Love without borders (DK to CA)

[canadianbagel]

Hello everyone,

I just want to say that I’ve read the sticky post called “spousal relationship” in this forum.

So I am a 24-year-old woman from Denmark who lives in Canada. I’m a Danish citizen. My boyfriend (fiancé) and I are as conjugal as can be, except we don’t have a common bank account. We live in the same tiny apartment, we sleep together, we cook together, we share clothes, all possible expenses, we buy each other gifts, we are monogamous, we have sexual relations, we want to marry. Everybody can confirm this. It’s been like that for more than a year.

I have stayed here with a visitor status that I had to extend a couple of times. The first time went smooth. The second time it was refused, and the letter said that I had to leave Canada immediately or the may force me. The reason, as I understand it, is that I have studied without permission. I thought that I was allowed to study for less than six months, so I enrolled in a intensive French program at McGill to increase my chances of getting a job in the future and because I really love French and I love Quebec. McGill wouldn’t let me enrol in a second program because my status would expire. I also took this as a sign that I was NOT in the wrong. I applied to extend my stay a bit ahead of time so I could continue my French, but after more than a month I got the refusal letter. Apparently, I am only allowed to study without a study permit for the first 6 months upon ENTRY. Oops.

I have enrolled in a program in Denmark starting in February, so I have to go back either way, even though i consider Canada my home. Furthermore, I need to be able to work and make money again. A month ago, I couldn’t imagine leaving my bf and I’m still crying my eyes out every day. However, a friend was worried that the fact that I have overstayed may give me problems in the future when I want to come back. An immigration lawyer said the same thing, that I have to restore my status before the 90 days expire, even though I plan on leaving in the beginning of January. Even though she wouldn’t really say a lot if I didn’t pay the initial fee. I have exhausted my resources, stupidly spending money on books, McGill and my bf has also been spending money on useless things. I also don’t know if I can use a Canadian lawyer if I play to apply out-land, or whatever you call it. I plan schooling in Denmark for the next year or so, so I will have to stay there most of the times. On the other hand, I am afraid to make any more mistakes. During this whole time, I haven’t talked to anyone who knows anything about any of this, and I just feel like I want somebody to hold my hand from now on, both when it comes to restoration of my status and application for permanent residency.

I honestly feel like booking an appointment with the lawyer (who has good reviews), grabbing my bf and just running to the office. Maybe we can share the costs, and he can keep in more close touch with the lawyer when I’m outside Canada if needed? There is still a month or so left to do some work, and I didn’t buy the ticket yet. My parents are begging me to let them help with money.

Or should I rather get a lawyer in Denmark?

Do I even need to restore my status before I leave if I leave within those 90 days?

Do you think I have a good chance of getting permanent residency based on this info? Anything else you wanna mention that could help?

Lastly, of course it doesn’t matter to me. But my boyfriend, who is a born-in-Quebec francophone Canadian citizen with french/czech roots, is 30 years older than me. Which is also why I am in such a hurry because we want to get our things together and have children!! Could that mean that I will be called for an interview out of disbelief?


Suggestions are greatly appreciated!

 

[scylla]

Hello everyone,

I just want to say that I’ve read the sticky post called “spousal relationship” in this forum.

So I am a 24-year-old woman from Denmark who lives in Canada. I’m a Danish citizen. My boyfriend (fiancé) and I are as conjugal as can be, except we don’t have a common bank account. We live in the same tiny apartment, we sleep together, we cook together, we share clothes, all possible expenses, we buy each other gifts, we are monogamous, we have sexual relations, we want to marry. Everybody can confirm this. It’s been like that for more than a year.

I have stayed here with a visitor status that I had to extend a couple of times. The first time went smooth. The second time it was refused, and the letter said that I had to leave Canada immediately or the may force me. The reason, as I understand it, is that I have studied without permission. I thought that I was allowed to study for less than six months, so I enrolled in a intensive French program at McGill to increase my chances of getting a job in the future and because I really love French and I love Quebec. McGill wouldn’t let me enrol in a second program because my status would expire. I also took this as a sign that I was NOT in the wrong. I applied to extend my stay a bit ahead of time so I could continue my French, but after more than a month I got the refusal letter. Apparently, I am only allowed to study without a study permit for the first 6 months upon ENTRY. Oops.

