Living in Quebec

[bh]

Dear all,
I would appreciate if someone could answer this question.
I and my wife got permanent residence status in 2011. I had applied for the federal skilled workers program. We landed in Canada in June, 2011. To meet the residency obligation to retain the permanent residence status, I intend to move to Canada before June, 2014.
I had not applied through the Quebec-selected skilled workers program and did not go through the process of obtaining the CSQ from the Quebec government.
I do not necessarily want to settle in Quebec in the long term but I would like to live there for a couple of years as I might get a job there.
Can I apply for a job in Quebec as Canadian permanent resident?
Would staying in Quebec satisfy the residency requirement and would I receive the benefits of a permanent resident in the province of Quebec.
Thank you for your time and help.

 

[computergeek]

As permanent residents, you may live anywhere in Canada (there are some additional obligations for PNP candidates, but it doesn't sound like you fall into that category.) Even though you need a CSQ to land in Quebec, you do not need a CSQ to live there once you are a PR or Citizen of Canada, as freedom of movement within Canada is guaranteed by the Charter of Rights to both Citizens and PRs.

 

[bh]

Thank you for your reply. A potential problem is that if and when I move to Quebec, that would be the first time I would establish residence in Canada since our landing in 2011. We still do not have PR cards since we have never established residence so far. Would I be eligible to apply for PR card while residing in Quebec? Do you think the issue of CSQ might come up at that time?

 

[computergeek]

Thank you for your reply. A potential problem is that if and when I move to Quebec, that would be the first time I would establish residence in Canada since our landing in 2011. We still do not have PR cards since we have never established residence so far. Would I be eligible to apply for PR card while residing in Quebec? Do you think the issue of CSQ might come up at that time?

Unless you are visa exempt, you will need to have a PR Travel Document. However, you don't need a CAQ for a PR card - a CAQ is only required for landing, but you have already landed and thus may live anywhere in Canada. I realize this seems peculiar, but that is the nature of political solutions sometimes.

The application form is here: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/applications/prcard.asp

You will need to complete that and submit it to CPC-S once you are in Canada.

Note: even though your PR card will be good for five additional years, your PR residency obligation started the day that you landed. Thus, you must remain in Canada for at least 730 days before the fifth anniversary of your landing in Canada, or have sufficient time remaining that you can meet the PR residency obligation in that time period.

 

[bh]

Thank you for your reply, the link as well as the word of caution.
I appreciate your reply and respect your opinion regarding my question of settling in Quebec but I’m assuming that there is probably no official documentation anywhere (such as on CIC website or may be on other official websites such as settlement.org) as otherwise you would probably have added the link in your reply. I guess you can see that I’m fairly nervous of starting the process of settling in Quebec and eventually finding out that it is not working out, although I would have to say that the fact that the document check-list as part of application to obtain the PR card does not include the CSQ is certainly reassuring.
Regarding the residency obligation, we are acutely aware of the timeline. Now that you mentioned it, I can ask another related question here. We have visited Canada a couple of time after initial landing and spent a couple of weeks there and we intend to visit again. We are not sure, however, if the time we spend in Canada visiting every now and then could be eventually counted towards the final count of 1095 days to satisfy the residency obligation. The other thing is there is no documented evidence of as to how many days we spend in Canada every time we visit because, we have noted that, not all officers at the ports of entry and exit stamp the passport each time.
Regarding the PR travel document, we are not visa exempt. However, when we first landed in Ontario, the officer told us that we would be able to re-enter Canada without a PR travel document as long as we enter by road and using a personal vehicle. If one would arrive in Canada either by air or by road but through a commercial vehicle, one would have to have either a PR card or a travel document. This did turn out to be true as we drove to Canada twice after landing, once to Ontario and another time to Quebec and we were allowed to enter based on our landing document. I thought I would just mention it.

 

[computergeek]

I appreciate your reply and respect your opinion regarding my question of settling in Quebec but I'm assuming that there is probably no official documentation anywhere (such as on CIC website or may be on other official websites such as settlement.org) as otherwise you would probably have added the link in your reply.

Direct from the CIC website: Permanent residents have the right "To live, work or study anywhere in Canada." (Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/newcomers/about-pr.asp)

It just takes time to hunt down definitive citations to everything. This is something I know, having researched it.

Section 6 of the Charter is explicit here:

- Citizens have the absolute right of entry
- Citizens and PR have the right to live anywhere in Canada.

Charter of Rights: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/Const/page-15.html

I guess you can see that I'm fairly nervous of starting the process of settling in Quebec and eventually finding out that it is not working out, although I would have to say that the fact that the document check-list as part of application to obtain the PR card does not include the CSQ is certainly reassuring.

Well, nothing guarantees that you go to Quebec and then find out you don't like it. But you won't go to Quebec and then find out you cannot be there legally - that's not going to happen.

Regarding the residency obligation, we are acutely aware of the timeline. Now that you mentioned it, I can ask another related question here. We have visited Canada a couple of time after initial landing and spent a couple of weeks there and we intend to visit again. We are not sure, however, if the time we spend in Canada visiting every now and then could be eventually counted towards the final count of 1095 days to satisfy the residency obligation. The other thing is there is no documented evidence of as to how many days we spend in Canada every time we visit because, we have noted that, not all officers at the ports of entry and exit stamp the passport each time.

