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PRTD Approved, Entered Canada now Apply for Renewal or Relinquish PR

salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
I got PRTD approved based on H&C ground as my wife and kids are in Canada and they are here for 3 years. Still I have not moved due to current COVID situation. I need advice on the below:

1) Shall I go for PR renewal now? but I can only stay for 60 days
2) Shall I relinquish PR and apply for visitors' visa. Any chances that my visitors' visa can be rejected?
3) Will it impact my future request for PR through spousal sponsorship program?
4) Will it affect my family Citizen application?

Appreciate expert advice on the above.

Thanks
 

canuck78

VIP Member
Jun 18, 2017
52,969
12,771
I got PRTD approved based on H&C ground as my wife and kids are in Canada and they are here for 3 years. Still I have not moved due to current COVID situation. I need advice on the below:

1) Shall I go for PR renewal now? but I can only stay for 60 days
2) Shall I relinquish PR and apply for visitors' visa. Any chances that my visitors' visa can be rejected?
3) Will it impact my future request for PR through spousal sponsorship program?
4) Will it affect my family Citizen application?

Appreciate expert advice on the above.

Thanks
Assume you said you wanted to move back permanently or else PRTD based on H&C would likely not have been approved. You can enter Canada and apply for a PR card. If you don't meet your RO again there are good chances you won't be given the second PRTD based on H&C. If you renounce your PR status there is no guarantee you will be awarded a TRV. If you fail to meet your RO again and are refused a PRTD based on H&C then I would renounce your PR status and apply for sponsorship.
 
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dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,267
3,028
I got PRTD approved based on H&C ground as my wife and kids are in Canada and they are here for 3 years. Still I have not moved due to current COVID situation. I need advice on the below:

1) Shall I go for PR renewal now? but I can only stay for 60 days
2) Shall I relinquish PR and apply for visitors' visa. Any chances that my visitors' visa can be rejected?
3) Will it impact my future request for PR through spousal sponsorship program?
4) Will it affect my family Citizen application?

Appreciate expert advice on the above.

Thanks
I would further caution that even if you apply for and obtain a new PR card, that will not entirely restart the clock in regards to future Residency Obligation compliance. Possession of a valid PR card does NOT factor into calculating RO compliance.

Generally, the positive H&C determination will allow the PR to travel to and from abroad with minimal risk of a new RO compliance examination at the Port-of-Entry when entering Canada. That means even though you might have been IN Canada fewer than 730 days within the previous five years, as of the day you arrive at the Port-of-Entry, the H&C decision is in effect honoured and usually, ordinarily, that means the individual is NOT issued an Inadmissibility report.

BUT if you move back abroad, or are otherwise abroad for extended periods of time, that can be, and is fairly likely to be, considered a change in circumstances. In this event, you might be examined for RO compliance any time you enter Canada based on the number of days you have been IN Canada as of that day. The previous H&C decision may help, or it could hurt.

Bottom-line: even getting a new PR card might not work for you if you go back abroad to stay for an extended period of time.

Other questions:

Relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC.

Nor should it have any detrimental impact on another family member's citizenship application . . . noting, however, if there are reasons to question a citizenship applicant's accounting of days in Canada, the range of factors that a decision-maker can consider, in weighing the evidence, obviously includes ties the individual has abroad, and of course a spouse living abroad is a rather significant tie.

In regards to the prospect of being granted visitor status, again, relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC. In contrast, though, your personal history would tend to indicate you are not at much risk for overstaying, so in that sense it could actually help. That said, there is NO guarantee that Canada will allow any Foreign National to visit Canada, and in general FNs who are not visa exempt typically face a higher burden of persuasion when applying for visitor status.
 
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salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
Assume you said you wanted to move back permanently or else PRTD based on H&C would likely not have been approved. You can enter Canada and apply for a PR card. If you don't meet your RO again there are good chances you won't be given the second PRTD based on H&C. If you renounce your PR status there is no guarantee you will be awarded a TRV. If you fail to meet your RO again and are refused a PRTD based on H&C then I would renounce your PR status and apply for sponsorship.
can you advice in case I get my PR Renewed based on H&C, then the clock for RO starts again or I will still be at risk at the POE to be questioned regarding the RO and absence from the country for 6 to 8 months?
 

salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
I would further caution that even if you apply for and obtain a new PR card, that will not entirely restart the clock in regards to future Residency Obligation compliance. Possession of a valid PR card does NOT factor into calculating RO compliance.

