Urgent: Sudden Increase in PR Processing Times for Refugees and Protected Persons (Up to 99 Months!)

[Banky@77]

Same, I know like 10 close friends plus myself n spouse who are physicians, some sub specialists....many are more qualified and know the language better than the so called economic migrants.

All these will not solve any problem, the only thing is for canada to learn how to process application fast and equally secure their border. Some years back,they canceled applications as they are proposing right now,what was the result?If you process application for 8years,what result are you going to get when the applications are still on going?It's better you stop receiving applications and process the ones you have rapidly and also control your border. Cabada process tourist visa in some countries for one to two years,what UK process within 2 to 3weeks.the canada immigration system need. to be overhaul, it's their internal problem,not the volume of applications,compared to other countries of the world.

 

[canuck78]

My point is this. Refugees (not claimant) should be given opportunity to apply for PR using other routes. Some refugees are very qualified to apply for PR using other route that has a faster processing time. I have a friend who is a medical doctor from Egypt. He had to wait for his PR through the refugee route while other medical doctors came in from other countries with their families with their PR.
Why bringing new intakes into Canada when you can convert some of your skilled temporal residents into PR. I have 2 masters degree. One from back home and one from canada. I am qualified to get more points on the express entry more that people outside canada but because I am a refugee, I cant apply. Does that make sense. The worse is that my wife is a qualified nurse. Canada needs people in health care but she cant even come in on her own without my getting PR while others in health care are getting PR.

Asylum should always be the last option for people. People think it is an easier route but many may have been better off applying for economic immigration. That said refugees and asylum seekers do receive a lot of benefits compared to economic immigrants. The primary focus of seeking asylum and for refugees is safety not economic benefit, faster processing, etc. Claiming asylum, being a refugee/protected person has always had some major consequences even if approved.

You could always consider abandoning your status in Canada if you knew you could get PR via an economic pathway if that is faster. Would speak to your lawyer. Your wife should also write her licensing exams while still in Egypt.

 

[canuck78]

All these will not solve any problem, the only thing is for canada to learn how to process application fast and equally secure their border. Some years back,they canceled applications as they are proposing right now,what was the result?If you process application for 8years,what result are you going to get when the applications are still on going?It's better you stop receiving applications and process the ones you have rapidly and also control your border. Cabada process tourist visa in some countries for one to two years,what UK process within 2 to 3weeks.the canada immigration system need. to be overhaul, it's their internal problem,not the volume of applications,compared to other countries of the world.

Pretty sure this is a troll account. Hard to keep track at this point they have so many accounts.

 

[God's own 269]

Asylum should always be the last option for people. People think it is an easier route but many may have been better off applying for economic immigration. That said refugees and asylum seekers do receive a lot of benefits compared to economic immigrants. The primary focus of seeking asylum and for refugees is safety not economic benefit, faster processing, etc. Claiming asylum, being a refugee/protected person has always had some major consequences even if approved.

You could always consider abandoning your status in Canada if you knew you could get PR via an economic pathway if that is faster. Would speak to your lawyer. Your wife should also write her licensing exams while still in Egypt.

If a refugee claimant abandon their regugee application, they would have to leave Canada. If I had the option of switching while still remaining in Canada, I would have done that years ago. I tried sponsoring my wife for study. I had all the money required and showed more than enough proof of funds but they denied her saying she will not go back at the end of her studies based on my situation. Can you imagine. I paid school fees in full. Yet most people that applied with less proof of funds were still giving visa. I even added the school policy of no refund of school fees if granted visa. Is that fair ?
So my wife cant get an education in Canada because of me evem though she has enough POF??

 

[canuck78]

If a refugee claimant abandon their regugee application, they would have to leave Canada. If I had the option of switching while still remaining in Canada, I would have done that years ago. I tried sponsoring my wife for study. I had all the money required and showed more than enough proof of funds but they denied her saying she will not go back at the end of her studies based on my situation. Can you imagine. I paid school fees in full. Yet most people that applied with less proof of funds were still giving visa. I even added the school policy of no refund of school fees if granted visa. Is that fair ?
So my wife cant get an education in Canada because of me evem though she has enough POF??