The residency obligation is two years in five. 1095 is the number of days in the past four years required for citizenship. Any time you spend in Canada, for whatever reason, counts towards the PR residency obligation. You have observed an important point: you will not be able to rely upon the CBSA to prove you were in Canada. It is your obligation to prove that you meet the residency obligation. CIC will not try to prove that you do not meet the residency obligation. Look at the PR card application and focus on the renewal section - you will have to provide them with a list of your absences. They have the right to ask you to prove that you have met the PR residency obligation. That is your obligation to prove, not theirs to disprove.

Regarding the PR travel document, we are not visa exempt. However, when we first landed in Ontario, the officer told us that we would be able to re-enter Canada without a PR travel document as long as we enter by road and using a personal vehicle. If one would arrive in Canada either by air or by road but through a commercial vehicle, one would have to have either a PR card or a travel document. This did turn out to be true as we drove to Canada twice after landing, once to Ontario and another time to Quebec and we were allowed to enter based on our landing document. I thought I would just mention it.

Yes, if you can get to a POE, all you need to do is show your executed COPR and your passport. This is covered in ENF 4 "Port of Entry Examinations" and I've quoted it many times on this forum. So, yes, you are right, you can drive into Canada in a private conveyance, but a commercial air carrier will insist that you must have a PR card. Technically, even someone from a non-visa-exempt country must show a PR card to travel, but I've never heard of anyone from the US (for example) being required to get a PRTD by the airline.

 

[bh]

Just wanted to say thank you. I have some more questions but would write later. Appreciate your time.

 

[bh]

As I mentioned earlier, we landed in June, 2011 and intend to move to Canada at the most by June, 2014 so that we have at least 730 days to satisfy the residency obligation. While I and my wife are planning to move together to Canada, there is a chance that she may not be able to because of job commitments. She would certainly be able to move by June, 2016 but that would likely be too late as there won’t be sufficient time remaining for her to meet the PR residency obligation.
If she does remain outside of Canada, would she be allowed to enter Canada between June 2014 and June 2016 to visit based on her landing permit. Could CBSA deny her entry to Canada during that time period arguing that because she would not have sufficient time remaining to meet the residency obligation, she won’t be eligible to enter Canada either while using her landing permit. In such a scenario, would she have to explore other options to visit Canada such as applying for temporary resident visa.

 

[Leon]

In order to fly to Canada, if your wife is not visa exempt, she will need a travel document. She will not get one if she doesn't meet the residency requirements. She could try for a US visa and enter by rental car or by foot at the US land border. She may get away with it or she may be reported on entry for not meeting the requirements. If that happens, she will be allowed to enter and given 30 days to appeal for her PR. If she doesn't appeal or loses, she will lose her PR. However, if you are in Canada and you meet your requirements, you can sponsor her for PR again. This can take anywhere from a few months to a couple of years depending which country you come from.

 

[bh]

Thank you for the reply. If she would want to visit Canada between June, 2014 and June, 2016 without using her landing document, I'm not sure if she could apply for temporary resident visa (TRV). I'm assuming that it would be unusual for Canadian visa office to issue TRV to her because although on one hand she would clearly not have enough time to satisfy the residency obligation but on the other hand would still have PR status (supposed to expire in June, 2016).

 

[cissino]

Quebec la Belle Province...

 

[Leon]

Thank you for the reply. If she would want to visit Canada between June, 2014 and June, 2016 without using her landing document, I'm not sure if she could apply for temporary resident visa (TRV). I'm assuming that it would be unusual for Canadian visa office to issue TRV to her because although on one hand she would clearly not have enough time to satisfy the residency obligation but on the other hand would still have PR status (supposed to expire in June, 2016).

They would not issue a TRV to a PR.

 

[computergeek]

They would not issue a TRV to a PR.

She has a valid PR card. Her best option is probably to fly to Canada prior to its expiration - the airline won't refuse her. The BSO may write up an A44(1) report on her, in which case they may investigate her further and issue a removal order. But, as a matter of law, she cannot be refused entry into Canada. From reading the reports of other people in this situation, a BSO often doesn't look at the residency obligation and allows the PR into Canada without further issue. If the BSO questions her, she can explain the circumstances - a BSO has the discretion to write up the report or to send her to secondary where they can issue the removal order on her, but the BSO can also let her come in with nothing, or even just a flag on her file (so the next time she enters she will face additional scrutiny.)

This might work - she has a spouse inside Canada who is in compliance and could thus re-sponsor her, so the most the BSO would be accomplishing is inconveniencing her, so a report might seem like it isn't strictly necessary.

But nothing is guaranteed here.

IF she enters Canada under such circumstances and is not given a removal order, she will need to remain in Canada until she is in compliance with the PR residency obligation. Until she has 730 days in the previous five years, she should not apply for a new PR card. Otherwise, it will trigger an examination and very likely lead to a removal order.

BSOs are in the situation where you are standing in front of them, with a line of people behind. They don't have a lot of time to do in-depth analysis. CPC-S (where PR card renewals are processed) just has paperwork. Thus, the BSO makes a rapid decision, often within 30 seconds. A CIC reviewer in Sydney - or a VO abroad - has quite a bit more time to look at these cases in-depth. Someone out of compliance does not benefit from the heightened scrutiny.