Suggestion please: Canada or India (Imp)

[mahi2020]

We are also in similar boat as her, have decent job offer of 100K, but not able to convince ourselves to move. This particularly becomes problem
If we migrate at later stage and career is going fine. Just my salary is over 115K CAD in India, Bangalore. Not even counting my wife’s salary. So much So that, after 14 years of our marriage now, she left job and pursuing her hobbies at home, looking after our kids and managing finances.

What people say about India (pollution, clean air, traffic etc) is certainly true, but it does not impact us due to earnings. We stay at large plush gated
Communities, (Green, Clean, very safe) within it and similar such communities, its as equal to developed countries. I can easily afford staying close

To work place and commute is not an issue and we have made our life within 5 Kms our locality of Bangalore.
You would see all such gated communities one after another, making the overall society cleaner and safe.

Situation would certainly be different if option would have been with USA, we would like our kid to migrate to USA than intermediate Canada.

you can never earn that kind of salary in Canada.
(Canada has highest % of alcoholism bcoz of lowest disposable income among developed nations)

But comparing Bangalore to even a bankrupt country like Greece is a crime.
that patch of land is un-livable, even 5km travel takes hours/ no water/ no electricity/ no freedom of movement (Claustrophobia is very common), apartments constructed everywhere with no direct sunlight/ ORR on verge of collapsing (you can justify all you want but you also know this state of affairs there.)

Option 1> stay in cheapest room of best hotel
Option 2> stay in costliest room of worst hotel.

Choice is always yours (which you have already made I guess

 

[Shilpa Lokesh]

suggestion please - very important decision but hard to make: Thinking of moving back to India...please advise...

We recently moved to Canada on a PR visa from India. got a very good job with $80K full time employment. This is my 3rd job in 2 months - i didn't like the first 2 though the salary was almost same in all 3...

Now its been couple of months in Canada- Canada is good & Beautiful country, but we're not liking it here, apart from big cultural shock (specially at office) we're making end of month almost same money what we used to make in India. (household income in India was close to $4K pm & in Canada is little above $4K pm)...

It is not about Canada vs India - it is 'My' life in Canada vs 'My' life in India.

India:
Car+Driver provided by company for free to commute to office daily (almost every Indian MNC provides this facility)
Work from home - whenever I want to
Maids (cheap n easy availability)
Inexpensive day care
Relative support (only Indians will understand )
Visit any relative/friend whenever feel like
Weather - little extra hot for 2 months of the year - but manageable due to AC in car/home/office. Amazing weather for 10 months
Traffic Jams - yes, a lot.
Specialist doctor - waiting 0-7 days
Que discipline - followed 60% of the time
Roads - 60% of the roads are good
Office & housing (we use to live in a big housing society) infra - same or little extra advance than Canada.

Canada:
TTC is good - but jammed during office time, hard to find space to stand as well.
Work from home - not easy - have to convince boss and can't ask every time.
No maids - but human operated Washer, Dryer, Vacuum, etc. available. Yeah - cooking no option- have to cook.
Day care - average $1000 pm (subsidized day-care for lower household income ppl)..
No relative support...
Lot of respect for time & privacy = hence no bumping in a lot
Weather: 4 to 5 months good rest is winter & harsh winter - yes, heaters everywhere.
Traffic jams - yes - but not like india.
Specialist doctor - waiting 2 to 12 months, if emergency - dial 911
Que discipline - followed 95% of the time
Roads: almost 99% of roads i have seen are good

India:
Rent 2 bedroom condo: $200 PM
Car : $ 200 PM with insurance
Hydro: $ 10 pm
Maid: $ 20 pm
Day Care: $ 100 pm (subsidized due to our company Tie-Up)
Internet + Phone: Free (company provided)
Daily office commute: Free (company provided)
Groceries: $ 100 PM
Insurance - Company provided
Misc: 100
Total:730