Generally, the positive H&C determination will allow the PR to travel to and from abroad with minimal risk of a new RO compliance examination at the Port-of-Entry when entering Canada. That means even though you might have been IN Canada fewer than 730 days within the previous five years, as of the day you arrive at the Port-of-Entry, the H&C decision is in effect honoured and usually, ordinarily, that means the individual is NOT issued an Inadmissibility report.

BUT if you move back abroad, or are otherwise abroad for extended periods of time, that can be, and is fairly likely to be, considered a change in circumstances. In this event, you might be examined for RO compliance any time you enter Canada based on the number of days you have been IN Canada as of that day. The previous H&C decision may help, or it could hurt.

Bottom-line: even getting a new PR card might not work for you if you go back abroad to stay for an extended period of time.

Other questions:

Relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC.

Nor should it have any detrimental impact on another family member's citizenship application . . . noting, however, if there are reasons to question a citizenship applicant's accounting of days in Canada, the range of factors that a decision-maker can consider, in weighing the evidence, obviously includes ties the individual has abroad, and of course a spouse living abroad is a rather significant tie.

In regards to the prospect of being granted visitor status, again, relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC. In contrast, though, your personal history would tend to indicate you are not at much risk for overstaying, so in that sense it could actually help. That said, there is NO guarantee that Canada will allow any Foreign National to visit Canada, and in general FNs who are not visa exempt typically face a higher burden of persuasion when applying for visitor status.

Thanks for a detailed reply. Can you advice what would be the best option for the person who is not ready to move permanently, family citizenship is important to get and then after period of 3 years from now, he can move permanently for good. As you mentioned new PR will not going to help and I will still be questioned at the POE regarding the RO compliance. This makes it difficult then.
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,267
3,028
Thanks for a detailed reply. Can you advice what would be the best option for the person who is not ready to move permanently, family citizenship is important to get and then after period of 3 years from now, he can move permanently for good. As you mentioned new PR will not going to help and I will still be questioned at the POE regarding the RO compliance. This makes it difficult then.
I am not qualified to offer advice.

Any advice offered in this forum should be approached with elevated skepticism . . . THIS IS NOT a PROPER VENUE for GIVING ADVICE. For advice, see a licensed, reputable professional!

This forum is a good resource for sharing information and experiences. Advice in the nature of what is obvious or at least conventional wisdom, as in what is generally well understood, is OK. And I offer some of that, advice like "follow the instructions," "be honest," and "for a PR in breach of the Residency Obligation, the sooner the PR returns to Canada the better the PR's chances of keeping PR status."

A big, big part of why this forum is not suitable for giving or obtaining advice is the extent to which many individual details, the particular facts and circumstances in the individual person's case, can and will influence how things go. NOT a good idea to come anywhere near close to sharing enough personal details here to even approach engaging in a useful analysis. And, anyway, future contingencies play a huge role in how things will actually go.

For example: as I previously noted, absent what is referred to as a "change in circumstances," the positive H&C decision mostly will, in effect, reset the Residency Obligation clock. What will constitute a "change in circumstances" will vary greatly from one person to another. Generally, short trips abroad are not at all likely to trigger RO compliance questions or issues. But it would be very, very difficult to forecast if and when the amount of time abroad might trigger RO compliance questions upon arrival at the Port-of-Entry (PoE) when returning to Canada.

If, for example, you come to Canada for a time, and obtain a new PR card, it is fairly likely you could leave and return to Canada several times without being questioned, at the PoE, about RO compliance, even though the RO still applies and even though you have not been IN Canada at least 730 days within the five years preceding the date you are examined upon arrival here. But as I also previously mentioned, if you go abroad for extended periods of time, notwithstanding the previous favourable H&C decision, the border officials can examine you in regards to RO compliance and if you have not been IN Canada at least 730 days within the preceding five years, as of that day, determine you are in breach of the RO and make a decision to terminate your PR status.

