Renewal of nearly expired PR card

[umelmeir]

Hello there,
Most likely Leon is going to answer my question, lol. You are such a nice, honest, direct person !
I landed on 10 Jan 2008, ( my passport expiry date was 06/06/2009 ) for the year 2008 I was physically present for at least 52 days ( you will know later why I said at least ) I renewed my passport in my home country sometimes either last quarter of 2008 or 1st quarter of 2009.
In 2009 I remember that I visited Canada at least 2 times, for min 30 days a visit, 2010 I lost the renewed passport during a visit to my home country so I had to obtain a new one that I received on 5 May 2010. Since then I have exact track of days I was physically here in Canada, but I don't have any exact information for the time between 10 Sept 2008 and 05 May 2010.
By the time my card will expire 20 Jan 2013 & based on the two passports ( stamps of borders ) which I have handy, I'll be completing 830 days of physically presence.

I have four questions please :
1- Since the processing times for renewing a PR takes 86 days after CIC receive my application, shall I apply for renewal ASAP / or by 26 Oct 2012 so I get the new PR before / with the expiry of this one ( 20 Jan 2013 ) ? Or shall I wait for a complete 730 days or more then I apply ? Do CIC consider the time of 86 days as presence ? ( Obviously I will be in Canada ) or they don't ?
2 - If I complete the 730 days, do I have to clarify the 1095 days I was outside Canada? Or if my presence in Canada is more than 730 days in the past five years ( for example 735 days ) then I don't have to clarify my absence ?
3 - Would there be in consequences of having my PR expired before applying / receiving a new one ?
Will I ever be asked to leave Canada ? Would CIC not grant me a new PR card ? When CIC says that I have to be in Canada for at least 2 years out of the five years, do they mean the LAST five years ? Or the 5 years of the original PR card that was granted when I landed ?
I know I might sound very silly, it's just eating my head & I am so worried.
4 - When I'll be applying for citizenship ( whenevr I'll be eligible to ) what would happen to the gap between 10 Sept 2008 and 05 May 2010 ? Will I need to get a police report that I lost my passport back in 2010 ? What about the times that I visited Canada then but I don't have the dates nor the stamps ? ( Due to my lost passport ), or would it be just easier / safer to wait till I complete 1095 days based on the passports that I already have handy ?

I'm sorry if I made it so long & thank you in advance for all your help & time.

 

[Leon]

1. You can only list days you already stayed by the time you apply. If you apply now, they will check if you have 730 days in Canada since you landed as a PR or if you could manage to have 730 days by the time of your 5 year landing anniversary. Having less then 730 days when you apply even if you could have 730 days on your 5 year anniversary would increase the risk that you will get a residency questionnaire which would really delay your application. It is therefore better to wait until you have 730 days or more.

2. You have to list the dates you were in Canada vs. the dates that you weren't. You don't have to give any mitigating circumstances if you meet the residency requirements but you might want to send some proof of having stayed in Canada when you said you did.

3. No, there are no consequences for letting your PR card expire when you are living in Canada. If you are a PR for less than 5 years when you apply to renew, they look at if you have already or still could meet the residency obligation in your first 5 years as a PR. If you are a PR for more than 5 years when you apply, they only look at the past 5 years.

4. For PR and citizenship, they like to see all your passports. If you did lose your passport, you should have some records of that like a police report. However, if you do meet the requirements when you apply without counting time stayed that you can not prove, then they can not refuse. When you apply for citizenship, you must have 1095 days within a 4 year period. Time stayed in 2008 is already expiring now because of that 4 year window.

 

[umelmeir]

Thank you so much Leon for a fast reply
I was just checking other people post & some of them seem to have my same case, they applied for a renewal after their PR expired & now the CIC agent is telling them that waiting time might take up to 20 months !!!!!
So here is the thing : my card will expire on 20 Jan 2013, I'll not apply for a renewal till I be 100 % sure that I have over 730 days, I understand that I can live in Canada with an expired PR, I understand that it'll have no impact whatsoever, but what about that long waiting time ? 20 Months ???!! By that time I'll be eligible to apply for a citizenship, what would happen to the gab when I don't have my PR renewed / received yet but I was physically in Canada for more than 1095 days ? Will I be still able to apply for citizenship or not ? How would they consider this time ( the time from an expired PR till issuing a new one ) ?
Thanking you in advance.

 

[Leon]

Let your PR card expire and do not apply until you have more than 730 days counting back the past 5 years. The more days you have when you apply, the lower is the risk that you would have of getting an RQ (residency questionnaire, really delays your application). The normal processing time for a PR card renewal is about 3 months, not 20.

When you have 1095 days, you can apply for citizenship, regardless of if you have renewed your PR card or not.

 

[saannto]

does your PR card has a date of expiry like 20 Jan 2013 -- because my PR card says expiry date as Jan 2013. please clarify. I am planning to leave country in Dec 2012 and return Jan 21 2013.\

I landed Nov 01 2007 so my fifth anniversary is on Nov 01 2012 ...

 

[umelmeir]

does your PR card has a date of expiry like 20 Jan 2013 -- because my PR card says expiry date as Jan 2013. please clarify. I am planning to leave country in Dec 2012 and return Jan 21 2013.\

I landed Nov 01 2007 so my fifth anniversary is on Nov 01 2012 ...

