Escaping from Africa.

[KGB]

-I am just interested to know if there are any other people living in Africa planning on escaping this dark continent by emigrating to Canada?

-South Africa has the second highest murder rate in the world, could this be considered a Genocide (white people being killed by black people)? That would enable me and my family to apply for refugee status. We are all multiple degree holders but I am afraid that some or all of us will be killed before we get processed in the Federal skilled worker category.

-How many people would I have to prove have been killed by a different race in order for it to be classified as a genocide (or does it need to be an organized genocide for it to qualify?)

 

[ghiaskhan]

Well we all are human, killing of white,black,brown or yellow is called sin by the believers and crime in the legal language. Why a fellow human should kill another? Why should we be unjust? why should we rob others wealth? No one can give justifications in their answer. Politics and polititions are the main sourses of all evil acts, and millions are being killed daily all around the world, as if human life is so chap to lose. Its not only south Africa,Iraq, or Afghanistan . Its happening everywhere and millions are on the run for refuge to other countries.Killers justify their killings in the name of humanity and human rights. So who is to invesigate.Can you expect goat and a Tiger eating in the same plate? Good luck, leaving your home is the most difficult act

 

[slmz]

-How many people would I have to prove have been killed by a different race in order for it to be classified as a genocide (or does it need to be an organized genocide for it to qualify?)

Out of curiosity, I went to search Wiki for genocide and found this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide

According to the United Nations Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (CPPCG), Article 2, genocide is defined as "any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."

 

[KGB]

Thank you for your trouble “slmz”.
-It seems as if white people living in South Africa might fall under that definition.

-The problem is that in Africa governments instruct the national Statistics agencies to stop collecting any data that might reflect negatively on them making it impossible to prove.

-I am currently including this topic in the Thesis that I am writing for my second law degree.

-Hate crimes black people perpetuate against white people here are almost always put under a different crime category because it is usually accompanied by theft or murder.
Here are 2 examples:

i) A (white) woman got her fingers cut off during a robbery and it was classified as a burglary and assault with the intent to cause greaves bodily harm.

http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442_2232176,00.html

ii) A (white) lady was burnt with an iron until she died of a hart-attack and that to was not classified as a hate crime.

http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442_2287164,00.html
http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442_2289349,00.html

-This is not like the Columbine shooting in the US this happens every single day, I frequently joke that Canada has boring news since their people don’t get killed in creative ways. You might think that this joke is in bad taste but it reflects the desperation that white people feel to leave this country.

-The gov has also stopped collecting data for immigration but a recent commercial survey suggests that half of all white South Africans have left the country since 1994.

 

[Leon]

You can arrive in Canada and claim refugee status for sure and it will buy you a few years here if you keep appealing but in the end if you are refused, they will send you back. You could also bring your family over on a visit visa and see if you or your partner can get a job fast enough so that you can get a work permit before your visit visa expires. You can buy time by extending your visit visa too. It's a bit risky but if it were me, I would not try the refugee route unless you get a good immigration lawyer who can guarantee that your application will be accepted.

 

[BCguy]

There are lots of White South Africans here in BC,Some options Take a course,Come in as Student allowed to work Part time,Then Come in under the International Graduate Category of PNP,Come in as a visitor,Find a job and come in under PNP,Get a job through an agency if you pay their fees,Thoudands of people from the third world do that monthly,Dont wait for the FSW.

 

[KSN]

All races in South Africa have experienced crime in the last few years and not just white people. There is also history in South Africa where non-whites were brutally attacked by white people due to hatred. There is still inequality in the job market there as well. White people still hold most of the high earning jobs.

Recently University of Free State students posted a video on myspace. THIS IS WITHOUT A DOUBT RACE RELATED. The link is below. This gives a glimpse into what other races dealt with during apartheid.

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=2941&art_id=nw20081114105514291C927433

 

[vic48912]

KGB,

Please save us the gory details of the trevails of white people in South Africa. In as much as i abhor violence against any of Gods creation, I dont appreciated the manner you are denigrating blacks in South Africa as if there is a national policy of genocide.
Moreover the violence in South Africa can be trace back to demonising policy of racist white regime that dehumanised blacks, it seem the chicken have come home to roasts. The poor or disadvantage in in any society tend to gravitate to crime and the they most often perpertuate violence on the rich. It happen all over the world. In South Africa, the rich are mostly white and are disappropriately targetted, that does not show thats there is an orchestrated effort to commit genocide against the white......AND ALSO DOES NOT FIT THE DEFINITION OF GENOCIDE.....Genocide is systematic and delibrate destruction of an ethnic, racial, religious group.

If claimimg genocide against white group in South Africa is the route you intend to use to enter Canada, I wish you good luck as i sense some racist undertone in your posting.

Vic

 

[ghiaskhan]

There are so many options available. claiming asylum is an option.If you have to do it, you could also consider taking refuge in Europe rather than going from sunshine Africa to frozen Canada. You may also consider migrating to your ancestor's home country where you may be legally allowed to settle down wihout much of problems that you may face in USA, UK or Canada.I feel you may be having inherent rights of settlemnt.