Beyond that the variability of circumstances, and the vagaries of decision-making, make it incredibly difficult to predict how things will go. Just the number of days here, number of days abroad, frequency of the travel, and so on, can affect how it goes. The basics are clear: the longer you are in Canada, and the more frequently you return to Canada after you go abroad, and the sooner you make the move to actually stay in Canada, the better your chances of not running into a problem. But translating that rather imprecise outline into a practical plan, a reliable plan, is very difficult, and is moreover subject to all the vagaries of real life contingencies the future will likely throw at you.

And for you, there is no guarantee you will actually be issued a new PR card . . . and even if issued one, whether that will be done before you need to go abroad again. Thus, for example, even if a new PR card is issued it might not be mailed to you but instead require an in-person pick-up; if in the meantime you have gone abroad, you will once again need to apply for a PR Travel Document in order to return to Canada in order to pick up the PR card in person. There is a real RISK of a negative decision for that PR TD application, despite the necessarily positive H&C decision underlying the issuance of a new PR card.

It gets complicated. There are many directions in which things can go.

ALL THAT SAID: There is no harm in trying. And if you apply for and are issued a new PR card, a PR card you actually receive, that will, at the least, give you some more time . . . from several months, to a year, perhaps even two . . . with how long again subject to variables like how often and for how long you return to Canada. And as a person with family settled in Canada, even if you encounter a negative RO compliance decision in the future, if by then you are ready to settle and stay in Canada, you probably have decent odds of being allowed to keep PR status in an appeal. Again, it gets complicated. The main thing is to recognize the limitations and be prepared to deal with contingencies.

In regards to some of the vagaries in how things go, the contingencies: as already noted, the date a PR card expires is not relevant if and when PoE officials are examining a PR for RO compliance. But, presenting a valid PR card, and particularly one whose date of expiration is two or more years away, increases the chances a returning PR will not even be questioned about RO compliance. After all, the vast majority of PRs are not asked questions about RO compliance when they go through border control. In contrast, the longer the absence, the bigger the risk there will be RO compliance questions. Lots and lots of variability in how things will actually go for a particular individual.

Spouse-sponsored PR back-up plan: The PR with a spouse living in Canada who is qualified to sponsor the individual for PR, if necessary (if PR status is lost), fortunately has a back-up plan. Even this, however, is subject to the vagaries of real life contingencies . . . not too long ago, for example, a forum participant suffered the sudden, unexpected death of his spouse, which closed the door on the back-up plan. In his case their children, living in Canada, were still dependents, still minors, so there was a big, big H&C factor based on the interests of minor children which enabled him to get relief and keep PR status despite having spent very little time in Canada himself. But of course he had to actually relocate to Canada and I have not seen any follow-up reports about how that has gone.
 
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salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
I am not qualified to offer advice.

Any advice offered in this forum should be approached with elevated skepticism . . . THIS IS NOT a PROPER VENUE for GIVING ADVICE. For advice, see a licensed, reputable professional!

This forum is a good resource for sharing information and experiences. Advice in the nature of what is obvious or at least conventional wisdom, as in what is generally well understood, is OK. And I offer some of that, advice like "follow the instructions," "be honest," and "for a PR in breach of the Residency Obligation, the sooner the PR returns to Canada the better the PR's chances of keeping PR status."

A big, big part of why this forum is not suitable for giving or obtaining advice is the extent to which many individual details, the particular facts and circumstances in the individual person's case, can and will influence how things go. NOT a good idea to come anywhere near close to sharing enough personal details here to even approach engaging in a useful analysis. And, anyway, future contingencies play a huge role in how things will actually go.

For example: as I previously noted, absent what is referred to as a "change in circumstances," the positive H&C decision mostly will, in effect, reset the Residency Obligation clock. What will constitute a "change in circumstances" will vary greatly from one person to another. Generally, short trips abroad are not at all likely to trigger RO compliance questions or issues. But it would be very, very difficult to forecast if and when the amount of time abroad might trigger RO compliance questions upon arrival at the Port-of-Entry (PoE) when returning to Canada.

