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spc337

Star Member
Jun 8, 2021
58
16
I’ve searched the forums but didn’t see an answer. Just curious if everyone should expect a FP request or if this is just random and/or exceptions..
 
I’ve searched the forums but didn’t see an answer. Just curious if everyone should expect a FP request or if this is just random and/or exceptions..
Not everyone. As far as anyone is aware, some combination of random + exceptions.
 
I’ve searched the forums but didn’t see an answer. Just curious if everyone should expect a FP request or if this is just random and/or exceptions..
As @armoured noted, not all citizenship applicants are asked to submit fingerprints.

There are no readily available statistics to confirm the numbers but it is very likely that only a relatively small percentage of applicants get a request for FPs. It may appear otherwise given the number of FP requests reflected in anecdotal reports in forums like this one, but that's due to the nature of who reports such details and why, forums like this being prone to a higher rate of anecdotal reporting about non-routine processing . . . and to be clear, a FP request is non-routine processing.

I differ from @armoured slightly in that I doubt that who gets a FP request is "random" . . . albeit, perhaps you and @armoured are using the term "random" to mean reasons for the request are unknown and difficult to predict, which seems to be rather common usage in this forum.

Yeah, I tend to be more than a little more technical than most. But "random" means purposeless or haphazard, selected by unsystematic chance. In contrast, IRCC processing agents almost certainly have criteria for determining who gets a FP request. We just do not know what that criteria is.

That said, there are various circumstances regarding which it is easy to forecast a higher probability of a FP request, ranging from applicants with name changes or other factors leading IRCC to be more likely to request FPs as part of verifying identity, to any indication of possible prohibitions such as criminality or security issues. Easy to apprehend that refugees have a higher risk of FP requests. Easy to apprehend that applicants who have lived or worked outside Canada during the previous four years likewise have a higher risk of FP requests.

For example (just one among many): any applicant for whom there is a name record hit in RCMP or U.S. NCIC/FBI databases is quite likely to get a FP request, even if there has been no formal charges or convictions that would constitute a prohibition.

Reason For Commenting:

This forum (like others) is riddled with unfounded insinuations that how it goes in processing citizenship, and other applications, is often affected by chance.

In contrast, while there may be some stochastic (random) events in processing, the vast majority of decisions made by citizenship processing agents and officers are criteria-based. Thing is, in many respects we do not know what that criteria is, other than what can be obviously discerned (not difficult to forecast there is an increased risk of a FP request, for example, for applicants who have spent a considerable amount of time living or working outside Canada in the previous four years, or for a now adult applicant who became a PR as an accompanying minor dependent and for whom IRCC did not receive FPs previously . . . among many other obvious examples).

This is worth recognizing because it should be reassuring for the vast majority of qualified PRs applying for citizenship, illustrating there is no need to worry about things going off the rails, no cause to apprehend out-of-the-blue, for no reason, non-routine processing*** or processing for what IRCC is now (so it appears) labeling "complex" applications. The latter is not random. With only uncommon exceptions, what is complex, or what triggers non-routine processing, is reason or criteria based.

Note regarding non-routine processing*** and FP requests: FP requests are non-routine processing. But it appears that for many, maybe most of those getting a FP request, this will have minimal negative impact on processing, resulting in little delay, so long as the applicant promptly and properly submits FPs. One might say: "Not all non-routine processing is created equal." For those applicants affected, the important question is not whether the application is subject to non-routine processing but, rather, which particular kind of non-routine processing is involved. For example: referrals to investigate background related to security issues will have a far, far bigger impact (resulting in much longer delays), than simple verification of identity or physical presence inquiries .
 
I differ from @armoured slightly in that I doubt that who gets a FP request is "random" . . . albeit, perhaps you and @armoured are using the term "random" to mean reasons for the request are unknown and difficult to predict, which seems to be rather common usage in this forum.

Yeah, I tend to be more than a little more technical than most. But "random" means purposeless or haphazard, selected by unsystematic chance. In contrast, IRCC processing agents almost certainly have criteria for determining who gets a FP request. We just do not know what that criteria is.
There is another use of random, used in statistics and notably in population/sampling theory and practice (notably - and relevant here - auditing, but also medicine, economics, etc), which is randomizing (selecting by draw, essentially) from within some population group for some treatment or check.

The selection or draw itself can be by chance but there still be - and very much so - a purpose behind it. To draw and test and compare to other information held and to support other checks, for example - but by sampling rather than every applicant.

That is the sense in which I used it, and I believe it is likely an accurate component of why they do the fingerprints. I can't confirm it is so, however.
 
There is another use of random, used in statistics and notably in population/sampling theory and practice (notably - and relevant here - auditing, but also medicine, economics, etc), which is randomizing (selecting by draw, essentially) from within some population group for some treatment or check.

The selection or draw itself can be by chance but there still be - and very much so - a purpose behind it. To draw and test and compare to other information held and to support other checks, for example - but by sampling rather than every applicant.

That is the sense in which I used it, and I believe it is likely an accurate component of why they do the fingerprints. I can't confirm it is so, however.

I have seen no indication at all that IRCC is randomly requesting fingerprints from citizenship applicants, and very much doubt that is happening.

IRCC periodically employs random selection methods in structured programs or projects for evaluating efficacy or quality control, which may be the sort of "auditing" you reference. That could include FP requests from citizenship applicants, if and when there is such a quality control audit implemented and it includes randomly selecting applicants. No sign IRCC is currently requesting FPs from citizenship applicants attendant any such audit.