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Proof of PR, don't travel without it?

Oki911

Full Member
Feb 18, 2016
24
1
If you travel to outside of Canada (eg. overseas), and you lose your PR-Card for whatever reason during your trip, after March 15, you will not be able to board the plane back to Canada, unless you have obtain a PR travel document (PRTD).

However, the processing time, apparently is 1 to 2 weeks, provided that you prove that you met your obligations as a PR. That is the question. How stringent is this approval process, and how on earth are you going to supply supporting evidence, unless you prepared a package proving PR status somehow.

I'm thinking of scanning all the documents I would use for the PR-Card application, and create an encrypted zip file or some other means of encrypting an archive, and place it on the internet (eg. Google drive).
Then, should I be faced with having to prove my PR status to a Visa Application Centre, I could just pull that zip file off the net, unpack it, print it all out, and slap it all together in an envelope and express courier it. Describe how you were able to produce such detailed information given you're outside the country, because it might not be usual for people to carry around T4s and tax assessment notices and whatnot.
It's then hoping that a travel document arrives back in time, or else the return flight has to be rescheduled. Some airline companies might let you reschedule a flight for a fee.

Or just fly to a US destination. But that kind of sucks too, because what, fly to like Boston, take a train to Niagara, walk across the bridge, do the customs thing, and take a train to Ottawa? Those train tickets alone cost more than a rescheduled return flight, or a new one way flight I bet.

That PR-Card has a credit card format. Easy to stick in your wallet. I think this is a bad idea. Some countries have way more pick pocket incidences than you hear about in Canada. In some places, these criminals work in teams. Your PR-Card in your wallet in your back jeans pocket is not safe.
Why can't they just scan my eye retina and be done with it? No more passports or PR-Cards or PRTD or eTAs or whatever. Just scan and go.
 

ttrajan

Champion Member
Oct 14, 2013
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It won't happen soon. At least they can reduce the PR card renewal processing time to one month. Now processing time is around 6 months?
 

Oki911

Full Member
Feb 18, 2016
24
1
I didn't mean proof of PR-Card, but proof of being a permanent resident.
See, if you lose your card while you're outside the country, you can not fly back until you obtain a PRTD (travel document from a visa office in or near the country you're traveling back to Canada from).
The problem then is that you're asked questions, and you might not be able to answer those questions unless you've prepped some documents that would support that are a permanent resident.
I would expect that the approval process isn't anywhere near as stringent as the approval process of renewing a PR-Card. But still, do they ask questions that are impossible to answer if you're abroad when completely unprepared and not having access to your filing cabinet at home or whatnot?
What questions are asked? I haven't seen the form, but based a comment somewhere, you're scrutinized if you live in Canada.
Perhaps something like a driver's license, bank / credit cards, bills, is enough? But who brings bills and whatnot on vacation?
Do people end up calling people in Canada to go to their house, having to scramble for documents that might support the validity of one's permanent residence claim?
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,283
3,042
For information about applying for a PR TD see:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/travel-document/index.asp​

and​

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/applications/travel.asp​




For the application form itself, see:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/forms/IMM5524E.pdf

For the checklist of documents to be submitted with the application, see:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/forms/IMM5627E.pdf
 

Oki911

Full Member
Feb 18, 2016
24
1
Re IMM5627E, the document checklist,

7. Evidence of your permanent resident status in Canada, such as:
• a Record of Landing or Confirmation of Permanent Residence or, if the document was lost or stolen, a police report documenting the
circumstances of the loss,
• an expired permanent resident card or, if your card was lost or stolen, a police report documenting the circumstances of the loss,
• employment documents,
• financial documents,
• Revenue Canada Notice of Assessment forms,
• evidence of receipt of benefits from Canadian government programs,
• rental agreements,
• club memberships, etc.

The IMM1000, a previous expired PR Card (I thought they tell you to destroy that when a new one arrives), employment status (eg. payslips), CRA assessment forms, rental agreements, are probably at home, and not available when traveling. For financial documents, you might be able to log in to your bank and/or credit card companies, and print out statements. Club memberships, a friend might be able to write a letter stating that you're a member, but I don't know if that will hold any water.

See what I mean? You're left with questions that a person can't answer, unless either someone from home, forwards stuff, or else you have all this digitized ready to be used.
 

Buletruck

VIP Member
May 18, 2015
6,687
2,531
Really, the process is no different than loosing your passport or having it stolen. Ever lost your wallet in Canada and tried to replace your drivers license? Talk about jumping through hoops to gather up adequate documentation to prove who you are. There is the burden of proof that you are who you say you are and that you're in compliance if you are trying to obtain any government issued document. And in a situation where its lost or stolen, the embassies overseas are extremely helpful (been there, done that...twice....once stolen, once when I got nudged into the water boarding a ferry) at working with you to get the documentation you need. The extent of the documentation required is probably more for those who have been out of Canada for extended periods and run the risk of not meeting residency requirements (it's easier to deal with someone who hasn't met the requirements if they aren't in Canada). If you are travelling, you're likely going to take you PR card with you, and if you don't well...expect the third degree.....plain and simple. It would be in your best interest to leave copies (PR Card, passport, other important documents) with family or friends in case of such an emergency. But being proactive makes sense to me.......
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,283
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Oki911 said:
. . . a previous expired PR Card (I thought they tell you to destroy that when a new one arrives)
A significant number of PRs in this situation, where they need a PR TD to board a flight headed for Canada, either had to leave Canada on short notice and did not have time to renew an expired or expiring PR card before embarking on the trip, or their PR card otherwise expired while they have been abroad. A valid PR card is proof of PR status. An expired PR card is evidence tending to prove PR status, and thus is useful to submit when making a PR TD application.

Indeed, even within Canada some government entities will accept an expired PR card as proof of status (in Ontario, for example, last I looked OHIP accepted expired PR cards (up to five years after expiration) to document PR status for purposes of OHIP eligibility).
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
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Buletruck said:
Really, the process is no different than loosing your passport or having it stolen.
A little different since in assessing eligibility for a PR TD, IRCC will make a Residency Determination to ascertain that the PR is in compliance with the PR RO.

In particular, to obtain a Travel Document (or temporary passport) abroad in event of losing one's Canadian passport, the individual only has to establish (1) identity, and (2) status (citizenship status).

To be issued a PR TD, however, the PR not only has to establish both identity and status (PR status), but to also establish compliance with the PR Residency Obligation.

PRs abroad who lose both their passport (from home country) plus their PR card, and who were not obviously just temporarily traveling abroad, can indeed incur some severe difficulty if IRCC has doubts about the PR's compliance with the PR Residency Obligation. The importance of safeguarding important documents can not be overstated.
 

steaky

VIP Member
Nov 11, 2008
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Oki911 said:
Perhaps something like a driver's license, bank / credit cards, bills, is enough? But who brings bills and whatnot on vacation?
Well, couldn't you get your credit card bills and other invoices (such as crossing toll bridges) from your email account?

Also, during your travel, couldn't you view and download your latest notice of assessment through "My Account" in CRA website assuming you had previously sign in and register yours in the website?