Legal for outland applicant to have extended stays, give birth, in Canada?

[adamdm]

Hey everyone

Background, "canada-immigration-discussion-board/advice-for-canada-citizen-sponsoring-pregnant-american-wife-t97008.0.html;msg1297218#msg1297218"

But here's a synopsis.

I'm a Canadian citizen by birth and resident of Toronto, my wife is an American citizen and resident of Boston. We are just about to send her sponsorship-immigration application package (outland) to Mississauga... Tomorrow finally (finally got my RevCan Option-C in the mail today, after only realizing last minute I needed it).

My wife is also (now) 16 weeks pregnant with her and my first child. It's hard enough being apart when she's pregnant. It would be INSANE to be apart with a newborn baby!!!!

Question: it is a fact that Americans can indeed spend up to 180 days at a time in Canada, and not just 180 days per year? I.E. Would it be legit for her to come here for 180 days, go back to US for a few days, and come again for 180 days, while the "Spouse Sponsorship - Outland" immigration application is being processed?
Would CIC consider it misrepresentation that even though we're starting the process with her Outland, she will be "visiting" here for most of the time of the application process?

[Note that she will maintain a legal address in Boston; Note too that she would NOT try to work illegally here] [Note also we are starting application process with her still actually living and working in US].

Question: is it technically okay for a visitor to give birth to a baby in Canada? Especially considering our marriage is real, and it's my baby too, and we will be playing by the rules (applying for her to get PR status)? I.E. She would come here in June; baby would be born in September, while my wife doesn't have status.
[Note: we already have a midwife lined up, which will be free if birth is "at home," but will cost $1000s if we got to hospital]

In June when she is 6 months pregnant I will be driving down to Boston to pick her up, bring her back up to Toronto, so we can be geographically together for the last trimester and for birth.
Should I be concerned about a border guard being suspicious about her, pregnant, coming up with me?

Should we be honest "she's planning to come for full six months allowable, and, planning on giving birth in Canada; Both look - we're married - and have started immigration sponsorship process! And we have a distinct reason for her not to overstay 6 months - - bringing the newborn to Boston for Christmas."
Would it help if we traveled not just with passports, but, our marriage certificate, and confirmation that CIC has our application? Possibly even letters from her family and mine that state "These new parents are planning on doing Christmas in the US, so 'she' doesn't overstay her visit."

If border guards gave her a hard time, maybe even turn her away, would word of that get to CIC, and compromise our application?


Should we, at that time, bring fewer of her belongings, and possible no baby things, to make it seem like she's not coming up for 6 months and to give birth? [Note: not lie if asked, but, be discrete, hope to fly under their radar and not get many questions asked of us].

After x-mass, we would be driving back to Toronto. Canadian husband, Canadian baby, and American wife without status. Would the border guards possibly give her a hard time, like "oh you're just living in Canada without status; not only will we not let you in, we're telling CIC what a trouble-maker you are!"?

Considering the baby could not be denied entry into Canada (it will be Canadian born), would they also deny the baby's mother / main food source?

Would it help if we had evidence of future travel plans to again not overstay a 6-month period? (while hoping/assuming her application would be accepted during the December-June 2013 window).


Last [Note] I have contacted my local MP, and tomorrow have a meeting with one their aides (a "case worker" who has dealt with "lots of immigration cases") to ask all of these questions, but, felt like asking all of you too.

Will update, because I'm sure some people may be interested in hearing.

 

[CharlieD10]

Why don't you apply for an extension of her visitor status when she comes to stay or if she is there already? Attach proof you have submitted the PR application, usually they are quite willing to extend visitor status on that basis. I don't recommend the whole border-crossing bit while she's obviously pregnant.

 

[scylla]

I agree with Charlie. Crossing the border when she is six months pregnant is risky.

