Possible removal order? Seniors please help

[PHCA]

Hello seniors, I am so anxious so I decided to make new thread hoping somebody could give me advice.

I have yet to complete my RO of 730 days on October 30, 2017. Upon coming back to Canada, the customs officer saw in my declaration that I was last in Canada in July 2011 thus she referred me to fall in line and speak with immigration officer. IO checked asked why I was away and I explained I had to finish my degree and gave him the response letter from Canadian Embassy in Manila as I asked permission if I can still return to Canada. It was a general answer that as long as I have my valid PR then I can return. I offered my school documents to IO but he refused and let me in. Please note that I returned October 30, 2015 and my PR card expired December 2016.

Since then I am keeping myself away from any activity whatsoever that concerns immigration as I am very anxious until I get my PR card renewed. My mom applied tourist visa two weeks ago as she will visit me in December. She had to put my name and address in her application to indicate that she will be visiting me together with my brothers and stepdad.

Now I am worried that visa officer will see my name and check my record and detect that I am currently in breach of my RO and will send me departure order anytime.

PLEASE PLEASE ADVICE!!!!

 

[Bs65]

So just to clarify the dates you came back into the country October 30 2015 having been away since July 2011 but your PR card expired December 2016 so assume was issued December 2011 and was not the first one ?

Others can comment and only CBSA/IRCC would know but I would have thought you would have heard since October 2015 whether any revoke proceedings had been initiated especially as you went to a secondary review.

As for an application for your mother to visit being tied to you not meeting RO only IRCC could answer that. But not myself being familiar with the questions on a TRV form it seems a long shot to ID you just going by your name and address unless the form also asks for for your name/DOB/Passport # and PR details.

Just keep in mind this is only a forum that cannot predict IRCC actions but with the time since your last landing and not having heard anything the odds look in your favour.

 

[PHCA]

So just to clarify the dates you came back into the country October 30 2015 having been away since July 2011 but your PR card expired December 2016 so assume was issued December 2011 and was not the first one ?

Others can comment and only CBSA/IRCC would know but I would have thought you would have heard since October 2015 whether any revoke proceedings had been initiated especially as you went to a secondary review.

As for an application for your mother to visit being tied to you not meeting RO only IRCC could answer that. But not myself being familiar with the questions on a TRV form it seems a long shot to ID you just going by your name and address unless the form also asks for for your name/DOB/Passport # and PR details.

Just keep in mind this is only a forum that cannot predict IRCC actions but with the time since your last landing and not having heard anything the odds look in your favour.

Hi @Bs65 thank you so much for your response.
I first landed May 2011. Left in July 2011 and came back October 30, 2015. My PR card's expiration was December 2016. That was my first PR card, and I am still waiting to complete my 730 days before I apply for renewal.

I am very very anxious right now because I found out my mother already applied for tourist visa to Canada in Manila and she had to declare that she will be visiting me. It only asked for the name and address. I am now stressing because for sure the visa officer will check me in their system and worried that they will see that I am currently in breach of my RO.. I'm worried I'll receive removal order out of nowhere. Please help.

 

[dpenabill]

I am very very anxious right now because I found out my mother already applied for tourist visa to Canada in Manila and she had to declare that she will be visiting me. It only asked for the name and address. I am now stressing because for sure the visa officer will check me in their system and worried that they will see that I am currently in breach of my RO.

We cannot guess all the circumstances that might trigger a Residency Examination. We know that formal applications to IRCC which depend on valid PR status can trigger a Residency Determination. PR card application. PR TD application. Citizenship application. And, probably formal sponsorship applications, like a PR sponsoring a PR visa application for a spouse or dependent child.

There are no reports of IRCC looking to find PRs in Canada who might be in breach of the PR RO. In following this stuff for nearly a decade, I have seen no one report a problem arising in this situation. So, while I can only guess, it seems very unlikely that this would trigger an inquiry or investigation into your compliance with the RO.

My sense is that is not a cause for worry.

Note: if you are now settling down to live permanently in Canada, that obviates the bulk of any concern IRCC has. IRCC does not go out of its way to catch PRs who have returned to Canada and who are staying in Canada. It is not as if the PR in breach needs to hide or evade IRCC. The thing to avoid is forcing their hand by making any kind of application for which IRCC is obligated to determine compliance with the PR RO. That is why so many advise those who manage to return to Canada without getting reported, to sit tight once in Canada, to wait out two years, and then its basically home free . . . except it can take a good while to get a new PR card, pending which it is better to wait before traveling abroad.


On another note:

You have repeated, a few times now, an account of your PoE experience in 2014. I had the impression that you were examined but allowed to enter WITHOUT being reported. Which I have previously said should be a good thing.

Some of the way you describe that event, however, is not clear.

The important factor is not whether you were allowed to enter Canada or not. As a PR you were entitled to enter Canada. For example, if a PR is reported at the border for being in breach of the PR RO, the PR will still be allowed to enter Canada. The PR must be allowed to enter Canada.

So what is really important is whether or not you were reported at the time of that entry. My interpretation of your description is that you were not reported for being in breach of the PR RO. If that is true, you were not reported, all you need to do is sit tight, stay in Canada, and you will have cured your breach of the PR RO by November.

Still not a good idea to travel abroad after that unless and until you are issued a new PR card, but as long as you stay in Canada, there should be no risk to your PR status. Wait until at least the new year to apply for a new PR card. Stay in Canada unless and until you get a new PR card. And it will work out. (Assuming it is true you were not issued a report back in 2014.)