Canada
Rent: 1+den $ 1620 PM (Heat, water, hydro, Parking & house Insurance included) (they don't give 1 bedroom condo on rent in most of the good buildings to family of 2 adult with 1 small kid, u have to take minimum 1+den)
Internet: $ 45 pm
Phone x2: 90 (60 + 30 for 2 phone)
TTC: $141 pm
Car: 350 (Car & Insurance) I see it cheaper to commute office daily to downtown by TTC rather than parking ur car in downtown.
Groceries: 500 PM
Insurance : half paid by company other half is $110 pm ($53 Per pay)
Misc- 144
Total: 3000 PM

We're thinking of moving back to India - why:
1. Almost same income
2. more savings in India
3. Cultural shock (yes, we overlooked it while moving) in office and in general
4. expensive vacations/outings
5. No friends..
6. Started feeling like we have no life.
7. Missing India
8. missing all the luxuries we had there (driver+maid+work from home+things easily available by paying extra)
9. No relatives (If I get my parents here - it will not be easy to get their PRs now-a-days...they only need working people i guess ...)
10.Not "much" difference in (daily) routine life when compared with India (except weather).
11. we're in our mid 30's, so life is little tough at this phase & age of life to adjust in a new country.
12. Except few things like good road, infrastructure, etc. almost everything is available in India. obviously no clean air n water in India - and for that we have water purifiers and AC in home/office/car. And Air is not really that bad except few places in India where we don't live.
13. good investment options in India (Bank FD's rate is around 8 to 9 % per year and lot of mutual funds doing good with average 14% per year)
15. Education is also not bad - can debate - i see lot of Indians doing good here in Canadian corporate world with Indian education.

List can go on since I am from India and not Canada. And that is why I am here on this forum seeking advice.

So, shall we move back to India or stay in Canada is the biggest question of our life right now.

We're very tensed and confused - I need advice please... like why India or Canada...why go back or don't go back....I welcome everyone's comment but I think Indians will be able to understand our situation more....

withing few months I got 4 offers and worked for 3 companies and left 2 of them working for 1 to 2 weeks and continuing with the 3rd one - so the job market is good and not that tough i would say like India.

Overall - We're comfortable here but not happy and in India we're living luxuries life with full of happiness or say happening events every day every-where. And yes, lot of people are scaring us with -40 degree weather coming soon...

I spoke to few people here in Canada:
Some say Canada is amazing - it is the best place in world - India is not good - not safe, Canada is safe, etc.etc....Hence, let me reiterate - this is only my experience and am no-one to comment/say anything about Canada/India. It is just my life in India vs my life in Canada. I am not saying India or Canada is good or bad. People say based on their experience -

Some said: I am incapable and incompetent to live in Canada - o'common I have a job, house, car, cash in account, etc. I have got really good feedback in just 1 month at work...In fact - this is the advance version of myself. I am working for more than 7 hours a day in office continuously (4 hrs was max in India) and I keep reading books and I am also managing my own finance and cooking and cleaning and a lot f things - which is good - but I've never done so many things myself in India - I had CA for finance - maids, drivers, well lets not get into that - then someone said its good to be self capable but why when we have options...
Some said we're consumer driven country not do savings like India.. I said - how do u manage to save like India here when our basics are so expensive. And if India is not a consumer country - then there is something wrong with Apple, Moto, HP, Dell, Toyota, etc. etc. all take Indian market into consideration before coming up with their next version/product....

Trust me - the way i am living n working here - If I wud have been same in India - i would have saved lot of money and would have grown personally & professionally as well. Imagine kinda efforts we put in for Documents-IELTS-PR-Packing n Moving-Job Hunting-House hunting-trying understand whole new world-etc.etc... I realize if i wud have put in these efforts in something else......

Sometimes I feel we had whole time in the world with friends and relatives everywhere in India...and I have wasted so much time by just going here n there in India and had fun entire day and laughed for 100 times a day...Whereas here - i lost my real laugh.....

I am here on this forum - because I wanted to know why am not able to enjoy my life here...Am i doing something wrong - or My salary is very low where I just meet my basics and save around $1K pm and I should not save that money as well and go on vacation or spend on something which might make us happy??...but then I will not have some emergency funds.... I donno if I should go back or not....please advise.....

