Filmmaker who entered the US illegally and wants to apply for Canadian PR

[Ray1979]

longstory,

I'm really thankful for the help. I didn't mean to recriminate. In the process of making a point and finding common ground as co-earthlings it all becomes a battle of words and my personal wish (though it may be naive) is to live to help one another, regardless of nationalities, status, skin color, belief or language. We only live an average of 90 years on this earth, such a short time in the context of time itself, and yet we continue to pour our lives into hatred and separation. It's so sad and I don't wanna be a part of that. I know that feeling of anger and dissapointment when another human being refers to others as if they are less and with a sentiment of ownership. I've learned to look past that and be at peace with what surrounds me, though it may reject me. Again all I want is to make the best of the little time I have in this life. I understand you and I hope you don't think I'm being judgemental as I am very thankful for the time you've taken to speak your mind and offer me a helping hand.

 

[PommeDeRoute]

longstory, your argument makes no sense. You are saying that since North America was taken violently from the natives the laws of the "newcomers" need not be followed.

So I guess the laws of Italy need not be followed because of the Romans' treatment of the poor barbarians. According to your argument, if I follow, Italy should be considered somehow an illegitimate state because the empire were violently taken from the Germanic tribes. Why don't we all just go an set up camp illegally in Macedonia, too? After all, look at the appalling treatment of Alexander the Great of the Asians. You must also be an opponent of Sharia, because of how the Muslims violently conquered Spain, Central Asia and Mesopotamia. Surely for you, Sharia law is illegitimate for this reason. Or are you one of those who believes that we need to be tolerant of Sharia in the West in the name of cultural diversity? I would be willing to bet that I know the answers to these questions.

Part of what makes Canada a great country is that we have the right of freedom of speech. As for my criticisms, this is an open forum. People drop in. People drop out and intelligent people like you and I debate things and make their points. If people are offended by that well, that's life. There are people in this forum who are escaping countries where they can be jailed or worse for speaking freely. Try learning something about Canada before criticizing it.

 

[PMM]

Hi

Ray, If you build your case solid, you can refuge to Canada, if you have any grounds you can prove the return to your country will be devastating for your future, Canada may grant you status. Cannot be a mickey mouse story where the boogeyman will be waiting for you, you will be denied however if you simply will be telling the tribunal that Guatemala is just a bad place to raise children. Under the Geneva convention, Canada must hear anyone who claims political asylum. There may be other ways but this is an option available to you IF you really have grounds for political asylum.

Suggest you read the safe third country treaty between Canada and the US. If the OP applies for asylum in Canada, he will be returned to the US to make his claim there.

 

[ather4u]

Hi ray,

My name is Ather, I m filmmaker, I would love to read your script, please email me here
Ather.chaudhary@gmail.com!

Thx

 

[zardoz]

His last post in this thread was two and a half years ago... Ancient history now, I suspect.

 

[on-hold]

Having an illegal status in the U.S. is normally a civil misdemeanor. We don't call businesses that hire out-of-status people illegal businesses, managers that have unsafe workplace environments don't get labeled illegal managers, and banks that prey on people with unethical lending practices aren't illegal banks. It's time to stop choosing one category of people (who coincidentally are poor and largely unrepresented), and calling them illegal. It is insulting and demeaning, and I respect the original poster for not responding to the rude answers dismissing his life and hopes; I am not so polite.

I have no respect for the authoritarian who hears a man talk about how he struggled to get where he is, and what he hopes to do with his life, and then thinks: illegal parasite. It is probably simpler to go through life like that, never evaluating a man on who he is and what he's done, I imagine you save a lot of thought. You could also do it with credit reports -- just ask people for those, find out who defaulted here, went bankrupt there? Sure, they might be people who tried to raise families or write book or buy a house, but we shouldn't get to bogged down in that. Terrible crimes were committed by U.S. banks, by U.S. citizens, and those people are not in jail -- I would rather associate with ten thousand illegal immigrants who work in the fields, as artists, as car wash attendants, than let a sub-prime lender eat supper in my home.

In other words, I could not care less about a person's immigration status, and I despise people who reduce others to that single quantity. Ray, good for you, the world needs artists, writers, and nothing it can do will make you illegal. Good luck coming to Canada.

