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Accuracy of CBSA report ?

punk

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Feb 15, 2010
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Hello,
I was calculating # of days in Canada and got my CBSA report. I have around 25 entries in the last 5 years. I am wondering how accurate is this report ? Can I 100% rely on it or there might be a chance where they haven't logged in an entry ?
 

links18

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Feb 1, 2006
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Its generally accurate, but not necessarily complete--especially if you entered at small land crossings with the US prior to June 2014. But you know what--nobody will question it unless there is conflicting info somewhere.
 

MW2015

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I validated a lot of mine with travel itineraries and they were pretty close, wish I had it before I applied since after doing it and my RQ I believe I may be short some time.
 

bennyameh

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MW2015 said:
I validated a lot of mine with travel itineraries and they were pretty close, wish I had it before I applied since after doing it and my RQ I believe I may be short some time.
Will it be safe for me to apply for the record now before my application because of the information I saw below on CIC website

"If you are applying for Canadian Citizenship you do not need to request your Traveller History Report from the CBSA. Checking “Yes” on page 5, section D of your application form permits Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) to collect the report on your behalf".

Please advise
 

dpenabill

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Bottom-line: there is only one for-sure accurate and complete source of information regarding travel dates, the one-and-only individual who necessarily was there every time: the PR himself or herself.

Not sure why CIC (now IRCC) has not routinely advised PRs the importance of keeping track of, and records related to, traveling abroad. The importance of this can loom very large for many, definitely so for those who travel frequently and are likely to have difficulty reconstructing the precise date for each and every trip if they have not kept the equivalent of a travel log.

The CBSA records have long been highly accurate, but as links18 notes, not necessarily complete. They are increasingly complete, but again the one most reliable source is the individual himself or herself.

Current presence calculator instructs applicants to give approximate dates and to explicitly note that they are approximate, if the applicant is not able to specifically give the precise dates. My sense is that this will work so long as all trips are disclosed and number of days absent are at least very close to accurate, but that omissions, extensive approximations, or significant discrepancies, will likely be more or less problematic.


As to whether failure to declare a trip that is omitted in the CBSA report might be noticed: foremost, the obligation, the requirement, is to declare ALL trips, and now this includes all day trips. While the primary source against which IRCC checks is typically the CBSA travel history, there are increasing reports that IRCC is conducting broad-based internet searches for information about individuals. Typically referred to as "open source" information, it is apparent that in some cases (not routinely, is my guess, but in some cases) IRCC is looking at Canada411, LinkedIn, Facebook, employer websites, among other sources of information on the Internet. There have been cases where such information refers to this or that event or activity or position abroad which is inconsistent with the applicant's declaration of dates abroad.

Note too, even inconsistencies between apparent activity IN Canada during time declared to be abroad, can result in damaging one's credibility. One might think that would, at worst, indicate the applicant might have made a mistake and was actually in Canada more than declared. But where this comes up in published decisions, it tends to actually hurt the applicant. (Older case I can recall was where the school records for an applicant's children indicated attendance at school in Canada during a time the applicant reported herself and the children to be abroad, and this was a negative factor relied upon to justify denying citizenship.)


Overall: best to not underestimate how critically important it is to accurately AND completely report all travel abroad, and thus to not rely on any particular source, including CBSA travel history, in populating the physical presence declaration. Rather, do one's best to be sure, as sure as possible (if one did not keep an exact travel log) based on multiple sources, to accurately and completely report all trips.


(Check credit card records, for example, and emails referencing dates in or out of Canada, any records one might have which would indicate trips abroad.)

Other than mistakes in completing the forms generally, probably the single most common cause of problems in citizenship application processing, and perhaps the most common cause of serious problems, has been the inaccurate or incomplete disclosure of travel abroad.
 

links18

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bennyameh said:
Will it be safe for me to apply for the record now before my application because of the information I saw below on CIC website

"If you are applying for Canadian Citizenship you do not need to request your Traveller History Report from the CBSA. Checking “Yes” on page 5, section D of your application form permits Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) to collect the report on your behalf".