Or, maybe this immigration is for the people who are not doing good in India or they don't like India....just a guess...

Hi Sheena, Even I too have same opinion and in dil

 

[Shilpa Lokesh]

Hi Sheena, Have you come to any conclusions, even I'm under same dilemma

 

[manish41711]

We are also in similar boat as her, have decent job offer of 100K, but not able to convince ourselves to move. This particularly becomes problem
If we migrate at later stage and career is going fine. Just my salary is over 115K CAD in India, Bangalore. Not even counting my wife’s salary. So much So that, after 14 years of our marriage now, she left job and pursuing her hobbies at home, looking after our kids and managing finances.

What people say about India (pollution, clean air, traffic etc) is certainly true, but it does not impact us due to earnings. We stay at large plush gated
Communities, (Green, Clean, very safe) within it and similar such communities, its as equal to developed countries. I can easily afford staying close

To work place and commute is not an issue and we have made our life within 5 Kms our locality of Bangalore.
You would see all such gated communities one after another, making the overall society cleaner and safe.

Situation would certainly be different if option would have been with USA, we would like our kid to migrate to USA than intermediate Canada.

You already have a job offer of 100K in canada ?

 

[canadabells]

You already have a job offer of 100K in canada ?

Yes, I do have as of now.

 

[canadabells]

Its very tricky situation, my conclusion each side has its pros and cons and one has to decide on priorities. Canada most likely both have to work for 20-25 years with really decent salaries, In India, if one partners salary is good enough, other spouse can have no or light job. Moreover "investments" really work wonders in India. I was at Yong Street Toronto Bank of Montral in Feb for opening an account, I was discussing with RM and per her, even the most aggressive fund in Canada does not fetch returns more than 6%. This is basic savings rate in India.

But Canada has its own merits too, beautiful country sides and views are splendid. Fresh air and water and big asset too.

 

[manish41711]

Yes, I do have as of now.

Are you in Canada as of now? Or from India how did you get a job?

 

[canadabells]

Are you in Canada as of now? Or from India how did you get a job?

I was in Canada with family (took vacation from work for about 2.5 months), searched for Job , got few interviews and returned to India, Got selected in one of them with decent salary, but now I am in dual mind to make a move or not. Most likely I will not join. In my case, benefits staying in India outweigh that of Canada, Toronto.

 

[canadabells]

you can never earn that kind of salary in Canada.
(Canada has highest % of alcoholism bcoz of lowest disposable income among developed nations)

But comparing Bangalore to even a bankrupt country like Greece is a crime.
that patch of land is un-livable, even 5km travel takes hours/ no water/ no electricity/ no freedom of movement (Claustrophobia is very common), apartments constructed everywhere with no direct sunlight/ ORR on verge of collapsing (you can justify all you want but you also know this state of affairs there.)

Option 1> stay in cheapest room of best hotel
Option 2> stay in costliest room of worst hotel.

Choice is always yours (which you have already made I guess

Not sure , If I agree or not..I stay in Brigade's fabulous township and do not have any issues at all. Roads in very good in Whitefield area..I am not sure what you mean by no water, electricity et all and our life is limited to 6-7 kms radius and we have everything under the sun within this radius and of international quality, right from tutions, hobby classes, schools, clinics, metro rail coming up.. What I feel is in day to day life, this is what it counts. This is where majority of our life goes, I got decent salary job in Toronto, but still can't afford tutions, hobby classes, anything extra curricular (for ex. My daughter is going for IIM Bangalore AI/ML summer classes for 8th Grade, which we can very easily afford). Unless my wife too takes up a equal level job . If my wife also has to take a full time job to survive or splurge a little - Canada is strict No-No for us.

Even then we explored the schools, private schools (Burligton area, Appleby line) are just not affordable, even then , Its impossible. My kids get better quality education here to make them suitable to compete in world.