Yes I was suggesting that some people could consider leaving since I know that not everyone who has received protected person status is genuine refugee/protected person and may be able to return to their country without risking their life. A study permit is a temporary permit while you are applying for PR with her as a dependent so she isn’t planning on being a temporary resident. Also plenty of people who would claim asylum themselves on arrival or not study and lose their deposit. I have suggested many times that protected people and refugees may want to approach the government or take the government to see if they can obtain faster family reunification. For the highest chances of success with the government a proposal should probably require proof of funds & employment and focus on family reunification after a certain period of time or after completion of a certain part of processing. Canada goal is to reduce the volume of temporary residents partially because of the strain on infrastructure so family reunification also creates issues because of the volume of refugees and protected people who will want to reunite with their dependents. There is no easy solution. Canada welcomed too many asylum seekers and refugees in a short period of time but the people who benefited from Canada’s doors being wide open are now facing long processing times. Not sure why the government didn’t do some basic longterm planning. Everyone could have predicted this would happen and many were alarmed that no changes were being made. In fairness Marc Miller apparently wanted to make some changes around a year ago but apparently was overruled. What a mess!

 

[moref1988]

Some friends are looking at this issue from a very unfair perspective and are probably revealing their conservative political views. The issue is not about returning to the country of origin, a real refugee would not have such a concern anyway. The issue here is one of predictability. The application should be finalized within the average processing time when applying because there is a notion called legitimate expectation. Every you extend the application beyond reasonable limits, you are exposing the applicant to the risk of inadmissibility. However, if the PR is finalized within a reasonable time, the applicant will become a citizen within a reasonable time and there will be no risk of inadmissibility. All of these unreasonable delays may be subject to litigation in federal court.

Another point is that a serious and big country like Canada should not change the rules of the game while the match is playing. Such unexpected changes should only occur if they are in the applicant's best interest. For example, there is no rational side to extend the application of someone who has been waiting for a PR for 24 months for another 24 months. These are changes that are entirely about surrendering to Trump policies. What a state should do is not to consider mass cancellation, but to consider mass approval to be able to dissolve the backlog if necessary. Because the backlog is an administrative issue, one that the state must resolve. The cost of this cannot be passed on to the applicant.

I send my greetings to everyone..

 

[canuck78]

Some friends are looking at this issue from a very unfair perspective and are probably revealing their conservative political views. The issue is not about returning to the country of origin, a real refugee would not have such a concern anyway. The issue here is one of predictability. The application should be finalized within the average processing time when applying because there is a notion called legitimate expectation. Every you extend the application beyond reasonable limits, you are exposing the applicant to the risk of inadmissibility. However, if the PR is finalized within a reasonable time, the applicant will become a citizen within a reasonable time and there will be no risk of inadmissibility. All of these unreasonable delays may be subject to litigation in federal court.

Another point is that a serious and big country like Canada should not change the rules of the game while the match is playing. Such unexpected changes should only occur if they are in the applicant's best interest. For example, there is no rational side to extend the application of someone who has been waiting for a PR for 24 months for another 24 months. These are changes that are entirely about surrendering to Trump policies. What a state should do is not to consider mass cancellation, but to consider mass approval to be able to dissolve the backlog if necessary. Because the backlog is an administrative issue, one that the state must resolve. The cost of this cannot be passed on to the applicant.

I send my greetings to everyone..

They are not considering mass cancellation of either protected people or asylum claimants. The immigration target plans haven’t changed dramatically so the processing times increasing weee fairly evident if you did the math. Wish IRCC had implemented this updated processing time system. The previous one was often incorrect when it came to processing times for various programs, permits, visas. People are free to take the government to court and people regularly file a Writ of Mandamus if their processing times are significantly longer than others going through the same process at the same time. This has very little to do with Trump except for fear that US immigration policies will continue to push more people seeking asylum towards Canada and Trump’s policies pushing us further into economic difficulty. Not a conservative many who are now calling for no immigration. Most Canadians want more measured data driven decision when it comes to immigration. We wouldn’t be in this position if the previous government had been more responsible. IRCC did batch approvals for TRVs at a certain point, didn’t cancel visa free status for Mexicans even as asylum claims from Mexico were skyrocketing, etc. all policies that contributed to backlogs we have today. A mass approval would be not responsible or data driven decision. Government policies around immigration in most countries are always changing because most countries make immigration decisions based on the best interests of their country and need to be able to adjust to country conditions like labour needs/unemployment rates, ageing population, infrastructure capacity like housing, schools, healthcare, etc. which wasn’t done under Trudeau. At a committee meeting last week on immigration it became clear that various healthcare organizations had never been contacted to determine the level of immigration that the HC system could absorb while Canada was increasing immigration by millions. I assume neither were school boards/provincial education ministers. It is going to take 5-10 years to get the immigration system functioning properly. Would add that if you look at other countries Canada remains very welcoming and changes being proposed are a lot less severe.

