PR card expiration date and travel history for renewal

[Westcoastx]

Hi I'm in a bit of a situation regarding my pr card renewal..
I'm a Canadian permanent resident, and my wife and I are leaving Canada by car to the U.S. for most of the month of March and plan on returning by car on March 28, which is the same day of my pr card expiration date, March 28.
Question is.. Will my pr card be invalid on or after the expiration date? Is March 28 the last day it would still be valid?
Just wondering if we need to change our return date from vacation.

Also, if my pr card renewal application is in process, would that make it okay for me to reenter Canada after the expiration date?

Another issue is that I'm having a problem filling out the renewal application where it asks for my travel history for the past 5 years.
Does that only mean how many days I stayed overnight outside of Canada? Or does that also include all the times I drove into the U.S. and returned the same day?
Because the problem with that is for 3 of the past 5 years I had a job where I had to leave Canada and drive back and forth across the border every single day, 4 and 5 days per week...not to mention the hundred times or so I left Canada to go shopping for a few hours each time in the past 5 years.
No way I could possibly come up with any real accurate numbers there.
Difficult enough to come up with accurate numbers for all the days outside Canada on vacation in the past 5 years.
The renewal application form only has a few lines to put all the dates I was outside Canada in the past 5 years so I have no idea what to do with that.
And then there's also a line on the renewal application that asks if I'd give consent for them to get all of my border crossing info from the border agency...So since I have a ton of travel history in and out of Canada for the past 5 years and there's no room on the form for it, could I just leave the travel history question blank and just give consent for them to check my history themselves?

I've been trying to contact Immigration about all of my questions and concerns, but they never answer the phone and they still haven't replied to my emails yet.

 

[armoured]

Hi I'm in a bit of a situation regarding my pr card renewal..
I'm a Canadian permanent resident, and my wife and I are leaving Canada by car to the U.S. for most of the month of March and plan on returning by car on March 28, which is the same day of my pr card expiration date, March 28.
Question is.. Will my pr card be invalid on or after the expiration date? Is March 28 the last day it would still be valid?
Just wondering if we need to change our return date from vacation.

I'm assuming you are compliant with residency obligation.

If you're returning by car, you'll be fine either way - show the card and other supporting ID and just say renewal not complete yet. (You would have trouble potentially flying back, separate issue - car is easier in this respect).

To be clear, it won't matter if you return AFTER your card is expired either. THe PR card is not your status as a PR, it does not 'expire.'

Also, if my pr card renewal application is in process, would that make it okay for me to reenter Canada after the expiration date?

It doesn't matter BUT having reapplied and being able to say with confidence (or even wave your copy of travel histroy) to show compliance won't hurt. They probably won't analyze in detail.

Another issue is that I'm having a problem filling out the renewal application where it asks for my travel history for the past 5 years.
Does that only mean how many days I stayed overnight outside of Canada? Or does that also include all the times I drove into the U.S. and returned the same day?

Any day where you are in Canada for any length of time counts towards physical residence. So even days you depart and don't come back or return just before midnight - it counts. You left and came back in same day (from either country)? It counts.

The renewal application form only has a few lines to put all the dates I was outside Canada in the past 5 years so I have no idea what to do with that.
And then there's also a line on the renewal application that asks if I'd give consent for them to get all of my border crossing info from the border agency...So since I have a ton of travel history in and out of Canada for the past 5 years and there's no room on the form for it, could I just leave the travel history question blank and just give consent for them to check my history themselves?

You just provide a table of your days outside of Canada, separate sheet of paper if necessary. Don't leave it blank even if you let them access your records.

You can provide a letter of explanation (short) that you crossed border a lot of days and returned.

The one wrinkle (I think) - you REALLY shouldn't leave any days you were outside of Canada (all day) off your table. A mistake or two of a couple of days if you have a lot of days in total (say, over 850 days) probably won't get much of a second look. Lots of errors that get you close to the 730 days might hurt your credibility and slow things down.

 

[Westcoastx]

I'm assuming you are compliant with residency obligation.

If you're returning by car, you'll be fine either way - show the card and other supporting ID and just say renewal not complete yet. (You would have trouble potentially flying back, separate issue - car is easier in this respect).

To be clear, it won't matter if you return AFTER your card is expired either. THe PR card is not your status as a PR, it does not 'expire.'



It doesn't matter BUT having reapplied and being able to say with confidence (or even wave your copy of travel histroy) to show compliance won't hurt. They probably won't analyze in detail.



Any day where you are in Canada for any length of time counts towards physical residence. So even days you depart and don't come back or return just before midnight - it counts. You left and came back in same day (from either country)? It counts.



You just provide a table of your days outside of Canada, separate sheet of paper if necessary. Don't leave it blank even if you let them access your records.

You can provide a letter of explanation (short) that you crossed border a lot of days and returned.

The one wrinkle (I think) - you REALLY shouldn't leave any days you were outside of Canada (all day) off your table. A mistake or two of a couple of days if you have a lot of days in total (say, over 850 days) probably won't get much of a second look. Lots of errors that get you close to the 730 days might hurt your credibility and slow things down.

Thanks.. Based on what you said and what seems to be the consensus here, I feel alot better now about driving back into Canada with my pr card expired. That was my biggest concern.

And it'll be alot easier now just figuring out how many full days I spent outside Canada in the past 5 years, rather than every time I left Canada for any amount of time.

One other question.. Does the receipt that they received my renewal application come by regular mail or email?

 

[canuck78]

Thanks.. Based on what you said and what seems to be the consensus here, I feel alot better now about driving back into Canada with my pr card expired. That was my biggest concern.

And it'll be alot easier now just figuring out how many full days I spent outside Canada in the past 5 years, rather than every time I left Canada for any amount of time.

One other question.. Does the receipt that they received my renewal application come by regular mail or email?

You still are required to put all your exit end entries out of Canada. You can’t just include the full days.

 

[armoured]

And it'll be alot easier now just figuring out how many full days I spent outside Canada in the past 5 years, rather than every time I left Canada for any amount of time.

Please note the comment that you do need to list all exits and entries.

 

[Westcoastx]

Please note the comment that you do need to list all exits and entries.

Oh I thought you meant it was only about the full days I was out of Canada.

There's no way I can possibly figure out the amount of times I left Canada just for a few hours for work and shopping over the past 5 years. It's well over a thousand times that I left Canada for work 4-5 times every week and all the shopping days. I couldn't even be 100% accurate within a few hundred.

 

[steaky]

Oh I thought you meant it was only about the full days I was out of Canada.

There's no way I can possibly figure out the amount of times I left Canada just for a few hours for work and shopping over the past 5 years. It's well over a thousand times that I left Canada for work 4-5 times every week and all the shopping days. I couldn't even be 100% accurate within a few hundred.

But you can request your entry record from the government.

 

[Westcoastx]

But you can request your entry record from the government.

But wouldn't that be the identical entry record that I would be giving consent to them to look at on the renewal application?

 

[armoured]

Oh I thought you meant it was only about the full days I was out of Canada.

There's no way I can possibly figure out the amount of times I left Canada just for a few hours for work and shopping over the past 5 years. It's well over a thousand times that I left Canada for work 4-5 times every week and all the shopping days. I couldn't even be 100% accurate within a few hundred.

Sorry, others I'm sure are correct.

It IS all about the number of days in Canada - in substance. But I guess you have to show everything else.

But as above: the main thing is to have the days you were outside of Canada accurate (out for full days). If you're quite certain others are right in that you aren't leaving out any days you were outside etc there's less risk (but letter of explanation that you effectively were commuting).

Still likely better to get your entry/exit records. Good luck.