Online calculator error / bug???

[spetel]

Hi guys, I think I stumbled upon a very critical bug in the online days calculator for citizenship.
Can anyone here confirm?

There are 3 dates in it, landed date, PR date and application date.
Days before the PR give you 1/2 eligible day, and days after PR give you a full eligible day, correct?

So, if you travel 6 days during the period before the PR, the online calculator deducts 6 days from the calculation, but these days only equal to 1/2 a day, so it should deduct only 3 days.
I can see in my calculation that any trip before the PR was deducted in full, and not half.

I'm wondering, am I correct? Can anyone look at their calculations and see if the same bug appears in yours as well?

Why is it super critical for me? I submitted (foolishly) the application with only 1 day to spare, I met with the judge yesterday and she found a trip of a few days that I forgot to include (I travel a lot to conferences as a speaker).

She told me I seem to be missing a few days (3-4, not more) and since I don't have any to spare she will have to reject my application and have me re-submit a new one.

I told her that calculation error and she was willing to look into it and credit me the half days if she find they were miscalculated, which will give me about 30 extra days (had about 60 days of travel before PR).

As a side note I will probably hire a lawyer to appeal if I get rejected over a few days, especially since the calculation we submitted was for April but we only paid/submitted our application on July, we just didn't know we should send an updated calculation form.

Thanks, I do hope this is a bug and they will correct it for me, and later fix it in the online calculator as well. Until then - FYI.

 

[screech339]

Hi guys, I think I stumbled upon a very critical bug in the online days calculator for citizenship.
Can anyone here confirm?

There are 3 dates in it, landed date, PR date and application date.
Days before the PR give you 1/2 eligible day, and days after PR give you a full eligible day, correct?

So, if you travel 6 days during the period before the PR, the online calculator deducts 6 days from the calculation, but these days only equal to 1/2 a day, so it should deduct only 3 days.
I can see in my calculation that any trip before the PR was deducted in full, and not half.

I'm wondering, am I correct? Can anyone look at their calculations and see if the same bug appears in yours as well?

Why is it super critical for me? I submitted (foolishly) the application with only 1 day to spare, I met with the judge yesterday and she found a trip of a few days that I forgot to include (I travel a lot to conferences as a speaker).

She told me I seem to be missing a few days (3-4, not more) and since I don't have any to spare she will have to reject my application and have me re-submit a new one.

I told her that calculation error and she was willing to look into it and credit me the half days if she find they were miscalculated, which will give me about 30 extra days (had about 60 days of travel before PR).

As a side note I will probably hire a lawyer to appeal if I get rejected over a few days, especially since the calculation we submitted was for April but we only paid/submitted our application on July, we just didn't know we should send an updated calculation form.

Thanks, I do hope this is a bug and they will correct it for me, and later fix it in the online calculator as well. Until then - FYI.

It is not an error. Any days absence from Canada regardless if it is pre-PR and PR days, it is considered to be a full day absence. Since you are considered to be "TEMPORARY" in Canada while holding a work/student/visitor visa during your pre-PR days, considered yourself lucky to be getting half day for every day you are in Canada towards citizenship qualification.

The law that allows applicants to claim pre-PR days as half days has always been in forced for a long time. This will change once the new 4/6 year rule kick in. Once the new rules kick in, applicant will not be able to claim any pre-PR days and must meet physical presence days of 1460 days. Basic residence will no longer apply.

 

[spetel]

Hi Screech, thanks for replying!

Do you have that written somewhere?
The judge herself told me they should be counted as 1/2 days.

Say you are in Canada 15 days before PR, and traveled 10 days out of them.
Based on what you say, it will be calculated as:
15 / 2 = 7.5 days, minus 10 days = -3.5
you actually owe 3.5 days. how does that make sense?

Anyway, I found another major bug in the online calculation form.
here are my dates:
Arrival date 9/28/2008
PR date 11/11/2010
Application date 4/14/2013

Calculated to:
Days before PR 774
Days after PR 886
So, total eligible days should be 1273, correct?
Well, the online calculator calculated these dates to be 1172.

There is a whole 101 days missing from their calculation.
1 day - since they didn't count the application date I assume.
But, where are the other 100 days that are missing here?