 

[HamiltonApplicant]

Now I am worried that visa officer will see my name and check my record and detect that I am currently in breach of my RO and will send me departure order anytime.

PLEASE PLEASE ADVICE!!!!

Your mother's mentioning your name in her Visa application is very unlikely to cause you issues

You should focus on your own upcoming PRC renewal, Please read message #18 of the thread
http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/pr-card-transferred-to-local-office-for-further-investigation.508090
and prepare accordingly.

 

[PHCA]

We cannot guess all the circumstances that might trigger a Residency Examination. We know that formal applications to IRCC which depend on valid PR status can trigger a Residency Determination. PR card application. PR TD application. Citizenship application. And, probably formal sponsorship applications, like a PR sponsoring a PR visa application for a spouse or dependent child.

There are no reports of IRCC looking to find PRs in Canada who might be in breach of the PR RO. In following this stuff for nearly a decade, I have seen no one report a problem arising in this situation. So, while I can only guess, it seems very unlikely that this would trigger an inquiry or investigation into your compliance with the RO.

My sense is that is not a cause for worry.

Note: if you are now settling down to live permanently in Canada, that obviates the bulk of any concern IRCC has. IRCC does not go out of its way to catch PRs who have returned to Canada and who are staying in Canada. It is not as if the PR in breach needs to hide or evade IRCC. The thing to avoid is forcing their hand by making any kind of application for which IRCC is obligated to determine compliance with the PR RO. That is why so many advise those who manage to return to Canada without getting reported, to sit tight once in Canada, to wait out two years, and then its basically home free . . . except it can take a good while to get a new PR card, pending which it is better to wait before traveling abroad.


On another note:

You have repeated, a few times now, an account of your PoE experience in 2014. I had the impression that you were examined but allowed to enter WITHOUT being reported. Which I have previously said should be a good thing.

Some of the way you describe that event, however, is not clear.

The important factor is not whether you were allowed to enter Canada or not. As a PR you were entitled to enter Canada. For example, if a PR is reported at the border for being in breach of the PR RO, the PR will still be allowed to enter Canada. The PR must be allowed to enter Canada.

So what is really important is whether or not you were reported at the time of that entry. My interpretation of your description is that you were not reported for being in breach of the PR RO. If that is true, you were not reported, all you need to do is sit tight, stay in Canada, and you will have cured your breach of the PR RO by November.

Still not a good idea to travel abroad after that unless and until you are issued a new PR card, but as long as you stay in Canada, there should be no risk to your PR status. Wait until at least the new year to apply for a new PR card. Stay in Canada unless and until you get a new PR card. And it will work out. (Assuming it is true you were not issued a report back in 2014.)

Thank you very much @dpenabill, you have been very patient and kind - I really appreciate this.
I worry so much because I saw in other posts that PRs that have still yet to complete their RO shouldn't apply for anything that concerns immigration to avoid initiating any investigation or removal orders. I am NOT sponsoring my family's tourist visa, she just had to put my name as I am their reason to visit. I would think that since it is my family's tourist visa application, then immigration wouldn't need to check my RO compliance, correct?

I returned in October 30, 2015 after being away since July 2011. I have been looking at other threads and from what I have read, if IO reports PR for being in breach of PR RO - IO will inform the PR, correct? If there is any departure order or sort of report regarding PR in breach of RO - they will inform PR about it, correct?

As far as I remember this is what happened in my last PoE in October 2015:
Filled out customs declaration form - put July 2011 as my last stay in Canada
Did the procedure in the machine and went in line for customs check. They saw my July 2011 date so she told me to go to immigration line.
Went in line and IO took my passport and PR card and also gave him the letter from Canadian Embassy in Manila - attached to it were my transcript from school as I also submitted those proof to Embassy when I asked permission if I can still return as PR and settle in Canada now that I have graduated. He looked at it, I think he asked me why I was away - told him I had to finish school, he kept on looking at the papers I gave him probably trying to read it perhaps, and then I offered if he wanted more of my supporting documents such as diploma, etc. He said no and returned all my stuff. I remember I even asked if it's all good (meaning if we were done since he already returned all my stuff and I was just standing there), he said yes and I thanked him and left.
I don't remember hearing the word "report" from him or anything like that. I would think that he would have informed/warned me if he did any report, correct?

Yes, I am not planning to renew my PR card until after the new year. I know 800 days is not that much but by that time I know I have really completed my RO and will just have to be hopeful and patient with the processing of my application by then.

 

[PHCA]

Your mother's mentioning your name in her Visa application is very unlikely to cause you issues

You should focus on your own upcoming PRC renewal, Please read message #18 of the thread
http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/threads/pr-card-transferred-to-local-office-for-further-investigation.508090
and prepare accordingly.

Hi @HamiltonApplicant, thank you for your response.
Yes, I am preparing all my supporting documents as early as now, and keeping all bills and receipts so I can have as much proof as I can. I will also consult with a lawyer/consultant before I submit application because like what @dpenabill said in that thread, there might be some inconsistency in the application. I already checked my I-94 since I only travelled to U.S. and Japan in the time I was away. Should I submit those too?

 

[HamiltonApplicant]

Hi @HamiltonApplicant, thank you for your response.
Yes, I am preparing all my supporting documents as early as now, and keeping all bills and receipts so I can have as much proof as I can. I will also consult with a lawyer/consultant before I submit application because like what @dpenabill said in that thread, there might be some inconsistency in the application. I already checked my I-94 since I only travelled to U.S. and Japan in the time I was away. Should I submit those too?

Start with physical presence calculation for PRs
https://eservices.cic.gc.ca/rescalc/resCalcStartNew.do