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URGENT: Is paid vacation still counted part of 52 weeks for CEC?

jvm8

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Jul 30, 2018
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I am on a contract that lasts exactly 12 months from my start date (Sep 11th 2017) to my end date (Sep 11th 2018). That gives me exactly 52 weeks to be eligible for the Canadian experience class but I am getting mixed information about whether paid vacation time counts toward that duration.

I have 2 questions:
  1. I've taken about 12 days of paid vacation in the time I have been employed in Canada. Does that still count?
  2. I've also taken business trips to other countries like the USA and India during this period. Does that also still count?
Thanks so much for your help, fingers crossed this all goes smoothly.
 

monkeyspanner

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Being pedantic but that would be 1year and 1day if you worked both days.
1. Yes paid vacation counts as employment.
2. Yes if you were travelling for your employers business.
 
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Vitesze

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Dec 15, 2017
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1. Paid vacation counts. What does not count is unpaid.
2. It does count as work experience, BUT they may place doubts whether you really worked in this period, as they will see you left the country - given that you are so close to the MEC of 12 months work experience, them invalidating even just a few days of your work experience will already lead your application to be rejected, so I would work on minimizing the risk.

what you should do:
- Mention that business trips are part of your job in your LOE
- Include some proof (e.g. paystub) that you were paid as normal for this period
- If for your NOC it is highly uncommon to do business trips, include a signed letter from your employer stating you were employed + paid in this period, and on a business trip

From what I've read on this forum, the CIC definitely appears to throw a fuss when Canadian Work Experience is gained outside Canada, although it is at the discretion of the VO to determine if the work experience someone claim is legitimate. Best to take no risk and include plenty of proof.
 
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jes_ON

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I am on a contract that lasts exactly 12 months from my start date (Sep 11th 2017) to my end date (Sep 11th 2018). That gives me exactly 52 weeks to be eligible for the Canadian experience class but I am getting mixed information about whether paid vacation time counts toward that duration.

I have 2 questions:
  1. I've taken about 12 days of paid vacation in the time I have been employed in Canada. Does that still count?
Yes; it helps if vacation and other benefits are mentioned in the letter of reference (as part of your remuneration).
  1. I've also taken business trips to other countries like the USA and India during this period. Does that also still count?
Maybe... what is your NOC? I believe this should be mentioned in your letter of reference as well....
 

jvm8

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Jul 30, 2018
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Hi Jes_oN,

1. Thanks, I'll be sure to have this included in my LOR

2. I work as a product analyst at a major tech company that's got operations across the world. I'm categorized as NOC A.

I also have a question about remote work. I was on Canadian payroll and have paystubs to prove it but took a couple of weeks to work remotely from my home country. Does that count against Canadian experience? I've gotten mixed information about this, I thought the criteria was being employed by a Canadian company on a Canadian work permit for 12 months.
 

jes_ON

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2. I work as a product analyst at a major tech company that's got operations across the world. I'm categorized as NOC A.
I think if your employer is willing to state that "traveling to and consulting with various sites in the global operation" (or something like that, LOL, I am not a business person) as part of your job duties and responsibilities, it will help.

I also have a question about remote work. I was on Canadian payroll and have paystubs to prove it but took a couple of weeks to work remotely from my home country. Does that count against Canadian experience?
We already talked about this, I think... IRCC will know you were out of the country based on travel records.

I've gotten mixed information about this, I thought the criteria was being employed by a Canadian company on a Canadian work permit for 12 months.
No, the criteria include being employed IN CANADA (with proper authorization)... Many people work for foreign owned businesses in Canada and get credit...

Ministerial instructions -
https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/mandate/policies-operational-instructions-agreements/ministerial-instructions/express-entry-application-management-system.html

"Canadian work experience
(3) For the purposes of this section, Canadian work experience is work experience that
  • (a) is acquired by a foreign national in Canada in one or more occupations listed in Skill Type 0 Management Occupations or Skill Level A or B of the National Occupational Classification matrix;..."
Again, I haven' t seen any "recent" cases (past few months), but it wasn't that long ago that telecommuting experience outside of Canada was excluded, and applicants refused....
 

jvm8

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But if the remote weeks are still under Canadian payroll and the hours are reflected in my T4, I'm a bit confused as to why this would be an issue. There must be plenty of other analysts/ consultants that travel for work and also choose to telecommute because of personal reasons. As long as I have the 12 months of work experience, I am still entitled to apply, right?