I have enrolled in a program in Denmark starting in February, so I have to go back either way, even though i consider Canada my home. Furthermore, I need to be able to work and make money again. A month ago, I couldn’t imagine leaving my bf and I’m still crying my eyes out every day. However, a friend was worried that the fact that I have overstayed may give me problems in the future when I want to come back. An immigration lawyer said the same thing, that I have to restore my status before the 90 days expire, even though I plan on leaving in the beginning of January. Even though she wouldn’t really say a lot if I didn’t pay the initial fee. I have exhausted my resources, stupidly spending money on books, McGill and my bf has also been spending money on useless things. I also don’t know if I can use a Canadian lawyer if I play to apply out-land, or whatever you call it. I plan schooling in Denmark for the next year or so, so I will have to stay there most of the times. On the other hand, I am afraid to make any more mistakes. During this whole time, I haven’t talked to anyone who knows anything about any of this, and I just feel like I want somebody to hold my hand from now on, both when it comes to restoration of my status and application for permanent residency.

I honestly feel like booking an appointment with the lawyer (who has good reviews), grabbing my bf and just running to the office. Maybe we can share the costs, and he can keep in more close touch with the lawyer when I’m outside Canada if needed? There is still a month or so left to do some work, and I didn’t buy the ticket yet. My parents are begging me to let them help with money.

Or should I rather get a lawyer in Denmark?

Do I even need to restore my status before I leave if I leave within those 90 days?

Do you think I have a good chance of getting permanent residency based on this info? Anything else you wanna mention that could help?

Lastly, of course it doesn’t matter to me. But my boyfriend, who is a born-in-Quebec francophone Canadian citizen with french/czech roots, is 30 years older than me. Which is also why I am in such a hurry because we want to get our things together and have children!! Could that mean that I will be called for an interview out of disbelief?


Suggestions are greatly appreciated!

Only a lawyer will hold your hand. If you want to hire a lawyer, pick a good one and be prepared to spend several thousand dollars for advice.

You can get advice here too for free. But we aren't going to hold your hand. You will need to dedicate time yourself to researching and understanding Canada's immigration programs and rules. It's your responsibility to know them as a visitor in Canada. IRCC does not accept ignorance of the rules as an excuse.

A few answers:
- If you aren't going to restore your status, you really need to leave Canada within 30 days of receiving the refusal. It's very unlikely that restoration will be approved based on the information you've provided. I would not apply to restore your status. I would very strongly recommend that you leave within 30 days of being refused. If you stay longer, this will complicate future entries into Canada since it will demonstrate that you don't follow / respect Canadian immigration law.
- If you and your boyfriend have been living together for a year or more, then you are common law (not conjugal).
- Note that you and your boyfriend must either be married or common law in order for him to be able to sponsor you for PR.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

I have stayed here with a visitor status that I had to extend a couple of times. The first time went smooth. The second time it was refused, and the letter said that I had to leave Canada immediately or the may force me. The reason, as I understand it, is that I have studied without permission. I thought that I was allowed to study for less than six months, so I enrolled in a intensive French program at McGill to increase my chances of getting a job in the future and because I really love French and I love Quebec. McGill wouldn’t let me enrol in a second program because my status would expire. I also took this as a sign that I was NOT in the wrong. I applied to extend my stay a bit ahead of time so I could continue my French, but after more than a month I got the refusal letter. Apparently, I am only allowed to study without a study permit for the first 6 months upon ENTRY. Oops.

Were the courses you took part of a program longer than 6 months, i.e. the first semester of a 1 year program or certification?