 

[moref1988]

They are not considering mass cancellation of either protected people or asylum claimants. The immigration target plans haven’t changed dramatically so the processing times increasing weee fairly evident if you did the math. Wish IRCC had implemented this updated processing time system. The previous one was often incorrect when it came to processing times for various programs, permits, visas. People are free to take the government to court and people regularly file a Writ of Mandamus if their processing times are significantly longer than others going through the same process at the same time. This has very little to do with Trump except for fear that US immigration policies will continue to push more people seeking asylum towards Canada and Trump’s policies pushing us further into economic difficulty. Not a conservative many who are now calling for no immigration. Most Canadians want more measured data driven decision when it comes to immigration. We wouldn’t be in this position if the previous government had been more responsible. IRCC did batch approvals for TRVs at a certain point, didn’t cancel visa free status for Mexicans even as asylum claims from Mexico were skyrocketing, etc. all policies that contributed to backlogs we have today. A mass approval would be not responsible or data driven decision. Government policies around immigration in most countries are always changing because most countries make immigration decisions based on the best interests of their country and need to be able to adjust to country conditions like labour needs/unemployment rates, ageing population, infrastructure capacity like housing, schools, healthcare, etc. which wasn’t done under Trudeau. At a committee meeting last week on immigration it became clear that various healthcare organizations had never been contacted to determine the level of immigration that the HC system could absorb while Canada was increasing immigration by millions. I assume neither were school boards/provincial education ministers. It is going to take 5-10 years to get the immigration system functioning properly. Would add that if you look at other countries Canada remains very welcoming and changes being proposed are a lot less severe.

When I say mass approval, I don't mean TRV or anything else. However, the backlog in the protected person category, which already has been in Canada for years and has an approval rate of around 95%, can certainly be addressed. What's the point of making people wait longer in this category, which has a very high approval rate? At the very least, the government should find a way to address the backlog of applications for 2023-2024!

If there's a 137k-person backlog, it's the state's responsibility to resolve it. It's not a fair approach to say, "You're going to get PR anyway, so wait 7-8 years."

 

[Banky@77]

When I say mass approval, I don't mean TRV or anything else. However, the backlog in the protected person category, which already has been in Canada for years and has an approval rate of around 95%, can certainly be addressed. What's the point of making people wait longer in this category, which has a very high approval rate? At the very least, the government should find a way to address the backlog of applications for 2023-2024!

If there's a 137k-person backlog, it's the state's responsibility to resolve it. It's not a fair approach to say, "You're going to get PR anyway, so wait 7-8 years."

Let them process 137k application for 8years, instead of working on their administrative lapses, they are complaining of backlog,given different excuses and some people will come here defending Ircc.

 

[moref1988]

Let them process 137k application for 8years, instead of working on their administrative lapses, they are complaining of backlog,given different excuses and some people will come here defending Ircc.

Exactly; there's nothing logical or defensible here. If there's a backlog, it's the government's responsibility to resolve it. There are quotas, and we're lowering them so saying them wait 7-8 years isn't fair.

Furthermore, technically, if you're changing a rule or making a major change, you should only be able to apply it to new applications. You can't apply such major changes to applications that have already been processed for a long time. If there's any justice, these issues need to be resolved somehow.

Furthermore, if there's a backlog, to address this issue, you need to increase quotas, even if just once, or perhaps not impose quotas on people already in Canada.

It's also important to note that Bill C-2 and Bill C-12 are deeply flawed bill proposals. No government in any country should be granted such sweeping powers. Such bills may be usual for Middle Eastern countries, but they are not right for Canada.

 

[Johnbusco]

Hello, please I want to know if protected person can invite spouse on a visitor visa to come to Canada

 

[scylla]

Hello, please I want to know if protected person can invite spouse on a visitor visa to come to Canada

The spouse can certainly try applying for a TRV. Generally speaking, the chances of the TRV being approved are low. But no harm trying.

 

[canuck78]

Exactly; there's nothing logical or defensible here. If there's a backlog, it's the government's responsibility to resolve it. There are quotas, and we're lowering them so saying them wait 7-8 years isn't fair.

Furthermore, technically, if you're changing a rule or making a major change, you should only be able to apply it to new applications. You can't apply such major changes to applications that have already been processed for a long time. If there's any justice, these issues need to be resolved somehow.

Furthermore, if there's a backlog, to address this issue, you need to increase quotas, even if just once, or perhaps not impose quotas on people already in Canada.

It's also important to note that Bill C-2 and Bill C-12 are deeply flawed bill proposals. No government in any country should be granted such sweeping powers. Such bills may be usual for Middle Eastern countries, but they are not right for Canada.

