.

I am filing now my Citizenship Application.

Looking at days calculators, I spent 230 days (more than 181 days) in China for business trips, visiting customers in several cities, within last 4 years: do I need to submit the Criminal Record for the time spent in China?

In each of the 4 years, I have never exceeded 6 months. In fact the max was in 2016 with 82 days. So in each calendar year I have NOT exceeded 181 days.

Can you kindly provide me your recommendation, as the citizenship application is not clear for me.

Thank you!
SA

Yes, you do need to supply a PCC for China. Example 2 matches your circumstances. It is cumulative over the 4 year period, not per year. I have no idea where you are getting the 181 days number from...

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/application/application-forms-guides/guide-0002-application-canadian-citizenship-under-subsection-5-1-adults-18-years-older.html

Within the last 4 years, if you spent 183 days or more in another country (other than Canada), you must provide a police certificate. You must provide a police certificate for each country where you spent 183 days or more. If you cannot get a police certificate, tell us why.
Example 1
In the past 4 years, you took one (1) trip to France that lasted 200 days. You would answer “Yes” to the question and you would need to provide a police certificate from France.
Example 2
In the past 4 years, you took 10 trips to the United States of America (USA). Each trip lasted 3 weeks, for a total of 210 days. You would answer “Yes” to the question and you would need to provide a police certificate from the USA.
Example 3
In the past 4 years, you spent one year (365 days) working in Singapore. While working in Singapore, you took a trip to Malaysia (10 days) and Thailand (10 days). You would answer “Yes” to the question and you would need to provide a police certificate from Singapore. You would not need to provide police certificates from Malaysia or Thailand.
Example 4
In the past 4 years, you took one (1) trip to Europe where you visited Portugal (5 days), Spain (7 days), France (10 days), Belgium (3 days), Netherlands (3 days), Germany (21 days), Switzerland (7 days) and Italy (21 days). You took a second trip to Europe where you visited Ireland (14 days), Scotland (14 days) and England (21 days). You went to Germany for a business trip that lasted 60 days. The total time you were outside of Canada was 186 days but you were not in a single country for 183 days or more. You would answer “No” to the question and you would not need to provide police certificates from any of the countries.

 

[Vats]

What do you enter in 9.c in form if you live outside canada but not as crown servant?

 

[zardoz]

What do you enter in 9.c in form if you live outside canada but not as crown servant?

I answered "yes" but filled out the other form as "not applicable" and also provided a letter of explanation. See below...


Question #9. c) “During your eligibility period did you live outside of Canada”

Under the strict interpretation of Question 9. c) “During your eligibility period did you live outside of Canada”, the answer has to be Yes.

However, the required mandatory follow on from that response is to require the submission of Residence Outside Canada [Form CIT 0177].

This is not applicable in my application as neither Section A or Section B of CIT 01777 are relevant to me. I have therefore submitted the signed and dated form with neither section completed, in order to confirm that I am not requesting any exemption.

 

[sa592]

Dear Zardoz

If that is true, that would be terrible, as I certainly cannot afford to go back to China, on my own expenses, now, for the mere purpose of getting a police certificate, with the additional risk that no police authority will help me out. In fact any local Police office will surely argue and point out that I have NOT resided in their city, just in a hotel. Shall I go to Shanghai, where I have visited customers for around 40 days of my 210? Or to Beijing? Or to Hong Kong?

 

[zardoz]

Dear Zardoz

If that is true, that would be terrible, as I certainly cannot afford to go back to China, on my own expenses, now, for the mere purpose of getting a police certificate, with the additional risk that no police authority will help me out. In fact any local Police office will surely argue and point out that I have NOT resided in their city, just in a hotel. Shall I go to Shanghai, where I have visited customers for around 40 days of my 210? Or to Beijing? Or to Hong Kong?

Sorry, I can't tell you how to obtain a PCC. I can only point you at the documents that state that you are obligated to provide one.

Here is the link to the PCC procedure for the ROC, for those who are interested in this thread.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/application/medical-police/police-certificates/how/china.html

 

[sebbie]

You could wait until you have less than 183 days in the past 4 years before applying.

Or you could figure out how to get a criminal record.

a quick google for "criminal record from china" brought me here:

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/application/medical-police/police-certificates/how/china.html

Now I have no idea what this link is really about, but I read this:

"Different cities have different ways to apply and you should ask your local office how to apply. Most places in China will allow a representative to apply for a police certificate on your behalf"

So, maybe you can hire someone in China to get a criminal record on your behalf?

Good luck

 

[Vats]

I answered "yes" but filled out the other form as "not applicable" and also provided a letter of explanation. See below...


Question #9. c) “During your eligibility period did you live outside of Canada”

Under the strict interpretation of Question 9. c) “During your eligibility period did you live outside of Canada”, the answer has to be Yes.

However, the required mandatory follow on from that response is to require the submission of Residence Outside Canada [Form CIT 0177].

This is not applicable in my application as neither Section A or Section B of CIT 01777 are relevant to me. I have therefore submitted the signed and dated form with neither section completed, in order to confirm that I am not requesting any exemption.

Thanks