Application Refused but it is complete!! Now What?

[canadianwoman]

You could try taking it to the media. The newspaper in your town, or a bigger city nearby, may be interested in the story, and this sometimes gets the government to act.

As a side note, I saw an ad for new workers to help process applications, and the minimum qualification was grade 10! Considering how difficult it is to become a foreign service worker (a diplomat), I was astounded that the entry requirements for the people taking the first look at our documents was so low.

 

[wildemam]

Problem is, they will dismiss any "claims" you make about what was in the application package :/

 

[CdnandTrini]

Oh wow, that might be another story then. Hmm, there's got to be something that can be done here. Are any of those documents dated?

What you can possibly do is take photos of how it looked out of the package (showing the "missing" documents. Send it back, and if you end up with a procedural fairness letter over it, you can break out all your proof of what happened. You should have proof of the original delivery date, and it would be even better if any of those documents had a date from when you signed or printed them.

You can even go a bit "CSI" and look at your browser's history logs to show when you accessed the online account to print out the Notice of Assessment (if you did), you could get your boss to right an affidavit stating he wrote the letter on X date, and so on. There are probably lots of little things you can do to at least show some circumstantial evidence of this.

I'm not a lawyer, that's just what I would do since you can't get a hold of anyone.

Is it possible to contact a different MP that might actually know something?

Thanks Aquakitty. Yes some of the documents are dated and we got the package photocopied at the same place we sent the original courier (FedEx) package from. So we have the delivery receipt and the receipt for the number of pages we copied. I can also check the browser history log and take a photo of how the package was returned. However even all of these tactics could still technically have happened after the fact. As far as I can see the only way that we could prove anything now would be if CPC-M kept a copy and I do not think they do that when they return "unprocessed" packages. I imagine they do get a lot that are legitimately missing things and they are already overwhelmed and seemingly understaffed.

I have called Ahmed Hussen's local office directly and left a message and have also e-mailed his CIC Minister's office with details. One of the things that I think might work in our favour is that they said the receipt was missing- it was not of course, it was one of the items closest to the top of the package. But CIC has a system record at their end of when we paid online and they could have easily cross referenced that at their end with our names. So perhaps if someone just uses a bit of common sense they would at least be able to say it's highly likely these people are telling the truth so let's give them the benefit of the doubt.

I will wait a bit to see if I can get any assistance from Ahmed Hussen's office and if that does not work I will then resubmit the package with a cover letter outlining the sequence of events and cc it to the Prime Minister, Immigration Minister and/or see if I want/need to involve any press or at that point a lawyer.

 

[CdnandTrini]

Problem is, they will dismiss any "claims" you make about what was in the application package :/

You are correct, this will for sure be the path of least resistance for them and technically it is true, we have no way of definitively proving our case. So hopefully I will get some kind of sensible help or intervention of sorts from someone at the Minister's office. If it were not for the fact that there could be a problem with my stepson's age eligibility and the need for the delivery of the first package to be the official "lock-in" date, I would just bite the bullet and resubmit and let them think they were right, simply to keep the process moving.

 

[Landagirl]

also a good idea but i think it needs to start with, how many have complete applications that were returned?

Seems to be a lot are getting returned with this new process. Whether they are actually missing something or not.

 

[jeffporfirio1]

Seems to be a lot are getting returned with this new process. Whether they are actually missing something or not.

Suspicious, as it turns the burden of proof unto the applicant.

 

[danawhitaker]

Seems to be a lot are getting returned with this new process. Whether they are actually missing something or not.

At least that perception isn't just entirely in my imagination. I thought I'd been noticing this trend as well.

 

[canadianwoman]

They just hired a bunch of new people to help handle the paperwork. They appear to have had little to no training, and the job requirements were laughable. I also thought it seemed that a fair number of applications were being returned recently.

 

[CdnandTrini]

These are good suggestions, I have all my documents not only photocopied and dated but also scanned and saved in my computer.

