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Want to file first Tax Return

naz143

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Jul 15, 2009
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Hi,

I would like to file my first tax return. My situation is:

We (me,my wife and two kids) became PR on Sep-2009. I came back to Middle East after about one month but my family is still there in BC. Now we have to file our first return. My questions are:

1. Am I still resident? There is a question in the Ufile application that "what is your provence of residence on 31 Dec 2009?" but on this date I was not there. what should I write provence name or non-resident?

2. Ufile asks about income. As I stated above, I stayed in BC only for one month and I didn't work there, even my wife is not working there too.
Should I need to declare my foreign income which I earned before landing in 2009? Actually, When I applied for CCTB, I declared my income for 2009 (Jan - Aug, period before landing) that was CAN 12,000.

3. Is foreign income taxable? If yes, then I need to provide any proof of my income.

Thanks and Regards,
 

toby

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You are still a permanent resident (for immigration purposes) – until such time as you fail to meet the PR quota of 730 days IN CANADA per 5-year period. For tax-paying purposes, you are considered a full-time resident since you or your spouse has a full-time residence available to you in Canada, and you have significant ties to Canada (i.e. your spouse is there).

So, put B.C. as your official residence.

You pay tax to Canada on worldwide income only as of the official date of entering Canada (September 2009). If you don’t have some sort of official receipt for income earned abroad, just state the amount and explain it in a cover letter.

I'll leave it to the experts to suggest a strategy to maintain permanent residency if it seems that you won't mee ththe PR quota for time spent in Canada. There is an exception that allows a permanent resident to count time spent abroad toward the quota AS LONG AS he/she was accompanying a Canadian.

The question I am not sure of is this. Can a Canadian resident count time abroad if it was spent accompanying another Canadian resident -- only only by accompanying a Canadian citizen?


If accompanying a Canadian resident will do, then your wife could meet the quota by spending Sept 2009 - 2011 in Canada while you work abroad. Then, she could leave Canada to work elsewhere, and you accompany her for the next two years.
accompany her. That way you both keep your Canada residency intact.

Experts: does this work?
 

naz143

Newbie
Jul 15, 2009
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Thanks Dear Toby:

I am still confused about the 2nd point. Do I need to declare the foreign income in the tax return which I earned before becoming a PR?
For example, from Jan-Aug I was not a PR and my foreign income was $ 12,000. On Sep-2009 I became a PR and from Sep-Dec my foreign income was $ 6,000. Now, my question is that which income I need to mention in the return 6,000 (Sep-Dec) OR 18,000 (Jan-Dec).

What is the max. income on which there is no tax for the family size of mine?

Thanks & With Best Regards,
 

toby

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You report only the $6000 earned after you became a permanent resident in Canada. I am pretty sure you will have no tax to pay on this $6000.

When in Canada, buy a Quicktax to save yourself a lot of headaches computing taxes.
 

naz143

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Jul 15, 2009
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Thanks Dear Toby,

It's really a very helpful forum. I will definately ask again, if I may have any quesiton.

Regards,
 

haver

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naz143 said:
What is the max. income on which there is no tax for the family size of mine?

Thanks & With Best Regards,
The tax issue in Canada is very complicated. If you claim 4 months income in Canada, it should be prorated and taxable as 3 times bigger amount (in your case it should be 6,000 * 3 = 18,000). After that, your income tax for 2009 should be divided by 3.
Here is tax calculator and rates http://www.ey.com/CA/en/Services/Tax/Tax-Calculators

There is additional tax in Canada. It is called CPP - Canada Pension Plan. The amount 3,500 should be subtracted from your taxable amount and you have to pay extra 9.9% from the income up to about 44,000.
 

toby

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NAZ 143

On your second point, if you became a PR in Sept 2009, you pay Canada income tax only on income (worldwide) that you earned after becoming a PR. Haber, I don’t think there is any prorating; I believe the CRA website is explicit on this point. However, if you have evidence to the contrary, I’d be very interested in seeing it.

So, NAZ, you earned $6000 from September 2009 to December 2009. There’s no tax to pay (income too low).

