Marrying an American while on social assistance

[Obsidian]

Hello, my fiancee and I are trying to get everything in order for her immigration. I'm Canadian and have always been a citizen, she's American and has been overseas but we've been together for three years (have known each other for five). I've also met her family and all that. The issue is that I'm on Ontario Works (Ontario's social assistance program) and I don't know if that will cause delays or problems with her becoming a citizen/permanent resident. Financially, it wouldn't be a problem (not easy but still) our families would help pay for her share of rent and food for however long it takes the application to go through. I read somewhere that the sponsor can't be on assistance and has to make enough to support the spouse for a certain amount of time but I don't know if that's really accurate? If she can't become a citizen because of my income, can we still get married and can she still live here while I try to get a job?

Thanks!

 

[mikeymyke]

Yes you can't be on social assistance, and you need to stop ASAP. I know some members here criticize me for saying that you have to be off social assistance for a year before applying (2 different CIC agents told me this), because CIC checks your history 12 months back, but lately we've been seeing more and more members here having their application refused because they were on welfare, despite being off welfare for a few months before applying.

You don't need income to support your spouse, you just need to show how you will support her when she arrives. You can get married and have her live with you, but the main issue still remains: you are still on welfare. It's a toss up really, some members claim they got off welfare, applied immediately for PR, and were approved, some members were off for a few months but then were refused because of welfare. It's up to you whether you want to wait a year to get off welfare, or risk it and try to apply a few months after you get off. Nobody here really knows when CIC officially clears the welfare thing off your record when applying to sponsor.

But right now, you really need to get off welfare immediately. Even working a min. wage job right now would be better than getting social assistance, better not just financially, but also in terms of making yourself more eligible to sponsor your wife.

I know she's just a fiancee now, but also I forgot to mention, before you can do all this, you need to marry her to sponsor her, unless you applied common law, which I don't think you guys are.

 

[Obsidian]

Thank you! What's most important to us right now is that she is simply able to live with me, here in Canada. We would like to get her immigration started as soon as possible, but given certain circumstances it may not be possible for me to get off welfare for a while. But if she can still, at the very least, live with me without being deported (we would be married at this point, pretty much the next time she comes to Canada we want it to be forever and will get married soon after she arrives).

I would be able to get a minimum wage job within a year of her coming here. It's just that we're also timing it with when she is able to move.

 

[keesio]

Thank you! What's most important to us right now is that she is simply able to live with me, here in Canada. We would like to get her immigration started as soon as possible, but given certain circumstances it may not be possible for me to get off welfare for a while. But if she can still, at the very least, live with me without being deported (we would be married at this point, pretty much the next time she comes to Canada we want it to be forever and will get married soon after she arrives).

I would be able to get a minimum wage job within a year of her coming here. It's just that we're also timing it with when she is able to move.

I think one potential issue is if you are still on welfare when she tries to come visit. Unless she tells them she is only visiting for a few days (and it is never good to lie), they will ask her how she will support herself while in Canada. Two answers to tell CIC is that she has a lot of funds and show proof (bank statement) or she will be staying with you who will support her. Normally the second answer is what most people give but in your case it may not fly if you are still on social assistance at the time.

 

[Rob_TO]

Yes you can't be on social assistance, and you need to stop ASAP. I know some members here criticize me for saying that you have to be off social assistance for a year before applying (2 different CIC agents told me this), because CIC checks your history 12 months back, but lately we've been seeing more and more members here having their application refused because they were on welfare, despite being off welfare for a few months before applying.

There is no such rule in ANY CIC documentation, that states you need to be off social assistance for 12 months. The ONLY rule around this is you must be completely off it at the time you submit the application. This is stated quite clearly in all the manuals.

However what will happen if you were on it within the past 12 months, is CIC will scrutinize the dates a lot more. They won't simply reject you, they would first mention that due to being on social assistance there is a chance for sponsor rejection, and will ask the sponsor to submit proofs/evidence that shows the specific date the social assistance officially stopped.

Another problem with this is that CIC and the social assistance dept of the government, do not share specific details and info. So CIC makes the sponsor come up with all the proofs/evidence, and doesn't just check themselves for the specific dates.

So anything within past 12 months will cause problems/delays, but it most certainly will NOT be cause for rejection on it's own, unless you can't prove to CIC that you were off social assistance as of the date the app was submitted.