 

[manish41711]

Not sure , If I agree or not..I stay in Brigade's fabulous township and do not have any issues at all. Roads in very good in Whitefield area..I am not sure what you mean by no water, electricity et all and our life is limited to 6-7 kms radius and we have everything under the sun within this radius and of international quality, right from tutions, hobby classes, schools, clinics, metro rail coming up.. What I feel is in day to day life, this is what it counts. This is where majority of our life goes, I got decent salary job in Toronto, but still can't afford tutions, hobby classes, anything extra curricular (for ex. My daughter is going for IIM Bangalore AI/ML summer classes for 8th Grade, which we can very easily afford). Unless my wife too takes up a equal level job . If my wife also has to take a full time job to survive or splurge a little - Canada is strict No-No for us.

Even then we explored the schools, private schools (Burligton area, Appleby line) are just not affordable, even then , Its impossible. My kids get better quality education here to make them suitable to compete in world.

Am I right in assuming that your salary in India is around 60 lakh per annum?

 

[canadabells]

Am I right in assuming that your salary in India is around 60 lakh per annum?

Yes, bit lesser than that..not considering returns from Mutual Funds etc investments.

 

[manish41711]

Yes, bit lesser than that..not considering returns from Mutual Funds etc investments.

In that case, it would be a no brainer, that you should stay in India. My 2 cents.

 

[mahi2020]

Not sure , If I agree or not..I stay in Brigade's fabulous township and do not have any issues at all. Roads in very good in Whitefield area..I am not sure what you mean by no water, electricity et all and our life is limited to 6-7 kms radius and we have everything under the sun within this radius and of international quality, right from tutions, hobby classes, schools, clinics, metro rail coming up.. What I feel is in day to day life, this is what it counts. This is where majority of our life goes, I got decent salary job in Toronto, but still can't afford tutions, hobby classes, anything extra curricular (for ex. My daughter is going for IIM Bangalore AI/ML summer classes for 8th Grade, which we can very easily afford). Unless my wife too takes up a equal level job . If my wife also has to take a full time job to survive or splurge a little - Canada is strict No-No for us.

Even then we explored the schools, private schools (Burligton area, Appleby line) are just not affordable, even then , Its impossible. My kids get better quality education here to make them suitable to compete in world.

All the best dude, you are happy where you are, and that's what matters.

Regarding roads in Whitefield area, possibly you and I have stayed in different cities with the same name Bangalore.
I prefer India over Canada any day, but was not able to adjust in Bangalore 2.0 (worked in Gurgaon before re-locating to Bangy ... ).

I am not able to adjust in Canada either bcoz of its shit weather.

 

[karma2000]

My 2 cents here....
I have lived in India, Canada, US, Europe and now back to Canada ..all the time making similar or better salary .

Grass does look greener on other side with every move I have undertaken. After returning, I still miss some or more things of every place I lived and in the end realized that everyone has their own factors and ways of calculating what's best.
The happiness factor is true and is the biggest decision maker from emotional level, but deep inside there are several factors. In the end , its hard but it makes you realize that the moment is NOW - this is to be cherished in full first - before judging ourselves and overthinking about it. In the end life is a journey! (my opinion of-course )