Is my calculation of eligible days (before travel deduction) wrong?
If anyone can explain that gap, please let me know what I am missing. Currently I see that the online calculator cannot be trusted as I first thought. Or is it just wishful thinking on my part?

 

[cecapplied]

if you applied on 4/14/2013, days after 4/14/2009 will be considered

Hi Screech, thanks for replying!

Do you have that written somewhere?
The judge herself told me they should be counted as 1/2 days.

Say you are in Canada 15 days before PR, and traveled 10 days out of them.
Based on what you say, it will be calculated as:
15 / 2 = 7.5 days, minus 10 days = -3.5
you actually owe 3.5 days. how does that make sense?

Anyway, I found another major bug in the online calculation form.
here are my dates:
Arrival date 9/28/2008
PR date 11/11/2010
Application date 4/14/2013

Calculated to:
Days before PR 774
Days after PR 886
So, total eligible days should be 1273, correct?
Well, the online calculator calculated these dates to be 1172.

There is a whole 101 days missing from their calculation.
1 day - since they didn't count the application date I assume.
But, where are the other 100 days that are missing here?

Is my calculation of eligible days (before travel deduction) wrong?
If anyone can explain that gap, please let me know what I am missing. Currently I see that the online calculator cannot be trusted as I first thought. Or is it just wishful thinking on my part?

 

[screech339]

Hi Screech, thanks for replying!

Do you have that written somewhere?
The judge herself told me they should be counted as 1/2 days.

Say you are in Canada 15 days before PR, and traveled 10 days out of them.
Based on what you say, it will be calculated as:
15 / 2 = 7.5 days, minus 10 days = -3.5
you actually owe 3.5 days. how does that make sense?

Anyway, I found another major bug in the online calculation form.
here are my dates:
Arrival date 9/28/2008
PR date 11/11/2010
Application date 4/14/2013

Calculated to:
Days before PR 774
Days after PR 886
So, total eligible days should be 1273, correct?
Well, the online calculator calculated these dates to be 1172.

There is a whole 101 days missing from their calculation.
1 day - since they didn't count the application date I assume.
But, where are the other 100 days that are missing here?

Is my calculation of eligible days (before travel deduction) wrong?
If anyone can explain that gap, please let me know what I am missing. Currently I see that the online calculator cannot be trusted as I first thought. Or is it just wishful thinking on my part?

Sorry, the online calculator is accurate and correct. When you complete the online calculator, it will return the correct amount of days towards citizenship, including any half days of Pre-PR days towards citizenship. If there was a flaw in the calculator, this would have been in the news, especially in the CIC gazette news. There has never been any news resulting from a bug or flaw in the online calculator.

Remember the calculator will only count the days in the last 4 years prior to application date, not since you the date you entered Canada which goes beyond the 4 year window. Keep that in mind.

I ran the online calculator under difference scenarios and each and every time, the answer came back as correct and accurate for my wife's citizenship qualification days.

 

[spetel]

if you applied on 4/14/2013, days after 4/14/2009 will be considered

Oh, it is 4 years... I thought it was 5 years.

Anyway, I hope for a positive answer on the half days. The judge also told me she can consider days since 4/14/2007 as an exception. So for me this solves it I hope.

 

[screech339]

Hi Screech, thanks for replying!

Say you are in Canada 15 days before PR, and traveled 10 days out of them.
Based on what you say, it will be calculated as:
15 / 2 = 7.5 days, minus 10 days = -3.5
you actually owe 3.5 days. how does that make sense?

If you were gone 10 days, you really was in Canada 6 days, not 5. The day you come back to Canada counts a day towards citizenship. So you have 3 days towards citizenship (6 days in Canada before PR = 3 full days)

Anyway, I found another major bug in the online calculation form.
here are my dates:
Arrival date 9/28/2008
PR date 11/11/2010
Application date 4/14/2013

Calculated to:
Days before PR 774
Days after PR 886
So, total eligible days should be 1273, correct?
Well, the online calculator calculated these dates to be 1172.

There is a whole 101 days missing from their calculation.
1 day - since they didn't count the application date I assume.
But, where are the other 100 days that are missing here?

Were you trying to count days from the time you enter Canada? The 100 missing days could be that they are beyond the 4 year window from date of application.