The majority of foreign nationals do not need a visa to visit the Netherlands for a period not exceeding three months, but they must hold a valid passport or EU identify card. On arrival in the Netherlands, there is a requirement for all non EU/EEA/Swiss nationals to submit an application for a residence permit and to register with the local municipal offices, whether or not they required an MVV to enter the country.

An application for a residence permit must be accompanied by birth certificates for the main applicant and any dependants, marriage certificate if applicable and divorce decree if married before. All documents must be legalized and translated if necessary. Additional documents such as your work permit and evidence of health insurance are also likely to be requested. Legalized birth, marriage and divorce certificates are also required when registering at the local municipal offices. Documents from other countries must be legalized and translated if necessary.

 

[BCguy]

To add to that I just talked to a contact who used to be the Chairman of the IRB or Immigration Refugee Board in BC and He said that such a application will be denied 99.999% of the time and He personally would have denied it.find another method

 

[ghiaskhan]

Thats a bad news, consider going bck to your ancestral home country. You may be having inherant rights there.
good luck

 

[KGB]

-Thank you very much for your replies, I really appreciate it.

-(“BCguy”, “Leon” and “Ghiaskhan” thank you for all the constructive replies under most of the posted topics, I on average find your “posts” most helpful.)

-(“KSN” and “Vic” thank you for your criticism it is important to take all sides of a story into account and I appreciate that fact.)

-Here is a quote for the day: “Knowledge is power, but enthusiasm pulls the switch.”
-Have a nice day to you all.

 

[ghiaskhan]

A nice comment

 

[KGB]

“As a white South African, you should have had all the priviledge of good education under apartheid”

Hi Rupeshhari:
-Yes I have I good education so let me put it to work to explaining one thing:
(amongst other things I majored in Economics in my B-com Law degree)
-I do not mean to be rude, just to clarify something.

-The one thing that makes “human capital” special is that it has increasing returns to scale, whereas all other capital (for instance machinery) has a diminishing return to scale.

What this means is if you increase the amount of machinery the output per machine (the total output divided by the total number of machines) will first increase in relation to the additional machines added and will then start to decrease. It looks like this:
Graph 1:

“Human capital” also looks like this except if you add “substantial education”, then it looks like this:
Graph 2:

The point that I am trying to make is this:
-I agree with you that black people were disadvantaged during apartheid and a result of this was that almost all black people were “low skilled workers”.
-The graph for “low skilled workers” is the same as the very top graph (graph 1).
-In other words 30 000 000 uneducated black people have a diminishing return to scale.

What this means is if you increase the amount of “low skilled workers” being used in the economy the output per “low skilled workers” (the total output divided by the total number of “low skilled workers”) will first increase in relation to the additional “low skilled workers” added and will then start to decrease.

-The point is that white people were not helped by the large number of “low skilled workers”. There were NO advantages for white people resulting from the suppression of black people as many people think. [We are not in ancient Egypt any more everyone (society as a whole) benefits from educating the population].
-I brought this topic up in second and third year economics and all 4 of my Lecturers agree with my conclusion.

-It is like the US recession dragging the whole world into recession.

-The only advantage according to most people might be that South Africa was one of the safest countries in the world (in white areas) before black people were allowed to integrate into white areas. (I would not know about this since I was very young in 1994.

-Thank you for your suggestions Rupeshhari, yesi can do almost all of the options you mentioned but my parents are teachers and I am concerned that they might not be able to take advantage of the options that are available to leave the country immediately, or under FSW.

-Thanx for the “heads up” with the police certificate (I am glad that the didn’t mess yours up)

 

[KSN]

KGB

First of all do you agree that all races in South Africa have suffered from crime?
Let me explain to you without graphs how non-white races were disadvantaged and white races were given everything.

A) With high ranking jobs white people earn more money. This would mean that white people would have more money than the other races. They also paid minimal taxes.
B) Government funding for schools. They used to fund each school per child. Guess which child used to get most of the money from the government? White children. But I guess your argument is that white people paid more taxes so they need it more right. They used to get 100 times more than black children. But I GUESS labourers children don’t deserve equal education according to you. Your schools also had a lot more sporting facilities, a lot more cleaners a lot more teachers per class. Black children were lucky if that bathrooms and shoes.
C) Municipal rates. Who used to pay more? Indians and Coloureds. That’s right. Their money was used to pay for your fathers grass to be cut. Just speaking of one task.
D)How many white people do you see cleaning other non-whites garden. Do you think they used to love coming to work to do that don’t you.
E)If there was no disadvantage you would have no problem living the life of a HARD WORKING black man or woman. Since white people were not really at any advantage.

DO YOU STILL THINK YOU DID NOT HAVE AN ADVANTAGE. You should speak to blacks, Indians, and coloureds before you form an opinion. Your lecturers forgot to use common sense when they agreed with you.

Take the advice of the of ghiaskhan and consider going back to ancestral home country.