If, for example, you come to Canada for a time, and obtain a new PR card, it is fairly likely you could leave and return to Canada several times without being questioned, at the PoE, about RO compliance, even though the RO still applies and even though you have not been IN Canada at least 730 days within the five years preceding the date you are examined upon arrival here. But as I also previously mentioned, if you go abroad for extended periods of time, notwithstanding the previous favourable H&C decision, the border officials can examine you in regards to RO compliance and if you have not been IN Canada at least 730 days within the preceding five years, as of that day, determine you are in breach of the RO and make a decision to terminate your PR status.

Beyond that the variability of circumstances, and the vagaries of decision-making, make it incredibly difficult to predict how things will go. Just the number of days here, number of days abroad, frequency of the travel, and so on, can affect how it goes. The basics are clear: the longer you are in Canada, and the more frequently you return to Canada after you go abroad, and the sooner you make the move to actually stay in Canada, the better your chances of not running into a problem. But translating that rather imprecise outline into a practical plan, a reliable plan, is very difficult, and is moreover subject to all the vagaries of real life contingencies the future will likely throw at you.

And for you, there is no guarantee you will actually be issued a new PR card . . . and even if issued one, whether that will be done before you need to go abroad again. Thus, for example, even if a new PR card is issued it might not be mailed to you but instead require an in-person pick-up; if in the meantime you have gone abroad, you will once again need to apply for a PR Travel Document in order to return to Canada in order to pick up the PR card in person. There is a real RISK of a negative decision for that PR TD application, despite the necessarily positive H&C decision underlying the issuance of a new PR card.

It gets complicated. There are many directions in which things can go.

ALL THAT SAID: There is no harm in trying. And if you apply for and are issued a new PR card, a PR card you actually receive, that will, at the least, give you some more time . . . from several months, to a year, perhaps even two . . . with how long again subject to variables like how often and for how long you return to Canada. And as a person with family settled in Canada, even if you encounter a negative RO compliance decision in the future, if by then you are ready to settle and stay in Canada, you probably have decent odds of being allowed to keep PR status in an appeal. Again, it gets complicated. The main thing is to recognize the limitations and be prepared to deal with contingencies.

In regards to some of the vagaries in how things go, the contingencies: as already noted, the date a PR card expires is not relevant if and when PoE officials are examining a PR for RO compliance. But, presenting a valid PR card, and particularly one whose date of expiration is two or more years away, increases the chances a returning PR will not even be questioned about RO compliance. After all, the vast majority of PRs are not asked questions about RO compliance when they go through border control. In contrast, the longer the absence, the bigger the risk there will be RO compliance questions. Lots and lots of variability in how things will actually go for a particular individual.

Spouse-sponsored PR back-up plan: The PR with a spouse living in Canada who is qualified to sponsor the individual for PR, if necessary (if PR status is lost), fortunately has a back-up plan. Even this, however, is subject to the vagaries of real life contingencies . . . not too long ago, for example, a forum participant suffered the sudden, unexpected death of his spouse, which closed the door on the back-up plan. In his case their children, living in Canada, were still dependents, still minors, so there was a big, big H&C factor based on the interests of minor children which enabled him to get relief and keep PR status despite having spent very little time in Canada himself. But of course he had to actually relocate to Canada and I have not seen any follow-up reports about how that has gone.
Thanks dpenabill. I don't know how to thank you for your post. Its so detailed and clear. One more, possibly last question. In my case, PR renewal with H&C ground is a better route or relinquishing and getting TRV is more preferred. The preference meaning the chances of getting it in favor.

Thanks and God bless you!
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
15,364
7,832
Thanks dpenabill. I don't know how to thank you for your post. Its so detailed and clear. One more, possibly last question. In my case, PR renewal with H&C ground is a better route or relinquishing and getting TRV is more preferred. The preference meaning the chances of getting it in favor.
I'm not sure I followed the full reasoning or question you posed here. But in terms of a brief simple response: I don't see any significant advantage in giving up the current PR status (by renouncing in the immediate) given you have a PRTD and the possibility to apply for a PR card (whether or not it is issued). Your own plans may change in favour of remaining in Canada, for example, in the near term. And equally I don't see any significant disadvantages in attempting to retain your PR status - again, in the immediate - and no serious long-term repercussions if you are honest and straightforward.