However, a friend was worried that the fact that I have overstayed may give me problems in the future when I want to come back. An immigration lawyer said the same thing, that I have to restore my status before the 90 days expire, even though I plan on leaving in the beginning of January. Even though she wouldn’t really say a lot if I didn’t pay the initial fee. I have exhausted my resources, stupidly spending money on books, McGill and my bf has also been spending money on useless things. I also don’t know if I can use a Canadian lawyer if I play to apply out-land, or whatever you call it. I plan schooling in Denmark for the next year or so, so I will have to stay there most of the times. On the other hand, I am afraid to make any more mistakes. During this whole time, I haven’t talked to anyone who knows anything about any of this, and I just feel like I want somebody to hold my hand from now on, both when it comes to restoration of my status and application for permanent residency.

The overstay will not affect a sponsorship app, as long as you fully declare it. Depending on how long you overstay, it could affect a future visit while you are waiting for PR.

I honestly feel like booking an appointment with the lawyer (who has good reviews), grabbing my bf and just running to the office. Maybe we can share the costs, and he can keep in more close touch with the lawyer when I’m outside Canada if needed? There is still a month or so left to do some work, and I didn’t buy the ticket yet. My parents are begging me to let them help with money.

Or should I rather get a lawyer in Denmark?

No need for a lawyer in either country.

Do I even need to restore my status before I leave if I leave within those 90 days?

As said above, Restoration likely has a low chance of approval. You really should leave within 30 days.

Lastly, of course it doesn’t matter to me. But my boyfriend, who is a born-in-Quebec francophone Canadian citizen with french/czech roots, is 30 years older than me. Which is also why I am in such a hurry because we want to get our things together and have children!! Could that mean that I will be called for an interview out of disbelief?

That's a big difference. You should ensure you address this in your app and why it isn't an issue for you guys.

 

[Jets13]

Just to add though you studying might have been a reason for refusal another could be that you stated you live in Canada. You are not allowed to live in Canada on a VISITOR status......if you are deemed not to be a genuine visitor (which you are not as you admit to living here) then you can be refused a visitor extension.

Also it is not 100% necessary to have a lawyer to fill the PR application, you seem to have decent command of the English language and would be able to fill the forms out yourself by just reading the instruction guides they provide. Having said that if your bf is 30 years older a lawyer could help you with organizing/preparing all the documents that you would require to prove the genuineness of your relationship/marriage.

Make sure you have ample proof of your relationship. Also are you planning on having a big wedding with family and friends involved or court marriage?

 

[canadianbagel]

Only a lawyer will hold your hand. If you want to hire a lawyer, pick a good one and be prepared to spend several thousand dollars for advice.

You can get advice here too for free. But we aren't going to hold your hand. You will need to dedicate time yourself to researching and understanding Canada's immigration programs and rules. It's your responsibility to know them as a visitor in Canada. IRCC does not accept ignorance of the rules as an excuse.

A few answers:
- If you aren't going to restore your status, you really need to leave Canada within 30 days of receiving the refusal. It's very unlikely that restoration will be approved based on the information you've provided. I would not apply to restore your status. I would very strongly recommend that you leave within 30 days of being refused. If you stay longer, this will complicate future entries into Canada since it will demonstrate that you don't follow / respect Canadian immigration law.
- If you and your boyfriend have been living together for a year or more, then you are common law (not conjugal).
- Note that you and your boyfriend must either be married or common law in order for him to be able to sponsor you for PR.

Thanks for your answer.
I read the requirements for studying several times and nowhere was it clear that the studying within the first 6 months had to be within the first 6 months of entry and not within 6 consecutive months of my time being here legally.. It was not the only one who misunderstood this completely. My father used the website of CIC to convince me that it was within the laws and that I should "do something with my time". Of course I shouldn't have listened to this and it is my own fault that I didn't know about any way of contacting IRCC (their line was always busy, even when I called in the minute they opened).
The first time I applied for an extension, I used the need to live together for a year in order to become common-law as a main reason. I also said things like that I wanted to stay here forever. It was approved. So it is hard for me to believe that they would not restore my status because they are afraid that I would stay here long-term, since I have been very honest from the beginning that this was my plan. Unless they think that now when I have stayed here for a year, I should go home and THEN apply for permanent residence.. Would you tell me why it is unlikely? Because of my ignorance regarding the limits of studying?