CdnandTrini, will you be going to an MP? Glad to know nothing was lost though. Yes they work faster but it seems CPC agents quality are worse, maybe these are new hires?

Hi janangela, as per my reply to aquakitty: " I have called Ahmed Hussen's local office directly and left a message and have also e-mailed his CIC Minister's office with details. One of the things that I think might work in our favour is that they said the receipt was missing- it was not of course, it was one of the items closest to the top op the package. But CIC has a system record at their end of when we paid online and they could have easily cross referenced that at their end with our names. So perhaps if someone just uses a bit of common sense they would at least be able to say it's highly likely these people are telling the truth so let's give them the benefit of the doubt.

I will wait a bit to see if I can get any assistance from Ahmed Hussen's office and if that does not work I will then resubmit the package with a cover letter outlining the sequence of events and cc it to the Prime Minister, Immigration Minister and/or see if I want/need to involve any press or at that point a lawyer."

And as some of the other posters also seem to indicate, apparently there have been a batch of new hires. It would also be difficult for applicants to determine if there is any kind of trend and even if we somehow managed to draw attention to something like that CIC is pretty notorious for refusing to accept responsibility (for the most part).

And from my own experience and many of the other forum members the "helpline" is even more of a waste of time and taxpayer dollars.

 

[CdnandTrini]

You could try taking it to the media. The newspaper in your town, or a bigger city nearby, may be interested in the story, and this sometimes gets the government to act.

As a side note, I saw an ad for new workers to help process applications, and the minimum qualification was grade 10! Considering how difficult it is to become a foreign service worker (a diplomat), I was astounded that the entry requirements for the people taking the first look at our documents was so low.

Thanks for the reply CW. As mentioned in my reply to aquakitty, I will try the Minister's office first and simultaneously call around to some other MPs. I guess their hiring approach was a bit of a "warm body" tactic. Just throw some people in there to satisfy some bureaucratic quota and hope for the best. Unfortunately in many of my dealings with gov't departments both personally and professionally, the people who are very competent seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Sadly. And as my own side note, education does not always equate with competence .

 

[CdnandTrini]

Seems to be a lot are getting returned with this new process. Whether they are actually missing something or not.

Interesting observation Landagirl. I have not been on the forum very much recently so I do not really have a good sense of any trends. When I was waiting for my husband to be approved for PR (over 3 years ago) I was on constantly and read a lot of family threads and it is true, you can see certain patterns or trends emerging.

But as the poster jefffporfirio1 stated, seemingly the burden of proof would be/is on the applicant. And as far as I can see, there is no observed standard at CIC's end to resolve cases like this. In fact, I actually think there are many "mistakes" like this made on purpose specifically because applicants have no recourse. It would serve CIC by slowing down the flow of applicants and if they do not get logged on the system they cannot be counted in their stats as anything negative. And most of us know how little transparency and accountability exists to address these issues.

 

[CdnandTrini]

At least that perception isn't just entirely in my imagination. I thought I'd been noticing this trend as well.

Well this is some kind of "strange" comfort to know that it is not in my own imagination either. Now I may have to do some more research based on some of the replies I am getting. I will try to dig into their operating standards and see if I can find anything relevant or useful for this type of scenario.

 

[Aquakitty]

This is their "technique" for faster processing. Send half the apps back

 

[overseagal138]

I really hope you get good news. It's unbelievable how little care the agents have with our paperwork.....and lives.

I am not surprised after experiencing it myself. I submit my PR package and done up checklist and photocopy colors yet cic email me they did not receive certain docs, I submit online to them. They emailed receipt but shortly later said they did not receive. Really annoying.

 

[simpsol22]

Just learned of a new petition out there.....part of it mentions applications not being analyzed properly and administrative errors...thought I'd share.
https://petitions.parl.gc.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-836

Hope Hussen's office gets back to you soon and you hear good news.