Please advise
Yes, it is safe for you to get your own record. Why wouldn't it be? Don't you want to know what data IRCC/CIC will have and how it compares to your own records? I don't know why IRCC/CIC tells applicants not to get their records as this could be setting them up for problems down the road if they do not match declared absences. I would think you would want to get your CBSA records and compare them to your own and if there are discrepancies try real hard to figure out which one is right. If there are discrepancies, most likely to be in the form of missed entries (or exits if you fall into the category according to which the US and Canada are already sharing data), you are probably going to to want to send a cover letter explaining that. IRCC/CIC do not mess around with missed trips. They may forgive a few days here or there in regards to entry/exit dates as long as you still have a buffer, but any indication of an undeclared trip is probably going to be a CIT-0520 at the least.
 

alphazip

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We ordered Canadian and U.S. entry records for my spouse before filing the application. Of 92 total entries (all by car...we live in a border city), 14 were missed by the CBSA Traveller Passage Report (entries by name), though 12 of those were captured (by licence plate number) by the Highway Passage Report. The U.S. report was complete and accurate. The citizenship officer didn't question any of the dates.

I don't understand why people choose to guess about their entry dates, when it is so easy (and free) to request entry data from Canadian and U.S. authorities.
 

links18

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alphazip said:
We ordered Canadian and U.S. entry records for my spouse before filing the application. Of 92 total entries (all by car...we live in a border city), 14 were missed by the CBSA Traveller Passage Report (entries by name), though 12 of those were captured (by licence plate number) by the Highway Passage Report. The U.S. report was complete and accurate.

I don't understand why people choose to guess about their entry dates, when it is so easy (and free) to request entry data from Canadian and U.S. authorities.
Well, one reason is IRCC/CIC tells you to estimate if you don't remember precise dates (don't under any circumstances listen to that) and then tells you not to bother getting your CBSA records, because they will get them on their own. I believe this is a way to reduce workload on CBSA's ATIP office, but it could be real problematic, because if you miss an entry and it looks like you didn't report a trip--IRCC/CIC will hold you accountable for it.

Another reason is that in recent history, it was taking months and months to get records from US CBP under FOIA, sometimes they didn't even send them at all. In fact, one official was quoted as saying this was because so many people were asking for their records for their Canadian citizenship applications. Processing times appear to have sped up (after they automated I-94 data), but you probably still won't get them within the time period you have to respond to CIC if they ask for them (this applied to US citizens who don't have to file an I-94).
 

alphazip

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links18 said:
Well, one reason is IRCC/CIC tells you to estimate if you don't remember precise dates (don't under any circumstances listen to that) and then tells you not to bother getting your CBSA records, because they will get them on their own. I believe this is a way to reduce workload on CBSA's ATIP office, but it could be real problematic, because if you miss an entry and it looks like you didn't report a trip--IRCC/CIC will hold you accountable for it.

Another reason is that in recent history, it was taking months and months to get records from US CBP under FOIA, sometimes they didn't even send them at all. In fact, one official was quoted as saying this was because so many people were asking for their records for their Canadian citizenship applications. Processing times appear to have sped up (after they automated I-94 data), but you probably still won't get them within the time period you have to respond to CIC if they ask for them (this applied to US citizens who don't have to file an I-94).
Yes, well, I would suggest that people ignore the suggestion that they not order their entry records, since they have a right to do so.

As to FOIA requests, yes, they promise them within a month, but rarely live up to that timeline. I have had a FOIA request take a month, and I've had others take 4 months. However, there have been many cases where people wait until they get an RQ to start gathering information. Why not be proactive? Request entries, request health records, etc., so, if an RQ is received, the applicant will be all set and not have to go past the deadline waiting for a FOIA request to be fulfilled.
 

links18

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alphazip said:
Yes, well, I would suggest that people ignore the suggestion that they not order their entry records, since they have a right to do so.

