When can we apply for PR Card Renewal?

[Zaid89]

I had PR since 21/Jul/2018, but I had to go back after the first COPR landing due to personal issues. I have landed back in Canada on 19/Oct/2021 and planning to stay now. My PR card has an expiry date of 25/Oct/2023.
As per the PR card renewal obligations - You should only apply for a PR card if: your card has expired or will expire in less than 9 months.
So can I apply in March 2023 for PR card renewal showing the job proof that I am going to complete 730 days?
Or I cannot apply for card renewal as I don't meet the 730 days Residency Obligations till 18/Oct/2023? So should I apply after 18/Oct/2023? Can we continue to stay in Canada if the PR card expires?

 

[canuck78]

I had PR since 21/Jul/2018, but I had to go back after the first COPR landing due to personal issues. I have landed back in Canada on 19/Oct/2021 and planning to stay now. My PR card has an expiry date of 25/Oct/2023.
As per the PR card renewal obligations - You should only apply for a PR card if: your card has expired or will expire in less than 9 months.
So can I apply in March 2023 for PR card renewal showing the job proof that I am going to complete 730 days?
Or I cannot apply for card renewal as I don't meet the 730 days Residency Obligations till 18/Oct/2023? So should I apply after 18/Oct/2023? Can we continue to stay in Canada if the PR card expires?

The 730 days out of 5 years starts on the day you landed so you are currently not meeting your RO. You must wait until you meet the 730 days out of 5 years or you risk being denied. Would actually recommend you add a few months as a buffer before applying. Yes you can remain in Canada without a valid PR card. You should be aware that since you don’t meet the RO you can’t sponsor anyone.

 

[armoured]

Or I cannot apply for card renewal as I don't meet the 730 days Residency Obligations till 18/Oct/2023? So should I apply after 18/Oct/2023? Can we continue to stay in Canada if the PR card expires?

Yes, you should apply after October 2023.

 

[Zaid89]

The 730 days out of 5 years starts on the day you landed so you are currently not meeting your RO. You must wait until you meet the 730 days out of 5 years or you risk being denied. Would actually recommend you add a few months as a buffer before applying. Yes, you can remain in Canada without a valid PR card. You should be aware that since you don’t meet the RO you can’t sponsor anyone.

Thanks, @canuck78 for the quick response. So you suggest applying for a PR card somewhere in December 2023.
But what does the landing means? The first time I landed with COPR? Because that was 21/Jul/2018 and based on that 5 years is completed by 21/Jul/2023 and I will not meet 730 days requirement.
My understanding was 730 days in the last 5 years when you are applying for the PR card renewal, not the landing or start date. Maybe I got that wrong.

PR Since: 21/Jul/2018
PR Expiry Date: 25/Oct/2023
Will Complete 730 Days by 18/Oct/2023

 

[canuck78]

Thanks, @canuck78 for the quick response. So you suggest applying for a PR card somewhere in December 2023.
But what does the landing means? The first time I landed with COPR? Because that was 21/Jul/2018 and based on that 5 years is completed by 21/Jul/2023 and I will not meet 730 days requirement.
My understanding was 730 days in the last 5 years when you are applying for the PR card renewal, not the landing or start date. Maybe I got that wrong.

PR Since: 21/Jul/2018
PR Expiry Date: 25/Oct/2023
Will Complete 730 Days by 18/Oct/2023

To be compliant with your RO you needed to meet the 730 days by July 21/2023. Since you won’t meet this you are currently not meeting your RO. As long as you remain in Canada and you don’t need to sponsor anyone it isn’t an issue. You will need to apply for PR card renewal once you have met the 730 days in the past 5 years? Would suggest getting closer to 800 days in the past 5 years to hopefully avoid a secondary review but that is up to you.

 

[Zaid89]

Thank you @canuck78 for this insight, so I don't have any issues if I continue to stay after July 21/2023. But I just have to make sure not to sponsor PR for my family.
But I can sponsor them on a visitor visa, that should not be an issue?

 

[armoured]

But I can sponsor them on a visitor visa, that should not be an issue?

You don't actually sponsor them for a visitor visa, they just apply on their own, so the issue does not come up.

 

[canuck78]

Thank you @canuck78 for this insight, so I don't have any issues if I continue to stay after July 21/2023. But I just have to make sure not to sponsor PR for my family.
But I can sponsor them on a visitor visa, that should not be an issue?

No issues with staying after July 21/2023. If you have a spouse or children without PR they may have difficulty getting a TRV and would not have access to healthcare until they receive PR.

 

[Zaid89]

Thanks, @armoured.

Sorry to ask this but why I can't sponsor the family as I will have a valid PR till 21/Jul/2023. Is it because if the application is processed around this date then I don't meet the residency obligation of 730 days? And they might revoke my PR?
Because my understanding was PR status is only assessed during PR Card renewal, a PR Travel Document, or arrive in Canada at an airport or land border.