Thanks so much for your help!
 

jes_ON

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But if the remote weeks are still under Canadian payroll and the hours are reflected in my T4, I'm a bit confused as to why this would be an issue.
Because it is outside of Canada, and given the wording of the Ministerial Instructions, that makes it ineligible. At least, that is how it has been interpreted in the last couple of years. I haven't seen any very recent cases like this, so I do not know if it has changed. I would agree it seems contrary to intent, but you know it would be seriously abused if IRCC allowed it.

Note that if you intend to apply for citizenship later, any time spent outside of Canada cannot be used towards meeting your residency requirement either.

Given that we are only talking the difference of a couple-few weeks, most people do not find it difficult to work a couple of extra weeks to ensure they meet the requirement. Good practice in any case.



There must be plenty of other analysts/ consultants that travel for work yes and also choose to telecommute because of personal reasons.
Not if they are serious about obtaining PR status...

As long as I have the 12 months of work experience, I am still entitled to apply, right?
Anyone is entitled to apply. Doesn't mean you are entitled to be approved.
 

jvm8

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Hi Jes, I'd like some advice on business trips if possible. My NOC is 2171 (Information Systems Analyst) and I was required to go for a mandatory onsite for 5 days to our company headquarters in the US. Would those 5 days count? I've got ample documentation that I was required to go and can have this included in my LOE.
 

jes_ON

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Hi Jes, I'd like some advice on business trips if possible. My NOC is 2171 (Information Systems Analyst) and I was required to go for a mandatory onsite for 5 days to our company headquarters in the US. Would those 5 days count? I've got ample documentation that I was required to go and can have this included in my LOE.
Five days? You want to deal with risk and doubt and possibly do battle with IRCC over 5 days? Is it not easier just to work 53 weeks instead of 52 before applying?
 

jvm8

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Jul 30, 2018
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Five days? You want to deal with risk and doubt and possibly do battle with IRCC over 5 days? Is it not easier just to work 53 weeks instead of 52 before applying?
I might not have the option of working the extra 5 days, I extended my contract by a month to cover remote days worked but these 5 days will still be included in my 50.5 weeks of work experience. My consultant has said it's never been an issue with a few days and I'm aware I'm taking a risk. What are your thoughts on the following, if I do not include the 5 days:

Weeks worked in Canada: 49.5
Vacation Weeks: 3
Weeks worked abroad: 5
 

jes_ON

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I might not have the option of working the extra 5 days, I extended my contract by a month to cover remote days worked but these 5 days will still be included in my 50.5 weeks of work experience. My consultant has said it's never been an issue with a few days and I'm aware I'm taking a risk. What are your thoughts on the following, if I do not include the 5 days:

Weeks worked in Canada: 49.5
Vacation Weeks: 3

You count your paid vacation as "weeks worked." And to me, it looks like you have 52 weeks without the weeks worked abroad. Whew : )
 

jvm8

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Jul 30, 2018
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Thanks a lot, Jes! One final question- I have 2 weeks in the 49.5 that I left on a Thursday from Canada to take a paid vacation in the US, but the paid days start Friday. I was still physically in Canada on those Thursdays, so I can count work experience from those 2 days, right?
 

jes_ON

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Thanks a lot, Jes! One final question- I have 2 weeks in the 49.5 that I left on a Thursday from Canada to take a paid vacation in the US, but the paid days start Friday. I was still physically in Canada on those Thursdays, so I can count work experience from those 2 days, right?
LOL, yes... : )
 

alexaha

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Nov 15, 2017
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Hi, have the same problem and really struggle to find the answer. I work in Canada as International Marketing Specialist (NOC A). I represent my company on various events and fairs, spending over 60 days abroad during the year. Business trips are essential part of my job. Are there any in country work experience requirements? Will CIC count these days for CEC? I would appreciate your assistance