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Issue with Landlord (Toronto)

jagan542

Star Member
Aug 12, 2018
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I moved into a condo in August. But in the month of December, the kitchen sink pipe got detached with the outward pipe and the water drained out onto the hardwood floor. With this, some part of the floor around the kitchen started to bulge, maybe because it was exposed to water. Now the landlord says it was my mistake that I intentionally did something that caused the pipe to detach and lead the hardwood floor to bulge.

The landlord wants me to claim the insurance to get this repaired (change the flooring) and says that this is completely my responsibility as the tenant needs to take care of all the repairs that happen inside the unit. I am not sure if talking to the insurance guys is the right thing or what needs to be done?

Please suggest.
 

Qwertypod

Hero Member
Jan 28, 2019
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This is exactly why you have renters (tenant) insurance. Use it and get this fixed. Landlords are largely responsible for appliance repair, not leaks.
 

jagan542

Star Member
Aug 12, 2018
82
44
This is exactly why you have renters (tenant) insurance. Use it and get this fixed. Landlords are largely responsible for appliance repair, not leaks.
Thanks for your reply.
I will try to contact the insurance company and see how this works.
 

scylla

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I moved into a condo in August. But in the month of December, the kitchen sink pipe got detached with the outward pipe and the water drained out onto the hardwood floor. With this, some part of the floor around the kitchen started to bulge, maybe because it was exposed to water. Now the landlord says it was my mistake that I intentionally did something that caused the pipe to detach and lead the hardwood floor to bulge.

The landlord wants me to claim the insurance to get this repaired (change the flooring) and says that this is completely my responsibility as the tenant needs to take care of all the repairs that happen inside the unit. I am not sure if talking to the insurance guys is the right thing or what needs to be done?

Please suggest.
The landlord's insurance should cover this. I suspect you have a cheap landlord that doesn't want to take the insurance hit.

You should only have to cover this if the pipe breaking was somehow your responsibility. If you did nothing to break the pipe, then you should tell your landlord this and let him / her know that you are not responsible for covering the damage. Tell them that you know your rights as a tenant. There are many resources to help you:

https://settlement.org/ontario/housing/rent-a-home/tenant-rights-and-responsibilities/what-are-my-rights-as-a-tenant/

https://tribunalsontario.ca/documents/ltb/Brochures/Maintenance and Repairs (EN).pdf

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2015/02/17/what-you-need-to-know-if-your-rental-unit-is-damaged-by-flooding/
 

Islander216

Champion Member
Nov 27, 2019
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A lot of landlords also use cheap garbage as wood tiles which always bulge at the mere smattering of water on them.

I agree, if you aren't at fault it's not you responsibility to fix it. The idea that you would sabotage the pipe to cause this is absurd and would not hold up in any legal proceeding.
 
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canuck78

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Jun 18, 2017
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As long you didn’t cause the leak, you reported the leak and didn’t leave the water on the floor once you noticed the leak it’s not up to you to fix the leak.
 

steaky

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As long you didn’t cause the leak, you reported the leak and didn’t leave the water on the floor once you noticed the leak it’s not up to you to fix the leak.
Unless it is too much for them, some tenants may choose to fix the leak.
 

Beltex

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It sounds like the kitchen sink drain pipe became detached somehow. A somewhat unusual event, unless some activity was being undertaken in the area of where the disconnect occurred. Even then, the connection should be sufficiently durable to withstand some bumping, jarring, or whatever.

However, as scylla has said, if the disconnection occurred without any fault on the tenant's part, then it should fall under the landlord's obligation to repair and maintain the premises.

I disagree with Qwertypod's view that "Landlords are largely responsible for appliance repair, not leaks." They are responsible for both, if there is no fault (including negligence) on the part of the tenant. For example, let's suppose the washing machine in the rental premises decides to spring a leak, from old age, some defect in the machine, or whatever. Taken at face value, under Qwerty's regime, the landlord would repair or replace the machine and the tenant would pay for the water damage caused by the leak from the faulty appliance, even if the tenant did nothing to cause said leak. That seems hardly fair or just.

Assuming the tenant has insurance that would respond (as in the case of most tenant policies), that insurer would likely appoint an adjuster to investigate the loss, and the insurer would likely deny coverage if it formed the opinion that there was no liability on the part of the tenant. In any event, even if the insurer would agree to accept the claim, the tenant should be slow to claim under his/her policy. One does not want to find oneself with any kind of a record of making claims. That can lead to two undesirable consequences: (i) an increase in future premiums, or, worse (ii) a denial of future coverage.

If the L/L claims under the L/L's policy, its insurer will also likely investigate and make at determination as to whether the loss falls within the L/L's coverage. In many cases, where both L/L and Tnt. are insured, both insurers become involved and seek to agree on which policy should cover the loss. If I were the landlord and I thought my insurance should be the one to pay, I probably would not claim unless the quantum of loss was high indeed. Better to simply self-insure against small losses and save making any claim for something major.

Taking me as an example, on both my home and on a rental property, I have sought and obtained a policy deductible of $10,000, even though, for a higher premium, the deductible would be only $1,000. Frankly, I would rather cover a loss of $10,000 out of my own pocket than find my insurer deciding to dump me at policy renewal time. It happens. I want coverage if the place burns to the ground and I am facing a million dollar loss. Replacing a kitchen floor I can handle.
Good for you on obtaining such cover. Insurance was initially envisaged to protect people from the total disaster of losing everything. Insurance these days seems to have morphed into a kind of social protection policy for the the clueless, witless and feckless, the high cost of premiums today is completely due to the over the top comprehensive nature of modern cover with seemingly endless added extras, bells and whistles which i think encourages claims. Like you I'm quite happy to accept responsibility for all but the largest of claims in return for a low basic premium.
 
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jagan542

Star Member
Aug 12, 2018
82
44
The landlord's insurance should cover this. I suspect you have a cheap landlord that doesn't want to take the insurance hit.

You should only have to cover this if the pipe breaking was somehow your responsibility. If you did nothing to break the pipe, then you should tell your landlord this and let him / her know that you are not responsible for covering the damage. Tell them that you know your rights as a tenant. There are many resources to help you:

https://settlement.org/ontario/housing/rent-a-home/tenant-rights-and-responsibilities/what-are-my-rights-as-a-tenant/

https://tribunalsontario.ca/documents/ltb/Brochures/Maintenance and Repairs (EN).pdf

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2015/02/17/what-you-need-to-know-if-your-rental-unit-is-damaged-by-flooding/
Thanks much for the info.