So going back to OPs dilemma and other who have posted with similar confusion;
- You are very well damn lucky to have good job offers or belong to industry skills that are transferable
- Coming to new country is not easy and coming with expectations is a major drawback, but it's understandable.
- More important is coming with open mind, a feel for adventure, being the new immigrant who is open to exploring place, friends , culture.
- Most importantly giving enough time to explore this opportunity. Some of you are very lucky to have fallback in your own countries, with family and jobs waiting for you - if you finally decided to go back. .
- Each country has its strengths - Burma is the happiest nation - but not all of us are moving there- so we cannot actually compare places by mathematical formula.
- And most important factor that I feel comes to back of mind - when I moved : I see is all talk of how much or equivalent we used to make at our home country, what we could afford this or that etc..Well, it's great what you made there and pretty damn good you got similar salary here. But, be honest, you didn't take all these efforts to move addresses, or make same $ right?. This is land of opportunity, try a little harder to make 5 times what you made back home and then see how you feel. I understand many say we cannot equate happiness to wealth, but that's what most of you are mentioning again and again (nothing wrong with that). You can have someone else clean your snow, cook food and teach you private yoga here too!. But hell ya, you need to be at a certain level = make that dough! There ware many many great success stories here.
- So in essence, if you are here, the opportunity is right in front of you.
- If you have decided to go back then you probably have a good feeling that your will be able to settle back again. But, then why miss the opportunity to do your best here while you have a better environment for growth - entrepreneurship, education, systems, security etc...worse to worse ..you can even file bankruptcy here! - again not implying anything the wrong way.
- SO please don't overthink this , there must have been some things you thought before making the long journey here, do those things - life is short to regret that I didn't do much in India but was still doing ok and then returning back and thinking oh I didn't give much to Canada, and made a U-turn.
-
Everyone has difference experiences, but progress, improving and accumulation of experiences is what will count in the long run.
Again! most of you/us are very lucky to have this dilemma in some way...make sure to give your best shot wherever you live! As before, you always have a choice to go back - it's not running away !

 

[jspallavi]

suggestion please - very important decision but hard to make: Thinking of moving back to India...please advise...

We recently moved to Canada on a PR visa from India. got a very good job with $80K full time employment. This is my 3rd job in 2 months - i didn't like the first 2 though the salary was almost same in all 3...

Now its been couple of months in Canada- Canada is good & Beautiful country, but we're not liking it here, apart from big cultural shock (specially at office) we're making end of month almost same money what we used to make in India. (household income in India was close to $4K pm & in Canada is little above $4K pm)...

It is not about Canada vs India - it is 'My' life in Canada vs 'My' life in India.

India:
Car+Driver provided by company for free to commute to office daily (almost every Indian MNC provides this facility)
Work from home - whenever I want to
Maids (cheap n easy availability)
Inexpensive day care
Relative support (only Indians will understand )
Visit any relative/friend whenever feel like
Weather - little extra hot for 2 months of the year - but manageable due to AC in car/home/office. Amazing weather for 10 months
Traffic Jams - yes, a lot.
Specialist doctor - waiting 0-7 days
Que discipline - followed 60% of the time
Roads - 60% of the roads are good
Office & housing (we use to live in a big housing society) infra - same or little extra advance than Canada.

Canada:
TTC is good - but jammed during office time, hard to find space to stand as well.
Work from home - not easy - have to convince boss and can't ask every time.
No maids - but human operated Washer, Dryer, Vacuum, etc. available. Yeah - cooking no option- have to cook.
Day care - average $1000 pm (subsidized day-care for lower household income ppl)..
No relative support...
Lot of respect for time & privacy = hence no bumping in a lot
Weather: 4 to 5 months good rest is winter & harsh winter - yes, heaters everywhere.
Traffic jams - yes - but not like india.
Specialist doctor - waiting 2 to 12 months, if emergency - dial 911
Que discipline - followed 95% of the time
Roads: almost 99% of roads i have seen are good

India:
Rent 2 bedroom condo: $200 PM
Car : $ 200 PM with insurance
Hydro: $ 10 pm
Maid: $ 20 pm
Day Care: $ 100 pm (subsidized due to our company Tie-Up)
Internet + Phone: Free (company provided)
Daily office commute: Free (company provided)
Groceries: $ 100 PM
Insurance - Company provided
Misc: 100
Total:730

Canada
Rent: 1+den $ 1620 PM (Heat, water, hydro, Parking & house Insurance included) (they don't give 1 bedroom condo on rent in most of the good buildings to family of 2 adult with 1 small kid, u have to take minimum 1+den)
Internet: $ 45 pm
Phone x2: 90 (60 + 30 for 2 phone)
TTC: $141 pm
Car: 350 (Car & Insurance) I see it cheaper to commute office daily to downtown by TTC rather than parking ur car in downtown.
Groceries: 500 PM
Insurance : half paid by company other half is $110 pm ($53 Per pay)
Misc- 144
Total: 3000 PM