As to FOIA requests, yes, they promise them within a month, but rarely live up to that timeline. I have had a FOIA request take a month, and I've had others take 4 months. However, there have been many cases where people wait until they get an RQ to start gathering information. Why not be proactive? Request entries, request health records, etc., so, if an RQ is received, the applicant will be all set and not have to go past the deadline waiting for a FOIA request to be fulfilled.
I agree it is in an applicant's best interest to do this, but if every Canadian citizenship applicant did all that, it would probably strain the system's capacity some. Of course, that is not the applicant's fault.
 

alphazip

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links18 said:
I agree it is in an applicant's best interest to do this, but if every Canadian citizenship applicant did all that, it would probably strain the system's capacity some. Of course, that is not the applicant's fault.
True, but it would only be for those who travelled outside of Canada, and not everyone has. With 92 entries to track, I thought it made the most sense to order the reports in our case.
 

punk

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I have ordered the report both from US/Canada. US records is very inaccurate since it's missing 30% of my entries I believe. On Canadian side, it looks pretty decent but still I am not 100% sure so probably will get it double checked.

I have two entrance into Canada during a short span of time ( 30 days) and I am not sure for what, how and what date I exactly left for. Unable to recall any details so working hard on remembering it.
 

alphazip

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punk said:
I have ordered the report both from US/Canada. US records is very inaccurate since it's missing 30% of my entries I believe. On Canadian side, it looks pretty decent but still I am not 100% sure so probably will get it double checked.

I have two entrance into Canada during a short span of time ( 30 days) and I am not sure for what, how and what date I exactly left for. Unable to recall any details so working hard on remembering it.
Some people have reported that their U.S. I-94 records are incomplete. If you do a FOIA request, all the entries should be there. Of course, FOIA requests can take months to be completed.
 

dpenabill

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punk said:
I have ordered the report both from US/Canada. US records is very inaccurate since it's missing 30% of my entries I believe. On Canadian side, it looks pretty decent but still I am not 100% sure so probably will get it double checked.

I have two entrance into Canada during a short span of time ( 30 days) and I am not sure for what, how and what date I exactly left for. Unable to recall any details so working hard on remembering it.
Reminders:

There is a difference between inaccurate and incomplete.

As I understand these records, they do NOT purport to be complete. Thus, omissions are not instances of inaccuracy.

On the other hand, the applicant is required to accurately report ALL trips. The applicant's account needs to be both accurate and complete.

There is only one certain way to accomplish this: keep an exact record for oneself. Even though the respective records, from both sides of the border, are increasingly complete, the best source of this information is an exact record the PR has kept for himself or herself.

Yes, the more frequently a PR travels abroad, the more onerous the task of keeping a complete and accurate record. But the more frequently a PR travels abroad, the more important it is to submit a complete AND accurate account of all trips.

The U.S. and Canadian records are good resources for double-checking one's own records. Since they are highly accurate, they are particularly good for verifying precise dates. Since they are NOT necessarily complete, however, they should not be relied upon as the primary source of this information.

After all, there is only one person who will be held accountable for any errors or omissions. And that individual has no real excuse for any error or omission, since that individual was there each and every time the applicant crossed the border.
 

punk

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dpenabill said:
Reminders:

There is a difference between inaccurate and incomplete.

As I understand these records, they do NOT purport to be complete. Thus, omissions are not instances of inaccuracy.

On the other hand, the applicant is required to accurately report ALL trips. The applicant's account needs to be both accurate and complete.

There is only one certain way to accomplish this: keep an exact record for oneself. Even though the respective records, from both sides of the border, are increasingly complete, the best source of this information is an exact record the PR has kept for himself or herself.

Yes, the more frequently a PR travels abroad, the more onerous the task of keeping a complete and accurate record. But the more frequently a PR travels abroad, the more important it is to submit a complete AND accurate account of all trips.

The U.S. and Canadian records are good resources for double-checking one's own records. Since they are highly accurate, they are particularly good for verifying precise dates. Since they are NOT necessarily complete, however, they should not be relied upon as the primary source of this information.

After all, there is only one person who will be held accountable for any errors or omissions. And that individual has no real excuse for any error or omission, since that individual was there each and every time the applicant crossed the border.
Thanks for correcting my language. Certainly, it is incomplete, but I figured out that the dates it missed were due to change in passport. I found couple of more entries as well. It's not 100% complete, but much better than I assumed.

I agree that it's a PR responsibility to complete the record