Is my calculation of eligible days (before travel deduction) wrong?
If anyone can explain that gap, please let me know what I am missing. Currently I see that the online calculator cannot be trusted as I first thought. Or is it just wishful thinking on my part?

 

[screech339]

Oh, it is 4 years... I thought it was 5 years.

Anyway, I hope for a positive answer on the half days. The judge also told me she can consider days since 4/14/2007 as an exception. So for me this solves it I hope.

Not sure the judge get the answer that he/she can consider says since 4/14/2007 as an exception since it is way beyond the 4 year window. Any days in Canada beyond 4 years prior to application date is meaningless. Has no affect on the citizenship qualification requirement.

 

[spetel]

Update: I can confirm days out of country while before the PR, do deduct 1/2 day and not full day.
The days appear wrong in the total days in the table. I confirm in the calculation of my application they did calculate it correctly to take half days and not full days, so this appears to be a glitch in the online print screen I had, while the printed version shows the correct travel days amount.

 

[screech339]

Update: I can confirm days out of country while before the PR, do deduct 1/2 day and not full day.
The days appear wrong in the total days in the table. I confirm in the calculation of my application they did calculate it correctly to take half days and not full days, so this appears to be a glitch in the online print screen I had, while the printed version shows the correct travel days amount.

May I ask how you confirm this? Are you confirming this with a judge or with CIC? You do realize that CIC agent now determine whether you pass the physical presence and qualify for citizenship or pass it on to citizenship judge to determine. If the agent feels you do not add up the presence days properly, the agent could still deny you path to citizenship.

Don't want to worry you or anything. I am still very skeptic that you can deduct half days absence days instead of full absence days.

 

[bambino]

In the summary at the top of the calculator printout the "Days absent" field reflects the half-day rule. The table at the bottom that lists the duration of all your trips ("Total # of days), in actual days, not accounting for the 1/2 credit for non-PR (NPR) time.

"Days absent" (in summary) = (NPR absences)*0.5 + (PR absences)*1
"Total # of days" (at the bottom of the table) = NPR absences + PR absences.

It is not an error. Any days absence from Canada regardless if it is pre-PR and PR days, it is considered to be a full day absence.

Absolutely, positively and utterly wrong.

 

[Smile_Canada]

I don't think there is any bug, either way you do it comes same results.

It says that you get credit of 1/2 day for each Pre-PR days you were present in Canada , and also you can get credited for max for 365 days. So you still need to get 2 years(ie. 365*2=730 days) after becoming PR.

According to this if you have 10 days in application before Pre-PR period and you were out of Canada for 5 days during that 10 day period, that means you were physically present in Canada for 10-5 = 5 days, and u can get claim for 5/2=2.5 days.
So summary (Pre-PR Days - Out Days)/2 = (10-5)/2=2.5

whereas you are trying to calculate as
divide Pre-PR Days/2 -OutDays/2
i.e. 10/2-5/2=5-2.5=2.5

 

[Smile_Canada]

Also i put following dates in Calculator

1. Date you entered Canada: 14-Mar-2011
2. Date you become PR : 14-Mar-2013
3. Date you sign application: 24-Mar-2015
4. Vacation: 10-Jun-2012 to 20-jun-2012 = 10 days

So Calculation will be
4 years starting before application i.e. 25-Mar-2011

Pre-PR days = 14/Mar/13 - 25/Mar/11 = 720 days
Out days = 10 days
So physically present 720-10 = 710 days
so get credit for 710/2 = 355 days

Then PR days is 24/Mar/15 - 14/Mar/13 = 740 days

so final calculation should be 740+355=1095 days

Residence calculator is showing me 1095 days, and its showing vacation of 10 days.

 

[spetel]

May I ask how you confirm this? Are you confirming this with a judge or with CIC? You do realize that CIC agent now determine whether you pass the physical presence and qualify for citizenship or pass it on to citizenship judge to determine. If the agent feels you do not add up the presence days properly, the agent could still deny you path to citizenship.

Don't want to worry you or anything. I am still very skeptic that you can deduct half days absence days instead of full absence days.

In my printed application, they only deducted 76.5 days, while the online calculation shows 106 days.
If I manually calculate the days before PR as half days, it comes to exactly 76.5