Individuals need to be concerned when the are being assessed by IRCC. This occurs when an individual applies for a PR Card renewal, a PR Travel Document, or arrive in Canada at an airport or land border. In each of these circumstance, an individual will be assessed and an officer will determine if you meet the residency requirement in the 5 year period that applies to your situation. An individual must have accumulated (or be able to accumulate) 730 residency days within this 5 year period to maintain PR status.

 

[canuck78]

Thanks, @armoured.

Sorry to ask this but why I can't sponsor the family as I will have a valid PR till 21/Jul/2023. Is it because if the application is processed around this date then I don't meet the residency obligation of 730 days? And they might revoke my PR?
Because my understanding was PR status is only assessed during PR Card renewal, a PR Travel Document, or arrive in Canada at an airport or land border.

Individuals need to be concerned when the are being assessed by IRCC. This occurs when an individual applies for a PR Card renewal, a PR Travel Document, or arrive in Canada at an airport or land border. In each of these circumstance, an individual will be assessed and an officer will determine if you meet the residency requirement in the 5 year period that applies to your situation. An individual must have accumulated (or be able to accumulate) 730 residency days within this 5 year period to maintain PR status.

If you sponsor your family you need to be eligible to sponsor. If you aren’t compliant with your RO you wouldn’t be considered eligible since you haven’t met the RO. You must be able to meet the 730 days within 5 years from your landing date to be considered currently compliant with your RO. You aren’t currently compliant with your RO.

 

[armoured]

Thanks, @armoured.

Sorry to ask this but why I can't sponsor the family as I will have a valid PR till 21/Jul/2023. Is it because if the application is processed around this date then I don't meet the residency obligation of 730 days? And they might revoke my PR?
Because my understanding was PR status is only assessed during PR Card renewal, a PR Travel Document, or arrive in Canada at an airport or land border.

PR status can also be examined when you apply to sponsor. OR, it's possible they would just 'hold' the sponsorship application until you are compliant - which in your case won't be until late 2023, so you really don't want to do that.

Agree entirely with how @canuck78 put it - if it helps to understand, a different way to explain the PR residency obligation is that the PR must be outside of Canada less than 1095 days in any five year period (the first period begins the day of landing - after the five year anniversary of landing, all the five year periods are looking back).

[Digression but this is mathematically the same as 730 days in Canada to be compliant: five years * 365 minus 730 days. Conceptually, IRCC gives 'credit' for days remaining in the first five year period - but easier to calculate/express as "days outside Canada must be less than 1095.]

Since you left Canada in, say, early August 2018 and returned in after August 2021 - you were out of Canada more than 1095 days. Now you cannot become compliant until you've been in Canada for two years continuously. (It's unfortunate you didn't return before July 2021 but too late to do anything about that now).

Again, you are still a PR, you're here legally, you can work, you are a PR, and an expired PR card (in future) does not mean you are not a PR either (the card is not the status).

You're just a PR who's out of compliance. If you don't leave the country or otherwise get examined, you're fine.

 

[Zaid89]

If you sponsor your family you need to be eligible to sponsor. If you aren’t compliant with your RO you wouldn’t be considered eligible since you haven’t met the RO. You must be able to meet the 730 days within 5 years from your landing date to be considered currently compliant with your RO. You aren’t currently compliant with your RO.

@armoured
I completed 730 days requirement yesterday, and it was continuous stay as I didn't travel anywhere abroad. I was thinking to go ahead and apply the PR renewal.
- Do you still think it could be an issue as I was 1093 days outside in last 5 years from today? Or it is safe as i was present continuously?
- If yes, then i should not mention anything in the "5.7 Humanitarian and compassionate grounds" section as I already meet the Residency Obligations.

Thank you for your help.

 

[armoured]

@armoured
I completed 730 days requirement yesterday, and it was continuous stay as I didn't travel anywhere abroad. I was thinking to go ahead and apply the PR renewal.
- Do you still think it could be an issue as I was 1093 days outside in last 5 years from today? Or it is safe as i was present continuously?
- If yes, then i should not mention anything in the "5.7 Humanitarian and compassionate grounds" section as I already meet the Residency Obligations.

Thank you for your help.

-You can apply as long as you are certain about your day count (which if continuous stay, not really that hard).
-Some will argue you should have some buffer of days and if so, how much (eg 15 30 or 60 days). I think waiting a couple or four weeks is probably not a big deal from your perspective (as long as you have no urgent need to travel, the only thing you'd really need the new PR card for) - but it's up to you.
-The 1093 days/730 days (plus or minus) is two sides of the same coin, so don't really understand the question.
-Can't say how 'safe' - the only real risk is additional delay, I should think. That's what the advice about 'buffer' days is for, but truth is - we're kind of reading tea leaves. (The buffer days is MUCH more important for those who have really complicated travel histories and/or have some risk of having left out a trip or three - not your situation)
-No, you do not need to put anything in H&C - in fact, do NOT put anything there as that would likely land it in the 'difficult processing' file (because you'd've indicated there are H&C issues which must be evaluated).