 

[adamdm]

Thanks you two for your advice. Two problems:

One - it will be tricky for her to come here any sooner - - one reason it Inland, because she ins't here now, and can't come permanently sooner

Two - when she's here, it would suck for her to not be able to visit her family in Boston - - this is partly why we're not doing it "Inland," because she would be "stuck" here for two years

And a third problem/question: would CIC consider it misrepresentation for us to apply Outland with her really being here during most of the application process?
Are we already walking a fine line with our current plan / process?

 

[CharlieD10]

I can only answer the third for you: No, it is not misrepresentation for her to be processed via Buffalo while she's in Canada as a visitor, she retains the opportunity to have her application processed by the visa office responsible for persons of her nationality no matter where she is.

 

[canadianwoman]

She can come up to Canada and stay 6 months (unless they give her less time, which is unlikely). She can then apply to extend her stay. You can still apply outland while she is visiting you in Canada, and it is perfectly OK for her to give birth here as a visitor.
Bring your marriage certificate and proof you have submitted the forms when you cross the border. Americans with proof they are applying for PR are not usually turned away. She should be clear she is just visiting, though, and have proof of ties to the USA with her. Try to hide the fact she is pregnant, if possible.

Some forum members have been reporting that they have been able to get provincial health coverage while here waiting for the PR. It seems they had to ask several places, and no one was too clear about it, but they finally got it (some after the 3-month wait).

 

[adamdm]

She can come up to Canada and stay 6 months (unless they give her less time, which is unlikely). She can then apply to extend her stay. You can still apply outland while she is visiting you in Canada, and it is perfectly OK for her to give birth here as a visitor.
Bring your marriage certificate and proof you have submitted the forms when you cross the border. Americans with proof they are applying for PR are not usually turned away. She should be clear she is just visiting, though, and have proof of ties to the USA with her. Try to hide the fact she is pregnant, if possible.

Some forum members have been reporting that they have been able to get provincial health coverage while here waiting for the PR. It seems they had to ask several places, and no one was too clear about it, but they finally got it (some after the 3-month wait).

Thanks for you advice.

Re: Ties. Is it enough that all her direct family will still be in Boston? And that we would want to do Christmas / New Years with them?

Re: Apply for extended stay: would it make sense to do that even though we/she would be crossing back into US before 180 days is over, and coming back for another/new 180-day period? ...{I guess it COULD make sense, because it could guarantee (?) her the right to come into Canada again in December}...

Re: Hiding Pregnancy: We plan to be discrete and not announce it; but, if a border guard asks, we wouldn't lie. Would the main reason for wanting to hide it be that the border folks may assume a pregnant spouse will want to overstay 180s, vs. non-pregnant spouse would be less likely to overstay?
Couldn't telling them she's pregnant actually HELP our case, because it would show that she's un-likely to illegally work?

 

[scylla]

Re: Ties. Is it enough that all her direct family will still be in Boston? And that we would want to do Christmas / New Years with them?

Those aren't really ties from a border crossing perspective. Ties are typically stronger things like: property owned, bank accounts and other assets, apartment/home rental agreements, proof of business ownership, proof of employment, proof of school enrolment, immediate family staying behind (immediate family = children or husband/wife). Ties are things that demonstrate your home country is still the primary place you live. Having family (parents, siblings) just proves you want to go back for the occasional visit.

 

[OhCanadiana]

Thanks you two for your advice. Two problems:

One - it will be tricky for her to come here any sooner - - one reason it Inland, because she ins't here now, and can't come permanently sooner

Two - when she's here, it would suck for her to not be able to visit her family in Boston - - this is partly why we're not doing it "Inland," because she would be "stuck" here for two years

And a third problem/question: would CIC consider it misrepresentation for us to ap`ply Outland with her really being here during most of the application process?
Are we already walking a fine line with our current plan / process?

Thought I'd chime in to clarify that you don't have to be outside Canada to apply outland. If she were a temporary lawful resident of Canada (i.e., visitor) she could apply outland through Buffalo. See http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/offices/apply-where.asp under Canada.