Beyond that, too many vagaries of fate and elements unknown. If at some point it makes sense to renounce, you can do that then.
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,267
3,028
Thanks dpenabill. I don't know how to thank you for your post. Its so detailed and clear. One more, possibly last question. In my case, PR renewal with H&C ground is a better route or relinquishing and getting TRV is more preferred. The preference meaning the chances of getting it in favor.

Thanks and God bless you!
Again, I am not qualified to give advice as such. Really. This is not merely a perfunctory caveat.

What I tried to outline and emphasize in my previous post was much depends on not only the particular details in your current situation, but on future contingencies. Some future circumstances are fairly easy to predict, many others not so much. So someone in your current situation is confronted with making some judgment calls, some very personal decisions, and in doing so should recognize that there is no way to make For-Sure plans.

But I also tried, clumsily (@armoured described this more succinctly), to also illuminate that there is no harm in pursuing a path that will continue your PR status for as long as you can. Suggesting (but not advising or recommending, because I really am not qualified to do that) that if feasible, if practical, applying for a new PR card is probably a good way to go . . . recognizing the chance it may run into issues, and being prepared for that, and recognizing the contingencies if it succeeds and being prepared for those (for example, realizing that if it succeeds, you may still need to deal with RO compliance issues in the not-so-distant future).

I realize your question is more immediate, about the relative prospect of success if you apply for a new PR card or relinquish PR status and rely on getting visitor status to visit family until you and your spouse are prepared to pursue a spouse-sponsored-PR application. But the TRV option remains available (subject to IRCC discretion in granting a TRV) if you pursue applying for a new PR card and that fails. The prospects for being issued a TRV will not be hurt if you first pursue getting a new PR card. Otherwise I would guess, but it is just a guess, that just comparing what is more likely to succeed, that would probably be getting the TRV . . . but my impression is that most PRs will choose to pursue keeping PR status as long as they can unless the long term plan is simply to give up on being a Canadian PR altogether.
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
15,364
7,832
But I also tried, clumsily (@armoured described this more succinctly), to also illuminate that there is no harm in pursuing a path that will continue your PR status for as long as you can.
It's kind of you but I glossed over (avoided completely) the difficult questions of when it may make sense to abandon attempts to retain PR status (eg renounce and apply for TRV / re-apply for PR sponsorship) - which is the real crux of the issue, and to which there can only be guesses.

But yes, I think a reasonable guess is that in most cases (but perhaps not all) will make sense to (attempt to) retain PR status until the disadvantages of the process outweigh the convenience and relative certainty in the near term.

Alas, a simple statement, but so general it may not help much.
 
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salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
Again, I am not qualified to give advice as such. Really. This is not merely a perfunctory caveat.

What I tried to outline and emphasize in my previous post was much depends on not only the particular details in your current situation, but on future contingencies. Some future circumstances are fairly easy to predict, many others not so much. So someone in your current situation is confronted with making some judgment calls, some very personal decisions, and in doing so should recognize that there is no way to make For-Sure plans.

But I also tried, clumsily (@armoured described this more succinctly), to also illuminate that there is no harm in pursuing a path that will continue your PR status for as long as you can. Suggesting (but not advising or recommending, because I really am not qualified to do that) that if feasible, if practical, applying for a new PR card is probably a good way to go . . . recognizing the chance it may run into issues, and being prepared for that, and recognizing the contingencies if it succeeds and being prepared for those (for example, realizing that if it succeeds, you may still need to deal with RO compliance issues in the not-so-distant future).