Thank you! What's most important to us right now is that she is simply able to live with me, here in Canada. We would like to get her immigration started as soon as possible, but given certain circumstances it may not be possible for me to get off welfare for a while. But if she can still, at the very least, live with me without being deported (we would be married at this point, pretty much the next time she comes to Canada we want it to be forever and will get married soon after she arrives).

I would be able to get a minimum wage job within a year of her coming here. It's just that we're also timing it with when she is able to move.

I would recommend that you keep excellent records from Ontario Works on specific dates you've received payments, and everything to do with correspondence when it comes time to stop the social assistance. Make sure you get a letter from them that you are officially off social assistance, and the date effective. This will be mandatory when you are ready to submit the PR app for your wife (after you get married). The sooner you get off social assistance, the better.

In order to start her PR application you must be married or common-law, and completely off social assistance. Until she gets PR she is only a VISITOR here in Canada, and can not legally live here. Her being married to you does not give her any special status at all to stay in Canada. Make sure she acts like a visitor when crossing the border. As was mentioned, hopefully she has suitable funds to support herself as CBSA could be very hesitant about admitting her if she has no funds and the person she is coming to see is on social assistance.

 

[rhcohen2014]

Thank you! What's most important to us right now is that she is simply able to live with me, here in Canada.

your US citizen girlfriend or wife can't just "move" and "live" in canada unless she has the proper authority from immigration. This includes a work permit, study permit or permanent residency status. Your girlfriend will always be considered a "visitor" unless she has one of these permits. Visitors can NOT work while in canada. If your girlfriend goes to the border and tells them she wants to go live with you, most likely she will be slapped with an exclusion order and be banned from entering canada. Since you are NOT married yet, they are more likely to do this. When a US citizen crosses the border to visit significant others, it is SUPER important they are able to show SIGNIFICANT proof of ties to the US. This includes a lease/mortgage/deed and/or work contract/recent paystubs. Belongings and family do not count as significant ties to border agents. They assume someone would leave everything behind to be with their significant other. Border agents want to see proof that the visitor has something they will and can easily go back to at the end of their visit. they may even limit the amount of time she is allowed to visit for.

Permanent Residency seems to be the best route for couples because it's permanent status, not temporary. so once you are married, she can submit an application, visit then exend her stay to be in canada during the entire processing. Again, she will not be able to work during this time.

As others have mentioned, it will be tough for you to be approved by a sponsor while on welfare, so if you are denied, she will not be able to continue her application successfully.

 

[mikeymyke]

There is no such rule in ANY CIC documentation, that states you need to be off social assistance for 12 months. The ONLY rule around this is you must be completely off it at the time you submit the application. This is stated quite clearly in all the manuals.

However what will happen if you were on it within the past 12 months, is CIC will scrutinize the dates a lot more. They won't simply reject you, they would first mention that due to being on social assistance there is a chance for sponsor rejection, and will ask the sponsor to submit proofs/evidence that shows the specific date the social assistance officially stopped.

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/declined-sponsor-for-social-welfare-need-ur-help-guys-t203196.0.html

Hey, Rob, you and I are on that thread!

I don't think the "simply won't reject you" applies here. See this guy he got off welfare before, but was rejected. Now they have a bit of a headache having to re-apply and having a refusal on record. I admit though, maybe part of the reason was he didn't submit his Option C.

I remember seeing about 3 more cases like him before, but I'm trying to find them and post the links to the thread.

 

[scylla]

Thank you! What's most important to us right now is that she is simply able to live with me, here in Canada. We would like to get her immigration started as soon as possible, but given certain circumstances it may not be possible for me to get off welfare for a while. But if she can still, at the very least, live with me without being deported (we would be married at this point, pretty much the next time she comes to Canada we want it to be forever and will get married soon after she arrives).

I would be able to get a minimum wage job within a year of her coming here. It's just that we're also timing it with when she is able to move.

You will have to get off social assistance before you can even start the immigration process. So getting off social assistance should be a priority for you if you want to live together in Canada.

Until she becomes a permanent resident, she cannot live with you in Canada. All she can do is try to visit as a tourist. Note that it's up to immigration if she is allowed into Canada and for how long as a tourist.

Another option would be for her to secure a full time job in Canada and obtain a work permit. However this can be challenging given most employers don't want to go through the paperwork to hire a foreign worker.