There no chance IRCC is going to increase PR quotas, eliminate quotas, etc. for all forms of PRs, protected people and their dependents. It was the government’s responsibility to try to minimize how many were arriving in Canada and claiming asylum and to limit the size of refugee programs coming from abroad. The JT government made it easier to get to Canada and had large refugee programs. The consequence is now the many who benefited from easier access to Canada are going to have to wait longer to get PR. There are also no changes the previous processing time page was based on backwards looking data. If you had looked at the raw data (number of applications and the yearly PR quota) the processing times were evident which is why I have been pointing out the processing times will continue to get longer for at least a year. The processing times have increased because more people applied. It is pure math.

 

[abff08f4813c]

Honest question, -what benefits exactly that a PR person have, that ***YOU*** don't have as an approved refugee?
Despite to wait longer for the process to become a citizen, what else does it impact currently your life?
Limbo for me, is while still being a claimant.

In fact an approved refugee is in some ways a better place than a TDH - temporary document holder (like international students or temporary foreign workers). Even if a person has their temporary status approved there is an expiry date to it and the person must leave by then unless a way to extend it or apply for another status occurs first. This was me not so long ago.

In some ways it's very much the inverse issue that approved refugees face - TDHs are free to travel and can leave whenever they want, but rather than having the certainty of getting PR and eventually citizenship after an admittedly long wait, TDHs aren't sure if they'll even be able to stay in Canada at all.

https://thewalrus.ca/permanent-residency-cuts-canada/

That’s a very hypocritical argument. You can’t talk about protecting refugees and then justify years of delay by saying “the goal is safety, not status.” Safety without stability isn’t protection, it’s survival on pause. Most of us have already proven we’re contributing members of society, yet we’re treated like a lower priority while other streams move freely.

I do sympathize with the very long wait and would agree to some changes (like extra credit for citizenship). I myself as a TDH (specially a temporary foreign worker obtaining PR via the Economic stream) had to wait about as long as you folks do to obtain PR, and the lack of extra credit means I'm still not yet a citizen.

In truth, I'm one of the lucky ones. My banker is also an immigrant, arriving around the same time I did, but younger and with less work experience, so he couldn't apply for PR earlier the way I did. I was able to get past ATIP or whatever stage it is that you don't have to about points anymore. He wasn't - he didn't have enough points until post-Covid ... which means he still doesn't have enough points. (He'd meet the bar now if the required score was at the pre-covid levels. As it is, he now wakes up at 5am every day - including weekends - and starts his day by learning French.)

And let’s be honest most decent jobs require permanent residency. When you have kids asking to go to places like Disneyland or just want to give them a better life, how can you say we shouldn’t worry about our PR status? We’re not asking for shortcuts; we’re asking for fairness. If fairness only applies to certain categories, then it’s not fairness at all it’s discrimination dressed up as policy.

I suppose I was lucky again, qualifying for multiple closed work permits for jobs that paid either six figures or very high five figures - until I qualified for an open work permit a year or so before I got PR.

I confess I'm a bit sore - I did get told once by a recruiter that the employer wouldn't hire me without PR, even though I had an open work permit. I'm pretty sure this is illegal, though.

The most important point was about family reunions. If the government can create a temporary pathway for family reunification, the majority won't mind the delay in PR.

In my opinion, family reunions are the most common and most emotionally draining aspect of waiting for PR. Any other reason is insignificant.

It is a human right to see our family and build it up, it is not about politics or economy. This is injustice. We have been waiting for PR just to get our families,

Most of the visas need PR earthier you get accepted or your spouse get refused for the visa! This cause a huge pain. We are human, 8 years of waiting! I dont mind the delay just let me get my wife in here, isnt of my right?? there is many concerns think deep about it...

This makes sense to me. I didn't have any when I came, but if I did, I would have been able to bring my spouse and kids. And gotten my spouse an open work permit too!

It also won't cost the government anything to allow protected persons to apply for all jobs, just like PR holders.

I'm a bit confused on this point. I was under the impression that refugee claimants and approved refugees got open work permits (OWP), https://www.gov.nl.ca/immigration/in-canada-refugee-claimants/ & https://newyouth.ca/en/resources/immigration/refugees/how-do-i-apply-work-permit-refugee-claimant

With an open work permit, what kind of jobs are you not able to do? (The two major restrictions that I'm aware of compared to PR is that an OWP doesn't allow sex work and that you have to do an IRCC approved medical before you can do certain jobs like working with children. But I thought all refugees eventually would do a medical, and somehow I don't feel that you are concerned about that other restriction...)

because we don't have the freedom of moving between the counties to meet up with our families.