Regarding CPP, or Canada Pension Plan -- which will pay you a pension when you retire -- if the $6,000 was from an employer, then the employer paid into CPP for you, and you have nothing extra to pay. But if the $6,000 was from your own business, Quicktax calculates that you should have paid $247.5 into the CPP fund.

On the question of maintaining PR status when you are out of Canada, further research has come to light. I recently summarized a long, complicated thread on this topic in Permanent Residency Obligations. Again, Matthewc was the major contributor; I only summarized the issue.

In your case, although you said your family members are all PRs, if in fact your wife is a Canadian citizen, and if she were to live with you abroad, then two things happen. First, you could count the time abroad toward your PR quota of 730 days. Second, if you do not have access to a residence in Canada throughout the year (owned or rented), then you are NOT taxable on income generated while you are outside Canada.

I mention these possibilities for general knowledge, even if they don’t help you.

In your case, if your wife is not a citizen, and/or if your family will stay in Canada throughout the year, then no, your time abroad cannot be counted toward your PR quota, and yes, you are taxable on all worldwide earnings. From 1 January 2010 onward, you will be taxable on all your earnings worldwide, throughout the year.

Now you know why Canada welcomed you with open arms. More taxes!!!!! Welcome to Canada!!!

;D
 

haver

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Toby, I am not an accountant or bookkeeper. I am a financial planner in Canada. I deal with taxes indirectly. I am pretty sure that minimum taxable income is prorated for people who came to Canada after the year started. If you are not sure please call CRA or play with the software. But sowtware could be wrong.
 

toby

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I'll look into this, Haver, for my own education.

But you seem to place the onus on me to check up on your assertions. I suggest it should be the other way around; don't give advice unless you're reasonably sure it is valid. And if someone questions the validity, check the validity yourself. At least that is the way I preferred to operate when I was a financial planner in Canada, and that is how I'd want any financial advisor I'd hire today to operate.
 

toby

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15 July 2011
OK, I spent an hour or two going through the CRA website, publications, and tax guides.

Sorry about the length of this post, but CRA is never concise, and this is an important issue for all PRs landing in Canada part-way through the year, and wanting to know what to report in their first Canadian tax return.

First, Haver's advice to multiply by 3 the $6000 of income earned after landing in Canada, then divide by 3, does not make sense to me. After all the arithmetic, one would end up at the starting point, at $6000, no?

Second, I never encountered this suggestion in any of the CRA publications or guides, so again, Haver, please tell us where you got this idea. It might have unexpected implications we'd want to consider further.

The CRA advice on the subject seems to be: the taxpayer simply declares in his tax return any income earned in Canada and abroad after he becomes a Canadian resident.

(Comment: that is, what happened before he became a resident does not concern Canada. It is true that the Canadian taxpayer must declare his worldwide income in the Canadian tax return, but this is only to calculate how many federal tax credits he is entitled to, not to tax that worldwide income while he was a non-resident.)


Here’s what the tax guide says. (Note: Employment income is Part I tax.)

Part I tax - definition
The payer usually deducts Part I tax from the types of income listed below. However, if you carry on a business in Canada, or sell or dispose of taxable Canadian property, you may be subject to tax.
Even if the payer deducts tax from your income or you pay an amount of tax during the year, you may also have to file a Canadian income tax return to calculate your final tax obligation to Canada on:

• income from employment in Canada or from a business carried on in Canada; ( Comment: the taxpayer earned $6000 – which Quicktax calculates to attract NO tax.)

• employment income from a Canadian resident for your employment in another country, if the terms of a tax treaty between Canada and your country of residence make the income exempt from tax in your country of residence. (Comment: if this is the case, then the foreign income, earned before the PR landed in Canada, would be taxable in his Canadian tax return for 2009; this needs to be checked out. But this is a very special, rare case, and probably does not apply.)

• certain income from employment outside Canada if you were a resident of Canada when the duties were performed. (Comment: this does not apply, since the foreign income was earned before the PR landed in Canada in June 2009.)

One of the information bulletins on residents and non-residents has this to say: (Note: To see the entire text, go to: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/5013-g/5013-g-01-09e.html#detstatut.)

Were you a non-resident of Canada in 2009?

