+1(514) 937-9445 or Toll-free (Canada & US) +1 (888) 947-9445

What is second class citizen

keesio

VIP Member
May 16, 2012
4,795
396
Toronto, Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
CPP-O
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
09-01-2013
Doc's Request.
09-07-2013
AOR Received.
30-01-2013
File Transfer...
11-02-2013
Med's Done....
02-01-2013
Interview........
waived
Passport Req..
12-07-2013
VISA ISSUED...
15-08-2013
LANDED..........
14-10-2013
emamabd said:
Whats the difference (from CIC perspective) between a "new citizen" working abroad for an extended period of time and a "citizen of convenience".
To CIC, it is basically if your desire for citizenship from the start is to use it as a "stepping stone" or "backup plan" without any intent to live in Canada. Proving this is quite difficult as CIC will need concrete evidence that someone already had prior plans to move out of Canada once citizenship was acquired. Otherwise without this evidence, you will just fall into "new citizen who later decided to move abroad" (even if the actual intent is indeed to be a "citizen of convenience").
 

ttrajan

Champion Member
Oct 14, 2013
2,237
49
Category........
AINP
Job Offer........
Yes
LANDED..........
15-08-2012
What is the processing time with the new rule? Earlier it was around 2 years.
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,286
3,048
To be clear, there is no legal classification of citizenship in Canada. A citizen is a citizen.

The so-called "second class citizen" characterization is entirely derived from criticisms of certain provisions of the SCCA. "In effect . . . " the criticism goes, the new provisions "create two classes of citizenship."

There is no legal distinction as such.

In contrast, however, there are scores and scores of distinctions made, in law and by the government, relative to different groups of citizens, pursuant to which the rights of individual citizens may be more or less restricted. Those convicted of indictable offences, for example, may be subject to severely restricted mobility.

Been convicted of murder? Argue as loud as one might about how the Charter protects your mobility rights, since you are a citizen, odds are you will be confined to the grounds of a fairly small institutional facility for a very long time, most of that time confined to a rather small space within that facility.

Which is to say, the characterization of "second class citizens" is almost entirely rhetorical, of minimal if any legal significance. What has legal significance is actual conduct and the consequences of that conduct. Commit a serious crime, go to prison. Commit treason, go to prison. Commit acts of terrorism, die or go to prison. Now, if you are a dual citizen, commit treason or acts of terrorism, and while you are in prison your citizenship status may be taken away so long as it does not render you stateless (if this part of the SCCA withstands constitutional challenges).

In the meantime, the rest of us, the vast, vast majority of us, try to keep our jobs and earn a living, do what we can to support and educate our families, and offer what help we can to our friends and neighbours, giving time or money to this or that charity effort along the way . . . and where I live, this time of year we hunker down and avoid the swarms of black flies and mosquitoes who want our blood (there's a reason why I so much like the Canadian winter).

ZingyDNA said:
If intent is so hard to prove, why would they put it in the application in the first place? Someone's intention can change 10 seconds after oath. Why put something pretty much impractical in the law? Either it's to please certain type of voters, or to open future opportunities for more strict citizenship law. Maybe both...
Seems you have been part of other discussions in which this query was clearly answered: neither, but rather to preclude the applicant-applying-on-the-way-to-the-airport (a pet peeve of the Tories) and to discourage taking-the-oath-on-the-way-to-the-airport, as well as including giving CIC some rather powerful tools for probing the background and continuing foreign ties of those applying for citizenship. That's plenty of why.