Well, that's not imposed by Canada though, right?

As another approved refugee points out,

With my RTD, I can literally travel to most countries without any hassles.

The issue is that you can't visit your family because they're in the home country that you fear persecution from. Nothing short of Canadian citizenship would be enough to protect you (and perhaps even then you wouldn't be safe). So getting PR earlier and faster would not help you - heck if you did visit your family after getting Canadian PR, it might end up getting stripped from you! (See https://www.canadavisa.com/canada-i...-for-citizenship.333455/page-77#post-11100561 )

 

[abff08f4813c]

My point is this. Refugees (not claimant) should be given opportunity to apply for PR using other routes. Some refugees are very qualified to apply for PR using other route that has a faster processing time.

I don't quite get this part. What's stopping these folks from just .. applying? Apply for PR using the other routes if you are qualified, BEFORE trying a refugee claim. Refugee claims are for those who have no other option. If you qualify for skilled immigration then usually you have options.

I have a friend who is a medical doctor from Egypt. He had to wait for his PR through the refugee route while other medical doctors came in from other countries with their families with their PR.

Again, why? Interesting that you bring up Egypt. I've known and worked with two Egyptians in my professional career here in North America. Both did the skilled immigration route. (Granted, they were in tech, not medicine/healthcare.)

Why bringing new intakes into Canada when you can convert some of your skilled temporal residents into PR. I have 2 masters degree. One from back home and one from canada. I am qualified to get more points on the express entry more that people outside canada but because I am a refugee, I cant apply. Does that make sense.

Yeah, because you're going to get your PR here anyways. It will just take a bit longer. And you can work and apply your skills to the benefit of Canada while you're waiting.

Though actually if OP's first post to this thread is accurate, then don't think of Express Entry as this big super fast shiny PR thing - I did Express Entry and it took me about the same amount of time to get PR as OP's first post says it will take for those coming in as protected persons.

The worse is that my wife is a qualified nurse. Canada needs people in health care but she cant even come in on her own without my getting PR while others in health care are getting PR.

This one makes sense to me. It's that rule that says eligibility for a married couple (or equivalent like common-law) must be together, so wife gets the same status as the husband and vice versa. (E.g. if husband is medically inadmissible because of kidney failure and need to use dialysis, then the perfectly healthy wife is also inadmissable. If you were boyfriend/girlfriend then she could apply for Express Entry and try to get PR on her own. Instead she has to wait. And even that wouldn't be so bad if she could wait WITH YOU - in the same country. But an eight year wait just so you can live together with your wife, that just seems pointlessly cruel.

Edit: Of course some TDHs also have multi-year delays before they can be reunited with their spouse, see https://thewalrus.ca/the-unspoken-contradictions-of-quebecs-immigration-policy/

“It is a human right to see our family”

Nope

I think the learned folks behind the Canadian Council for Refugees put forth a very good argument on this topic. From https://ccrweb.ca/en/cba-ccr-letter-refugee-family-reunification

> We respectfully submit that Canada has a legal obligation, under the UNCRC, to expeditiously reunite minor dependents of Protected Persons, and that a four-year delay does not meet that threshold. Given the deleterious impact of prolonged separation on family members, the extraordinary processing delays have Charter implications. The Supreme Court has consistently confirmed that the Charter should be presumed to give, at least, as great a level of protection as is found in the international human rights instruments that Canada has ratified.

While it's true that the exact text of "It is a human right to see our family" does not appear in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, I think a good lawyer may be able to argue that this is implied from Article 12 of the UDHR as well as Article 16(3) of the same (but IANAL). See https://www.un.org/en/udhrbook/pdf/udhr_booklet_en_web.pdf

And as per https://www.chrc-ccdp.gc.ca/individuals/human-rights/about-human-rights , the UDHR is where Canada's human rights laws stem from.

If you had looked at the raw data (number of applications and the yearly PR quota) the processing times were evident which is why I have been pointing out the processing times will continue to get longer for at least a year. The processing times have increased because more people applied. It is pure math.

So I just read this, https://thewalrus.ca/canada-held-th...ional-students-then-slammed-it-in-their-face/

> Nearly 13,000 international students applied for asylum in Canada by September 2024, an increase of about 1,600 from the year before. Even if these claims eventually fail, the students–cum–asylum seekers will earn another three years in Canada as their applications are considered—the same length as a PGWP, as it turns out. During this time, they’re eligible for health care, reduced tuition, and work permits. At the very least, they can spend a few years paying back some of their recruitment and tuition debt.