You are a non-resident of Canada for tax purposes throughout any period in which you do not have significant residential ties (as defined in the following section) in Canada and you are not a deemed resident of Canada. (Comment: before landing in June 2009, the taxpayer was a non-resident, and this is how CRA tells him to treat his income earned before landing, while a non-resident.)

What income should you report? - Report your income from Canadian sources (my emphasis) such as the taxable part of your scholarships, fellowships, bursaries, net research grants, income from a business that does not have a permanent establishment in Canada, net partnership income (limited or non-active partners only), and taxable capital gains from disposing of taxable Canadian property, as indicated under the income lines applicable to non-residents of Canada in the guide.
Interest income for both non-residents and deemed non-residents must be entered on Schedule A, Statement of World Income. If your Canadian payer has withheld non-resident tax at an incorrect rate or for more information on non-resident tax withholding, contact the International Tax Services Office.

Conclusion: In brief, before landing, report only income sourced in Canada (if any) After landing, report all income..
 

haver

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Toby, I think you take such simple queston as very complicated. Please don't write so much useless words.

What you need to do is just use any simple software and show the entrance day to Canada let say as Sep 1 or something.
You will see the result. I don't want to waiste time in discussing for nothing.

Just use simple income tax software and that is it.

As for multiple $6,000 by 3 , please don't forget calculate the tax and divide the result by 3.
 

toby

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7 July 2011
LANDED..........
15 July 2011
Are you a CFP, Haver?
 

haver

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May 30, 2009
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Yes, Toby, I have a CFP designation since 2004.

I am pretty sure that personal income tax deduction for 2009 is 10,300 and should be divided by 3 (that is equal about 3,400) .
So, the taxable income should be about 2,600

If person has a family (wife and 2 kids), then there may be other tax deductions that could apply, and his tax deductions should be about 8,900 (if they don't have any income).

If the taxpayer is self-employed or has a business income, he should also pay 9.9% CPP contribution from 2,500 (6000 - 3,500).
If he is employed, then there is no CPP tax on foreign employment income.

There is also double taxation issue. If taxpayer paid some taxes on this 6000 back in Middle East and there is an agreement about double taxation between his country and Canada, then it reduces his taxes in Canada on amount of tax paid in his country.
 

toby

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Sep 29, 2009
1,671
104
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Visa Office......
Hong Kong
Job Offer........
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App. Filed.......
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October 2009 and 15 April 2011
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4 April 2011
VISA ISSUED...
7 July 2011
LANDED..........
15 July 2011
Haver:

You are right that the issue was initially simple. You complicated it by giving confusing advice.

In an earlier post you said:
As for multiple $6,000 by 3 , please don't forget calculate the tax and divide the result by 3.”

I confess I don’t know what you meant to say.

Now you say:
I am pretty sure that personal income tax deduction for 2009 is 10,300 and should be divided by 3 (that is equal about 3,400) .
So, the taxable income should be about 2,600”


This is much clearer, but still questionable. I asked you for your sources so I could assess the validity of your advice. My former accountant has never heard of your method. And Quicktax (you recommend I use a tax program to keep things simple) makes no mention of your complex calculation. The taxpayer:
(1) Inputs the income earned in Canada ($6,000 – no prorating, no multiplying by 3).
(2) Inputs the date of entering Canada (Quicktax reduces the federal tax credit because the taxpayer has not been in Canada all year).
(3) Presto – practically no tax to pay. No dividing tax payable by 3.

And before you criticize me for using “useless words”, remember that these words came largely from CRA publications. Are you seriously recommending that we ignore CRA’s advice and instead rely on your unsupported advice? Being “pretty sure” is not good enough; if you hope to sell insurance products by giving financial and tax advice, you need to be sure it is GOOD advice. If someone asks you for supporting evidence, why not provide it instead of hiding behind criticism?

In the Health section of this forum, you asked Leon, a senior member of this forum, if he is “responsible” for his advice. You should ask yourself this question. Misleading new residents on important tax issues is a serious matter.
 

haver

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Toby:
This is a forum for new immigrants.
This is not an accounting school.
There is no need to republish here CRA website.

Unlike you I am a real person with a real website.

Please introduce yourself: first, and last names and your designation.
And also, please explain the reason why you are following me on each of my postings here.