Again, you should really focus on getting off social assistance as soon as you can.

 

[Rob_TO]

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/declined-sponsor-for-social-welfare-need-ur-help-guys-t203196.0.html

Hey, Rob, you and I are on that thread!

I don't think the "simply won't reject you" applies here. See this guy he got off welfare before, but was rejected. Now they have a bit of a headache having to re-apply and having a refusal on record. I admit though, maybe part of the reason was he didn't submit his Option C.

I remember seeing about 3 more cases like him before, but I'm trying to find them and post the links to the thread.

The reason they were rejected is not just because of being on welfare during the past 1 year, it's they gave absolutely NO proof/evidence or records of when they came off welfare.

You're right about the auto rejection though. In practically all cases I've seen, before anyone is rejected CIC explains the situation to you and possible reason for rejection, and gives you an opportunity to respond or submit additional docs before they actually reject the app. Perhaps it's just for applicant processing where they do this more though, and for sponsor apps they are more quick to hit the reject button without informing sponsor first.

Anyways i'm pretty confident that if that guy had gotten an actual letter from welfare office saying he was officially off welfare as of some specific date which was before they submitted the app, then CIC would not have rejected him. I'm sure you will find similar situations with any others cases you've read. As I said, I really don't think CIC talks to the provincial welfare offices very closely, so don't bother to do their own investigation. They leave that up to the sponsor to get the documents to prove it.

 

[ama1978]

I personally was receiving assistance for some time up to the month I left to marry my husband. I was working but my hours were all over the place so it was kind of a back up for me. I received just slightly over $1,000 for the entire year. When I applied for sponsorship (10 months after marrying my spouse and off assistance) I included the letter I wrote to OW cancelling my benefits as well as the letter received from OW stating my benefits were cancelled. My sponsorship took 86 days for approval when others were being approved in 28 days. I called many times and when they finally noted the account it was because they were waiting for documentation from OW stating that I was no longer receiving it. So even though I sent all the documentation ahead of time, they still conducted their own search into it. Option C was provided. I personally would get off as soon as possible and find a means to support yourself. Even having waited as long as we did there were still long delays for us. And it was not a main source of income for me.

The reason they were rejected is not just because of being on welfare during the past 1 year, it's they gave absolutely NO proof/evidence or records of when they came off welfare.

You're right about the auto rejection though. In practically all cases I've seen, before anyone is rejected CIC explains the situation to you and possible reason for rejection, and gives you an opportunity to respond or submit additional docs before they actually reject the app. Perhaps it's just for applicant processing where they do this more though, and for sponsor apps they are more quick to hit the reject button without informing sponsor first.

Anyways i'm pretty confident that if that guy had gotten an actual letter from welfare office saying he was officially off welfare as of some specific date which was before they submitted the app, then CIC would not have rejected him. I'm sure you will find similar situations with any others cases you've read. As I said, I really don't think CIC talks to the provincial welfare offices very closely, so don't bother to do their own investigation. They leave that up to the sponsor to get the documents to prove it.

 

[omariewk1]

so what would have happened if he didn't produce a letter from the welfare board but positively provide them with a letter of employment from his current employer? would that be enough for them not to reject his application?

 

[ama1978]

Some are still able to receive assistance while working. So I am sure they would want absolute proof that they are no longer receiving the social assistance.

so what would have happened if he didn't produce a letter from the welfare board but positively provide them with a letter of employment from his current employer? would that be enough for them not to reject his application?

 

[rhcohen2014]

Some are still able to receive assistance while working. So I am sure they would want absolute proof that they are no longer receiving the social assistance.

i agree, i believe this is part of the reason why the option c is requested, to prove they haven't been drawing assistance, employed or not.

 

[omariewk1]

ok, so if you provide them with 2 t4s from the 2 companies you have worked at since being off welfare plus your option c shouldn't that be good enough proof that you are no longer on welfare?

 

[rhcohen2014]

ok, so if you provide them with 2 t4s from the 2 companies you have worked at since being off welfare plus your option c shouldn't that be good enough proof that you are no longer on welfare?

in theory i would think. from what I gather from the story from an above poster, CIC still did their own check regardless of the proof they sent. Each case is unique. no one can say for sure what will work and what won't work. if there is proof of social assistance being drawn along the line, it sounds like the approval will take longer than the norm.