 

[YorkFactory]

It's time to stop choosing one category of people (who coincidentally are poor and largely unrepresented), and calling them illegal. It is insulting and demeaning, and I respect the original poster for not responding to the rude answers dismissing his life and hopes; I am not so polite.

The word "illegal" applies to the act of immigrating. Nobody is being called an illegal person.

 

[on-hold]

York Factory, I disagree, perhaps because I'm an American -- in the United States there is a large, organized group of people who consider illegal immigrants to be, in fact, illegal people who have put themselves beyond the pale.

 

[YorkFactory]

York Factory, I disagree, perhaps because I'm an American -- in the United States there is a large, organized group of people who consider illegal immigrants to be, in fact, illegal people who have put themselves beyond the pale.

That has nothing to do with being American. Those who immigrate illegally are illegal immigrants. Nobody is saying that they are somehow not legally people; it's just how you turn it into a noun phrase in English.

 

[on-hold]

York Factory, if you want to argue that my origin and society have nothing to do with how I understand words, that's your choice.

As for the term 'illegal immigrant', if it is a value-neutral phrase that is so simply understood, why are news organizations rejecting it and why is there a political fight about whether it is appropriate or not? Do all those experts in rhetoric and policy lack your simple understanding?

 

[YorkFactory]

York Factory, if you want to argue that my origin and society have nothing to do with how I understand words, that's your choice.

As for the term 'illegal immigrant', if it is a value-neutral phrase that is so simply understood, why are news organizations rejecting it and why is there a political fight about whether it is appropriate or not? Do all those experts in rhetoric and policy lack your simple understanding?

What is the most concise noun phrase describing someone who has immigrated illegally? Native speakers of English will recognize that it is, in fact, the phrase "illegal immigrant." (What is the most concise noun phrase describing who talks loudly? "Loud talker.") News organizations may be rejecting it for political purposes, but that doesn't mean it's not the preferred term in American English (or Canadian English).

 

[on-hold]

Or you might be preferring it for political purposes. Just like 'Negro' is more concise than 'African-Canadian', it's not prejudicial at all! It's a simple word that defines a simple concept.

 

[YorkFactory]

Or you might be preferring it for political purposes. Just like 'Negro' is more concise than 'African-Canadian', it's not prejudicial at all! It's a simple word that defines a simple concept.

"Illegal immigrant" is not any more prejudicial than "loud talker," as already discussed above. Ask yourself why you want to remove information about the immigration being illegal, and then it's pretty clear whose agenda various press outlets are pushing.

 

[on-hold]

Some possible reasons, all of which the use of the word ignores:

- illegal immigration is a single act, not an ongoing status.

- for example, we don't refer to someone who gets a ticket for speeding as an 'illegal driver' for the rest of their life

- in the United States, it is a misdemeanor. We don't refer to people who commit other misdemeanors as 'illegal'. I.e. an 'illegal taxpayer' (filed late) or an 'illegal student' (for children who are registered in the wrong district), or an 'illegal media consumer" (stole cable). Why is the adjective 'illegal' reserved for foreigners who commit a misdemeanor, usually because they want to work hard?

I respect people who want to work, and travel to find jobs that they can do well.

- many 'illegal immigrants' were brought here as children, their illegal status was not something that they chose or participated in. Right? Or are they illegal children? I don't respect people who search for pejorative adjectives to apply to people who have done nothing wrong.

- 'illegal immigrants', being out of status, work and pay taxes but do not receive many benefits from this. It would be far more accurate to find a term which recognizes this fact, which is ongoing, rather than obsessing about a single misdemeanor committed in the past. I think 'uncompensated workers' is a far better term.

Refusing to accept the term 'illegal immigrant' is one step towards acknowledging that there are communities that are smaller and larger than the nation state. A migrant who breaks the law at the border can become a valuable member of a small town; and there is a larger community of people that crosses borders and recognizes them as a legal entity but not the sole determinant of human dignity and existence.

This is one reason, maybe the prime reason, that the term is preferred by authoritarian absolutists.

 

[zardoz]

In Australia, the official term used by Immigration is "unlawful non-citizen". Hmm... Wonder how that translates to Canadian?