I will likely do as you recommend. That is, scan the necessary things I need to scan in order to make the application. And then, leave.
Would it, though, be a problem to go to a physical immigration office in my city and talk to them? Would they simply deport me?
I'm asking because the person at the consulat told me that they are not gonna stamp my passport when I leave, so I DO need to tell them that I left somehow, right?

I understand that we are common law. This is one of the reasons why I have been living here for a year. I did not sacrifice one year of being unable to do anything with my life just to be with him in the now...

 

[scylla]

Thanks for your answer.
I read the requirements for studying several times and nowhere was it clear that the studying within the first 6 months had to be within the first 6 months of entry and not within 6 consecutive months of my time being here legally.. It was not the only one who misunderstood this completely. My father used the website of CIC to convince me that it was within the laws and that I should "do something with my time". Of course I shouldn't have listened to this and it is my own fault that I didn't know about any way of contacting IRCC (their line was always busy, even when I called in the minute they opened).
The first time I applied for an extension, I used the need to live together for a year in order to become common-law as a main reason. I also said things like that I wanted to stay here forever. It was approved. So it is hard for me to believe that they would not restore my status because they are afraid that I would stay here long-term, since I have been very honest from the beginning that this was my plan. Unless they think that now when I have stayed here for a year, I should go home and THEN apply for permanent residence.. Would you tell me why it is unlikely? Because of my ignorance regarding the limits of studying?

I will likely do as you recommend. That is, scan the necessary things I need to scan in order to make the application. And then, leave.
Would it, though, be a problem to go to a physical immigration office in my city and talk to them? Would they simply deport me?
I'm asking because the person at the consulat told me that they are not gonna stamp my passport when I leave, so I DO need to tell them that I left somehow, right?

I understand that we are common law. This is one of the reasons why I have been living here for a year. I did not sacrifice one year of being unable to do anything with my life just to be with him in the now...

- Yes, restoration is less likely to be approved because of the issue regarding rules for studying. Once an extension is refused, it's typically best to leave Canada (the refusal is IRCC's way of telling you it's time to leave Canada). You're out of status in Canada now. Technically you can apply for PR (by being sponsored by your common law partner). However since you are in Canada without status, you won't benefit from the open work permit pilot and IRCC could at some point decide to remove you. Obviously up to you, however I would leave since you were planning on leaving anyway.
- It won't be possible to go to a physical immigration office in your city to talk to them. They don't offer advice and you won't be able to get into the building. If you need advice, then you'll need to hire an immigration lawyer.
- No, you don't need to tell them that you have left.

 

[canadianbagel]

Were the courses you took part of a program longer than 6 months, i.e. the first semester of a 1 year program or certification?

That would depend on what you register for. I did not apply officially, since it was past the deadline. I just registered as an independent student and paid the international student fee for one six week long course. Yes, you can take four more such courses and earn a certificate, but half of my class did not do that. It is only an option. And McGill wouldn't let me because my status would expire. From all the conversation I had with them, via email and face-to-face, it was clear that they had a legal obligation (they said this many times), did not wish trouble with IRCC, and believed that what I was doing was legal.
When I applied for my second extension, I did so with the hope that I could continue with the third course in the row (I started with the 2nd). I told IRCC this. That would still be within 6 consecutive months with only one week's vacation. My plan was to apply for a study permit for the next semester. I did not think that they would assume anything else. Of course I wanted to follow the rules. I did not think that I was breaking the rules, neither did anyone else.

The overstay will not affect a sponsorship app, as long as you fully declare it. Depending on how long you overstay, it could affect a future visit while you are waiting for PR.

Thank you. Very useful.

No need for a lawyer in either country.

Ok. That is what I needed to hear.

As said above, Restoration likely has a low chance of approval. You really should leave within 30 days.

Ok.

That's a big difference. You should ensure you address this in your app and why it isn't an issue for you guys.

Ok. Very useful too. Even though I don't know what to say except... why on earth would it be?

 

[canadianbagel]

Just to add though you studying might have been a reason for refusal another could be that you stated you live in Canada. You are not allowed to live in Canada on a VISITOR status......if you are deemed not to be a genuine visitor (which you are not as you admit to living here) then you can be refused a visitor extension.

