How is six months counted for visitors

[SMCANADAVISA]

Hi folks,

I have a question around calculation of duration for a visitor and would appreciate if any of you can provide guidance.

Lets suppose person X entered Canada on 28th April 2015 with a ten year multiple entry visitor visa. He is authorized to stay in Canada till 28th October 2015 which is six months from date of entry. Person X leaves Canada on 25th October 2015 to visit a relative in London, UK which is not his home country. He then comes back to Canada on 30th October, 2015 for re-entry.

My questions are :
1. When person X re enters Canada on 30th October, 2015 will that be counted as a new stay which means he can stay for another 6 months starting 30th October?
2. Does person X have to return to home country only or can go to any destination outside Canada to be considered for re-entry?

Thank you

 

[scylla]

1. New stay - but there's no guarantee the visitor will be given another six months.
2. He can go to any country. Note that whether someone is allowed back into Canada and for how long is entirely up to the CBSA officer. If the CBSA officer feels the person has been spending too much time in Canada and abusing visitor priviledges, the visitor may only be allowed into Canada for a short period of time or even refused entry.

 

[SMCANADAVISA]

1. New stay - but there's no guarantee the visitor will be given another six months.
2. He can go to any country. Note that whether someone is allowed back into Canada and for how long is entirely up to the CBSA officer. If the CBSA officer feels the person has been spending too much time in Canada and abusing visitor priviledges, the visitor may only be allowed into Canada for a short period of time or even refused entry.

Very helpful! Thank you Scylla.

 

[sokosan]

Must say I'm perplexed by this byzantine visitor's visa system...totally.

I totally understand that the border official can refuse you entry. This is completely legitimate. What I don't get is this power of the border official to determine your length of stay. That seems totally ridiculous. What is then the whole point of getting a visa, going through all the trouble of it, paying a fee, showing all supporting documents? When the border official can halve the time of your intended stay just if he thinks you're suspicious. I don't get it.

Compare thjs to the EU (Schengen) system: if you need a visa, it states exactly the maximum time you can stay. It states the first day on which you can enter and the last on which you must leave. The border official can refuse you entry (hardly ever happens in that case), but he cannot "modify" your visa at the airport.

If you don't need a visa: again, the border official can let you in, or not. Once you are in, the rules are perfectly clear: you have 90 days total within a given 180 day period.

 

[scylla]

Must say I'm perplexed by this byzantine visitor's visa system...totally.

It's actually not byzantine at all. It's a completely different construct which has both pros and cons (as does the Schegen).

The benefits of the Schengen are that you know you'll be able to enter the country for a fixed period of time (as you've said, this isn't determined at the border). The big downside is that there is no multiple year + multiple entry version of this visa (Schengen has multiple entry visas - but they are only valid for one year). So if you visit often (e.g. once a year) - this means applying for a separate visa each time you want to visit (I have a friend who rants about this on a regular basis). With the Canada/US approach, you can apply once and receive a 10 year, multiple entry visa which allows you to enter as a visitor for the next 10 years. Downside (of course) is that the length of your stay is determined at the boarder (although you're typically given six months by default).

 

[sokosan]

You have some points...ideally there would be some combination of the two i.e. a Schengen system with multiple year multiple entry visas.

What my experience is however is that Schengen visitor visas tended to be issued rather quickly (e.g. 7 days). Also, the Schengen area seems more quick to liberalize visa restrictions: for example, Serbian citizens have been able to travel visa-free for tourism since 2009, and after that many countries also removed the need for tourist visas (e.g. Japan, Brazil, if I remember well) but the UK, US, and Canada have not done so. (as a side benefit, unrelated, once you're on the schengen white list it's difficult to be removed, since 25+ countries must all agree to it, so one sympathetic country is enough to block a visa reintroduction, theoretically)

To me, it seems like the US and Canada are using the multiple-year visa system to avoid liberalizing the visa regime towards countries which need visas. I see the US motivation (post-9/11 paranoia) but can't really understand Canada's...

 

[scylla]

To me, it seems like the US and Canada are using the multiple-year visa system to avoid liberalizing the visa regime towards countries which need visas. I see the US motivation (post-9/11 paranoia) but can't really understand Canada's...

It's not a 9/11 thing. It's a refugee thing. Both Canada & the US tend to impose visas on countries where there is a higher incidence of refugee claimants.

 

[sokosan]

Btw, how is the date which you actually leave Canada as a visitor determined?

I don't remember ever having a proper passport control on a Canadian airport on departure...my grandma also had PR, and I never remember anyone checking her papers on leaving either - her absense (and thus whether she kept/lost he PR status) was determined based on what she put down on the customs declaration form when coming back.

When a person leaving with a tourist visa is actually leaving, where does the actual check of how long you staid take place?

 

[Jalex23]

Btw, how is the date which you actually leave Canada as a visitor determined?

I don't remember ever having a proper passport control on a Canadian airport on departure...my grandma also had PR, and I never remember anyone checking her papers on leaving either - her absense (and thus whether she kept/lost he PR status) was determined based on what she put down on the customs declaration form when coming back.

When a person leaving with a tourist visa is actually leaving, where does the actual check of how long you staid take place?

There is no check.

Whenever you leave there are manifests given by airlines, cruises, etc. to Canada Immigration. These manifests are then fed to the system. So Canada knows when you left, in which vessel and all relevant information of your departure.

Also if that was not enough several countries share in/out information so they can track who is leaving/entering their country.