Yes saanto my PR clearely show expiry date 20 Jan 2013 ( The 20 is hidden under the maple leaf ) you may want to double check that.
P.S. I landed on 10 Jan 2008, I'm not sure about your case but if you landed on 01 Nov 2007 then expiry date of your card should be 20 Nov 2012, I have no clue why they granted you officialy 2 months on top of the 5 years ??!!

 

[umelmeir]

4. For PR and citizenship, they like to see all your passports. If you did lose your passport, you should have some records of that like a police report. However, if you do meet the requirements when you apply without counting time stayed that you can not prove, then they can not refuse. When you apply for citizenship, you must have 1095 days within a 4 year period. Time stayed in 2008 is already expiring now because of that 4 year window.

Very clear Leon, thank u so much
No I don't have any police record of my lost passport, my home country is having a civil war for the past 18 months now, I'm so scared getting back there to get a proove from the immigration there stating that I lost my passport, it has been already almost 3 years now. I thought abt contacting my embassy in Ottawa so they request that from the immigration back home ( I don't even know if it's doable ) however I DO know they are not going to cooperate with me quickly enough ......... So .........
Laugh at me if u like, lol, I just knew that there is an agency that records our entries to Canada, would it be against me if I contacted them asking them to provide me of my entries history ? ( This will help me wih getting the information that I'm missing now due to my lost passport ), besides it's a clear proof to the CIC of the days I have been here right ? I also read something abt getting my OHIP card history, which might help as well but will not be as clear proof as the agency records as I was thinking what if I didn't get sick in some of my short visits ?

Thanking you in advance !!

 

[Leon]

You can get your travels history from CBSA but do not bother with OHIP card history lest OHIP should find out that you were outside Canada that much, they may say you should have lost your OHIP and should pay back for the costs you incurred.

 

[karenps]

You mentioned that:
I was just checking other people post & some of them seem to have my same case, they applied for a renewal after their PR expired & now the CIC agent is telling them that waiting time might take up to 20 months !!!!!


The 20 months wait is if your renewal application has been sent to the local office. If your case is straight forward (i.e., you've been in canada for well over 2 years), it usually happens within 3 months. However, my parents' file was transferred to the local office because they have been in canada for 733 days (3 days more than the minimum) in the past 5 years and so I guess they are checking to make sure htey really were here. As a result, there is a delay. I called the call center and the agent said it's taking 20 months for them to get back to us from the date the file was received by them. Hope this helps.

Karen

 

[umelmeir]

You mentioned that:
I was just checking other people post & some of them seem to have my same case, they applied for a renewal after their PR expired & now the CIC agent is telling them that waiting time might take up to 20 months !!!!!
The 20 months wait is if your renewal application has been sent to the local office. If your case is straight forward (i.e., you've been in canada for well over 2 years), it usually happens within 3 months. However, my parents' file was transferred to the local office because they have been in canada for 733 days (3 days more than the minimum) in the past 5 years and so I guess they are checking to make sure htey really were here. As a result, there is a delay. I called the call center and the agent said it's taking 20 months for them to get back to us from the date the file was received by them. Hope this helps. Karen

Well honestly it was your parent's case that I was referring to, however why would CIC transfer your parent's file to the local office ? I mean as you are saying they already have more than 730 days ( Even if it's only 3 days on top of that ), so they do meet the residency requirement, I still can't understand ! After 12 months they'll be eligible to apply for citizenship ( Without receiving yet their PR !!! ) I just don't get it !

 

[karenps]

I know! It's such a frustrating situation for us. My parents wouldn't be eligible for their citizenship because they travel back and forth. They have extended family back in their home country and an extended social network. They come here every other year and spend time with us but then go back in the winter. They are in their 70s and totally dependent on us. We try our best to keep them from getting bored, but with our work schedules, it's very hard. So we incur the expense of sending them back home when it gets cold here so they are happy. They will be moving here permanently in a year or so.

But we made absolute SURE they had the minimum number of days required to maintain their PR status. We spoke to lawyers, CIC agents and NO ONE told us that their application would be scrutinized even after meeting the requirements, even if by a few days. Had we known, we would have asked them to stay longer. So now it's just a waiting game.

Karen

 

[umelmeir]

I know! It's such a frustrating situation for us. My parents wouldn't be eligible for their citizenship because they travel back and forth. They have extended family back in their home country and an extended social network. They come here every other year and spend time with us but then go back in the winter. They are in their 70s and totally dependent on us. We try our best to keep them from getting bored, but with our work schedules, it's very hard. So we incur the expense of sending them back home when it gets cold here so they are happy. They will be moving here permanently in a year or so.
But we made absolute SURE they had the minimum number of days required to maintain their PR status. We spoke to lawyers, CIC agents and NO ONE told us that their application would be scrutinized even after meeting the requirements, even if by a few days. Had we known, we would have asked them to stay longer. So now it's just a waiting game.
Karen

Oh ok I think I misunderstood the situation but now it's clear, so basically they are NOT in Canada, it makes a lot of sense to me now, even it doesn't make any sense to me at all that being physically present in Canada for over 730 days is not sasisfactory enough to get the PRs renwed !
Good luck !

 

[karenps]

They are in Canada now but have traveled back and fiorth In the past 5 years. Will keep you posted on what happens. Thanks.