I realize your question is more immediate, about the relative prospect of success if you apply for a new PR card or relinquish PR status and rely on getting visitor status to visit family until you and your spouse are prepared to pursue a spouse-sponsored-PR application. But the TRV option remains available (subject to IRCC discretion in granting a TRV) if you pursue applying for a new PR card and that fails. The prospects for being issued a TRV will not be hurt if you first pursue getting a new PR card. Otherwise I would guess, but it is just a guess, that just comparing what is more likely to succeed, that would probably be getting the TRV . . . but my impression is that most PRs will choose to pursue keeping PR status as long as they can unless the long term plan is simply to give up on being a Canadian PR altogether.
Once again thanks for your well-articulated reply. Its convincing for me. I know now what I should do and the backup plan for the same.
 

salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
It's kind of you but I glossed over (avoided completely) the difficult questions of when it may make sense to abandon attempts to retain PR status (eg renounce and apply for TRV / re-apply for PR sponsorship) - which is the real crux of the issue, and to which there can only be guesses.

But yes, I think a reasonable guess is that in most cases (but perhaps not all) will make sense to (attempt to) retain PR status until the disadvantages of the process outweigh the convenience and relative certainty in the near term.

Alas, a simple statement, but so general it may not help much.
Agree with you.
 
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May 3, 2021
2
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I got PRTD approved based on H&C ground as my wife and kids are in Canada and they are here for 3 years. Still I have not moved due to current COVID situation. I need advice on the below:

1) Shall I go for PR renewal now? but I can only stay for 60 days
2) Shall I relinquish PR and apply for visitors' visa. Any chances that my visitors' visa can be rejected?
3) Will it impact my future request for PR through spousal sponsorship program?
4) Will it affect my family Citizen application?

Appreciate expert advice on the above.

Thanks
I am sorry but I have a question for you if you do not mind. How much time did it take you to receive your PRTD? I applied through mail about a month ago and no news, yet. Thank you
 

salkab

Full Member
Apr 9, 2015
29
1
I am sorry but I have a question for you if you do not mind. How much time did it take you to receive your PRTD? I applied through mail about a month ago and no news, yet. Thank you
It took me 1 month to get the approval, it also includes one interview by an officer on phone. It doesn’t include the time passport sent to embassy for visa stamping and receiving back. This process took another a week or 10 days
 

candadream

Full Member
Jun 24, 2021
45
0
I would further caution that even if you apply for and obtain a new PR card, that will not entirely restart the clock in regards to future Residency Obligation compliance. Possession of a valid PR card does NOT factor into calculating RO compliance.

Generally, the positive H&C determination will allow the PR to travel to and from abroad with minimal risk of a new RO compliance examination at the Port-of-Entry when entering Canada. That means even though you might have been IN Canada fewer than 730 days within the previous five years, as of the day you arrive at the Port-of-Entry, the H&C decision is in effect honoured and usually, ordinarily, that means the individual is NOT issued an Inadmissibility report.

BUT if you move back abroad, or are otherwise abroad for extended periods of time, that can be, and is fairly likely to be, considered a change in circumstances. In this event, you might be examined for RO compliance any time you enter Canada based on the number of days you have been IN Canada as of that day. The previous H&C decision may help, or it could hurt.

Bottom-line: even getting a new PR card might not work for you if you go back abroad to stay for an extended period of time.

Other questions:

Relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC.

Nor should it have any detrimental impact on another family member's citizenship application . . . noting, however, if there are reasons to question a citizenship applicant's accounting of days in Canada, the range of factors that a decision-maker can consider, in weighing the evidence, obviously includes ties the individual has abroad, and of course a spouse living abroad is a rather significant tie.

In regards to the prospect of being granted visitor status, again, relinquishing PR status, or losing it due to inadmissibility based on non-compliance with RO, will not, not ordinarily, have any negative impact on future applications to IRCC. In contrast, though, your personal history would tend to indicate you are not at much risk for overstaying, so in that sense it could actually help. That said, there is NO guarantee that Canada will allow any Foreign National to visit Canada, and in general FNs who are not visa exempt typically face a higher burden of persuasion when applying for visitor status.
This is a very detailed answer.

I want to know what if you get your PR, then get the PRTD to go abroad (study 1 year) and then come back and live in Canada for the next 4 years.

When will the person be questioned about their Residence Obligations? Once he is back after 1 year study or anytime they come back to the country or only at the end of the 5 years?