Also it is not 100% necessary to have a lawyer to fill the PR application, you seem to have decent command of the English language and would be able to fill the forms out yourself by just reading the instruction guides they provide. Having said that if your bf is 30 years older a lawyer could help you with organizing/preparing all the documents that you would require to prove the genuineness of your relationship/marriage.

Make sure you have ample proof of your relationship. Also are you planning on having a big wedding with family and friends involved or court marriage?

I also stated that I lived in Canada in my first application, which was approved. I thought that since there was an option to apply from within Canada, that would mean that it is ok to live here. Living here meaning that my postal address is here and that this is where i physically reside. Maybe I don't have a good command of the English language after all...

I do not care much where I am for the next year. What matters is the future. So all this is good news to me.

We will likely have a small family wedding. I don't know where, though. Would it be a good idea to marry while I wait for my permanent residency?

Thanks for your reply.

 

[canadianbagel]

If it isn't legal to live here on a visitor record...... how can we be common law? Our only basis for being common law is precisely that I have lived here for a year, no?
These small ambiguities are why I was trying to establish how close we really are... as a backup.

 

[canadianbagel]

- Yes, restoration is less likely to be approved because of the issue regarding rules for studying. Once an extension is refused, it's typically best to leave Canada (the refusal is IRCC's way of telling you it's time to leave Canada). You're out of status in Canada now. Technically you can apply for PR (by being sponsored by your common law partner). However since you are in Canada without status, you won't benefit from the open work permit pilot and IRCC could at some point decide to remove you. Obviously up to you, however I would leave since you were planning on leaving anyway.
- It won't be possible to go to a physical immigration office in your city to talk to them. They don't offer advice and you won't be able to get into the building. If you need advice, then you'll need to hire an immigration lawyer.
- No, you don't need to tell them that you have left.

Super. Thank you! I understand from the IRCC website that if I plan to live outside of Canada while the permanent resident application is being processed, I should apply in the same category as if I was already living outside of Canada. If I leave within these 30 days, would it be a problem to begin the process (make my bf apply as a sponsor) a couple of days before I get on the plane, let's say?

 

[canadianbagel]

I have a small clarification to make. It says on the website:

People who don’t need a permit to study in Canada
Most foreign nationals need a study permit to study in Canada. The cases below are exceptions.

Short-term studies (six months or less)
You can study at any school in Canada without a study permit if:

• your course or program is for six months or less
• your studies aren’t part of a longer program and
• you will complete all your studies within the time we approved you to stay in Canada (usually six months after you enter).

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigratio...es/study-canada/study-permit/eligibility.html

And my letter:

This letter refers to your application for a Visitor Record.

Based on your application and accompanying documentation that you have provided, I have carefully considered all information and I am not satisfied that you meet the requirements of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act and Regulations. Your application as requested is therefore refused.

[X] A foreign national is authorized to study in Canada without a study permit if the program of study will be completed within the period of stay authorized upon entry into Canada and the duration of the program is six months or less. An application to obtain a study permit to further pursue a program of study must be made outside Canada.

[X] You are a person in Canada without legal status and as such are required to leave Canada immediately. If you do not leave Canada voluntarily, enforcement action may be taken against you.​

Like I already mentioned, the course is an independent course. I didn't apply for the full program, I registered as an independent student for this single course and took only this course like so many others. I have an independent, sealed transcript for it. For that reason, at first, I thought that the above quotes imply a contradiction. But now, I realize that they probably just didn't want me to continue without a permit. If this is correct, then at least I didn't study illegally, and McGill, my father and I did not misunderstand the rules, though the refusal letter should have been no surprise to me.

EDIT: I know you could also argue that it is part of a program. But it is not a part of the program in the same sense that BIOL 200 Molecular Biology (3 credits) is part of Major Pharmacology and I didn't register, nor did I apply for any full program.

But it is not what matters...

 

[canadianbagel]

I feel really grateful that they probably let me stay for a year just so we could become common law! Thank you Canada. Fantastic country.