BTW: Intent is not hard to prove. The inclusion of an intent element in the law is very common in many contexts. Like with any fact, a decision maker can examine and consider relevant evidence and based on the evidence conclude what an individual's intent is. What the individual says his or her intent is, is of course relevant evidence, but not the only evidence, not at all binding or definitive. For example, the applicant for citizenship who has taken a job abroad while the application is pending, can protest vehemently that his intent is to continue to reside in Canada if granted citizenship, but CIC is likely to conclude otherwise, for obvious reasons.
 

hoping_canadian

Hero Member
Jun 20, 2014
525
12
Montreal
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
red some articles in facebook, saying about second class citizens, citizenship can be revoked. those who doesn't born Canadian, which can obtain citizenship from other country can be revoked their citizenship, something like that. Its alarming!!!
 

keesio

VIP Member
May 16, 2012
4,795
396
Toronto, Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
CPP-O
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
09-01-2013
Doc's Request.
09-07-2013
AOR Received.
30-01-2013
File Transfer...
11-02-2013
Med's Done....
02-01-2013
Interview........
waived
Passport Req..
12-07-2013
VISA ISSUED...
15-08-2013
LANDED..........
14-10-2013
hoping_canadian said:
red some articles in facebook, saying about second class citizens, citizenship can be revoked. those who doesn't born Canadian, which can obtain citizenship from other country can be revoked their citizenship, something like that. Its alarming!!!
Do you believe everything you read on facebook?

anyway even their hype is wrong. The issue is dual (or potential dual) citizens, not if you were or were not born in Canada.
 

MUFC

Champion Member
Jul 14, 2014
1,223
214
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
hoping_canadian said:
red some articles in facebook, saying about second class citizens, citizenship can be revoked. those who doesn't born Canadian, which can obtain citizenship from other country can be revoked their citizenship, something like that. Its alarming!!!
What about Twitter? Do they alarm there too?
 

keesio

VIP Member
May 16, 2012
4,795
396
Toronto, Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
CPP-O
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
09-01-2013
Doc's Request.
09-07-2013
AOR Received.
30-01-2013
File Transfer...
11-02-2013
Med's Done....
02-01-2013
Interview........
waived
Passport Req..
12-07-2013
VISA ISSUED...
15-08-2013
LANDED..........
14-10-2013
MUFC said:
What about Twitter? Do they alarm there too?
Don't forget instagram and reddit. And TMZ. There is a whole lot of chatter on TMZ so it must be true.
 

MUFC

Champion Member
Jul 14, 2014
1,223
214
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
keesio said:
Don't forget instagram and reddit. And TMZ. There is a whole lot of chatter on TMZ so it must be true.
I knew it I was looking in a wrong place, because I was hopping to find something in the gossip newspapers.
 

hoping_canadian

Hero Member
Jun 20, 2014
525
12
Montreal
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
keesio said:
Do you believe everything you read on facebook?

anyway even their hype is wrong. The issue is dual (or potential dual) citizens, not if you were or were not born in Canada.
https://bccla.org/2015/06/its-official-second-class-citizenship-goes-into-effect/
 

hoping_canadian

Hero Member
Jun 20, 2014
525
12
Montreal
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
keesio said:
Don't forget instagram and reddit. And TMZ. There is a whole lot of chatter on TMZ so it must be true.
just to keep you updated

http://www.sfu.ca/education/cels/bilingual/bilingual-corner/bill-c-24.html
 

hoping_canadian

Hero Member
Jun 20, 2014
525
12
Montreal
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
MUFC said:
I knew it I was looking in a wrong place, because I was hopping to find something in the gossip newspapers.
just to keep you guys posted :p :p :p :p :p

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/citizenship-act-will-create-two-classes-of-canadians/article18778296/
 

MUFC

Champion Member
Jul 14, 2014
1,223
214
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
I want to be third class citizen, second class is a little bit higher for me.

What forms do I have to fulfill for the third class citizenship?
 

keesio

VIP Member
May 16, 2012
4,795
396
Toronto, Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
CPP-O
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
09-01-2013
Doc's Request.
09-07-2013
AOR Received.
30-01-2013
File Transfer...
11-02-2013
Med's Done....
02-01-2013
Interview........
waived
Passport Req..
12-07-2013
VISA ISSUED...
15-08-2013
LANDED..........
14-10-2013
Yes yes I'm quite familiar with all the provisions of C24. I'm a dual citizen so it is in my own best interest to be aware of how it impacts me. So I've studied it carefully and realized that there isn't really much in there to be concerned about. Of course you will have all sorts of groups and media go on about it like anything. Controversy (whether real or imagined) makes good news. It's why TMZ is so popular :)