We're thinking of moving back to India - why:
1. Almost same income
2. more savings in India
3. Cultural shock (yes, we overlooked it while moving) in office and in general
4. expensive vacations/outings
5. No friends..
6. Started feeling like we have no life.
7. Missing India
8. missing all the luxuries we had there (driver+maid+work from home+things easily available by paying extra)
9. No relatives (If I get my parents here - it will not be easy to get their PRs now-a-days...they only need working people i guess ...)
10.Not "much" difference in (daily) routine life when compared with India (except weather).
11. we're in our mid 30's, so life is little tough at this phase & age of life to adjust in a new country.
12. Except few things like good road, infrastructure, etc. almost everything is available in India. obviously no clean air n water in India - and for that we have water purifiers and AC in home/office/car. And Air is not really that bad except few places in India where we don't live.
13. good investment options in India (Bank FD's rate is around 8 to 9 % per year and lot of mutual funds doing good with average 14% per year)
15. Education is also not bad - can debate - i see lot of Indians doing good here in Canadian corporate world with Indian education.

List can go on since I am from India and not Canada. And that is why I am here on this forum seeking advice.

So, shall we move back to India or stay in Canada is the biggest question of our life right now.

We're very tensed and confused - I need advice please... like why India or Canada...why go back or don't go back....I welcome everyone's comment but I think Indians will be able to understand our situation more....

withing few months I got 4 offers and worked for 3 companies and left 2 of them working for 1 to 2 weeks and continuing with the 3rd one - so the job market is good and not that tough i would say like India.

Overall - We're comfortable here but not happy and in India we're living luxuries life with full of happiness or say happening events every day every-where. And yes, lot of people are scaring us with -40 degree weather coming soon...

I spoke to few people here in Canada:
Some say Canada is amazing - it is the best place in world - India is not good - not safe, Canada is safe, etc.etc....Hence, let me reiterate - this is only my experience and am no-one to comment/say anything about Canada/India. It is just my life in India vs my life in Canada. I am not saying India or Canada is good or bad. People say based on their experience -

Some said: I am incapable and incompetent to live in Canada - o'common I have a job, house, car, cash in account, etc. I have got really good feedback in just 1 month at work...In fact - this is the advance version of myself. I am working for more than 7 hours a day in office continuously (4 hrs was max in India) and I keep reading books and I am also managing my own finance and cooking and cleaning and a lot f things - which is good - but I've never done so many things myself in India - I had CA for finance - maids, drivers, well lets not get into that - then someone said its good to be self capable but why when we have options...
Some said we're consumer driven country not do savings like India.. I said - how do u manage to save like India here when our basics are so expensive. And if India is not a consumer country - then there is something wrong with Apple, Moto, HP, Dell, Toyota, etc. etc. all take Indian market into consideration before coming up with their next version/product....

Trust me - the way i am living n working here - If I wud have been same in India - i would have saved lot of money and would have grown personally & professionally as well. Imagine kinda efforts we put in for Documents-IELTS-PR-Packing n Moving-Job Hunting-House hunting-trying understand whole new world-etc.etc... I realize if i wud have put in these efforts in something else......

Sometimes I feel we had whole time in the world with friends and relatives everywhere in India...and I have wasted so much time by just going here n there in India and had fun entire day and laughed for 100 times a day...Whereas here - i lost my real laugh.....

I am here on this forum - because I wanted to know why am not able to enjoy my life here...Am i doing something wrong - or My salary is very low where I just meet my basics and save around $1K pm and I should not save that money as well and go on vacation or spend on something which might make us happy??...but then I will not have some emergency funds.... I donno if I should go back or not....please advise.....

Or, maybe this immigration is for the people who are not doing good in India or they don't like India....just a guess...

You just moved to Toronto, your salary is double of what the average Canadian earns, give it time.

There is a huge Indian community in Toronto, you should try to find some kind of club to meet people of your homecountry, maybe that will make you feel more comfortable.

Cheers

Hi Sheena I recently moved to Halifax Canada. My thoughts match with yours. I feel like going back to India. What was your final decision? Enlighten me ad you are more experienced