It makes more sense for her to apply outland instead of inland because it takes a lot less time to process the application and, as you say, she retains the ability to travel. In addition, she would have the right to appeal (hopefully not necessary).

The potential issue you'll have with her going to visit you in Canada is that, by definition, to enter Canada as a visitor you need to show you intend the visit to be temporary and will head back 'home' outside Canada (ie, you are visiting and not living in Canada during your visit). Since you live there, I'm sure you see how they could argue at the border that she - and your baby - intends to stay with you. That's where the ties to the US become important (in addition to the ideas in scylla's post, consider return tickets and also google for more ideas depending on your situation - the US has similar requirements so there's lots of discussions out there). It's kind of a catch-22 situation and they could make her life difficult at the border (depending on the agent).

 

[backcountryguy]

In the same boat as OhCanadiana.

Met my wife while in states (Washington) on business. Married in Washington state this past February. She's expecting late August.
Plan is to keep her property in the states as a rental, but move up to the Yukon ( where I presently work ). Gave thought to her originally coming up on a skilled workers visa ( she has a master's degree, works as an ICU nurse and speaks French as well having gone to University in France). The intent of that visa though is not for immigration purposes although a friend of hers from the states ended up immigrating here by that route.

Getting advice from different sources supporting both the spousal sponsorship route and the skilled worker route for immigration.
her intent is to work in Canada as a nurse after her pregnancy. Skilled worker not likely an option right now as she won't be able to work immediately after our child is born.

Our big issue ( among others) is health care coverage for her in Canada. so long as she is working stateside, the hospital she works for covers her health insurance. She can take 12 weeks unpaid maternity leave in the states ( states being one of 4 countries in the world not having some form of paid maternity leave. Ghana, Haiti, and even the Congo do. crazy).


If our child is born in the states, it will be covered under her present health coverage, but even though our child is automatically a canadian citizen as well, it won't be covered by canadian health care for about 10 months. If it born in Canada, not a problem, covered right away. Thinking of having the child in Canada and we just pay for it. Question for health care is if she quits her job stateside to come to Canada, we have to find some other form of health care coverage for her during her stay. Unlikely she could get an extended leave from the hospital for maternity leave for health reasons and stay on the hospital's health coverage after the pregnancy so just looking for options . Blue Cross canada will only cover residents for extended coverage, blue cross travel insurance in the USA requires that you already have a form of primary health insurance.

Planning for her to apply 'outland' to matter how we go about it.

Ideally, it would be nice if we can apply outland and she can still travel back to see family on occasion if we can secure some type of health care coverage we can pay for while she is staying in Canada and waiting to get her application processe3d. Just looking for our family to be together and for her and our baby to be able to buy health insurance in the meantime.

 

[Bright_skies]

My friend was in this situation. They chose to have their baby in Canada but they paid for it (home birth with a midwife- it wasn't too expensive but if she had to go to the hospital in an emergency it would have been!). Her child was Canadian right away with the medical. When she wanted to get him an American passport she had to jump through A LOT of hoops, though these policies change often- this was 5 years ago. She had to prove that she had resided a certain amount of time in her life continuously (literally) in America before they gave her son citizenship. You could check the way they do it now. In that regard giving birth in Canada was harder than obtaining Canadian citizenship born abroad, though she herself had to remain without health insurance, a big factor.

In general if you are married with a child your spousal application would not be too complicated, I would wager a lot easier than skilled laborer in this situation.

Good luck!

 

[robrod]

My wife had planned and was looking forward to a natural, birthpool delivery at home (she's a Canadian citizen) through her midwife but ended up delivering earlier and at the hospital due to "complications", I guess you can call them. It would have been very expensive as both her and our baby-girl had to stay for a week without healthcare or insurance, that is for sure.
Both very healthy and conquered adversity in the end, thank goodness.