Inland vs Outland Spousal Sponsorship - please help!

[LittleMermaid]

Hello everybody

I am new to the forum and this is my very first post.

I am a 22 year old British woman currently in Canada on a Working Holiday visa from the UK. My boyfriend is Canadian, and we have been together in total for about 3 and a half years. We split up briefly last year, and therefore both of us didn't want to rush into any kind of sponsorship so we agreed I would come over as a visitor for six months, then apply for my working holiday visa when it opened at the beginning of 2012 and see where things went from there. I got the visa successfully at the end of February of this year and as of March have been working for Scotiabank.

We are almost positive we do not apply for the common-law sponsorship option - although we have a joint bank account, emails, photos etc to prove our relationship is in fact genuine, we unfortunately possess no other financial documents as we pay no bills/rent where we reside.

So, we are now looking at spousal sponsorship.

My working holiday visa expires in February of 2013. We are curious as to whether we could get married now, and process our Spousal visa and if we could just apply for either a second turn on my working holiday visa/IEC initiative OR whether the Government would accept (in conjunction with our PR application for myself) an extension to stay in Canada while the spousal visa is fully processed.

We are wondering what is best for us and I suppose really the specific ins and outs of inland vs outland sponsorship.

I am also curious of the average inland application length for a couple like us, as the Government of Canada site says anywhere from 6-18 months (the latter seems extensive considering). Neither of us have had any prior serious relationships, nor dependants, nor have we committed any crimes. It would be ideal if the process in entirety for inland visa processing only took 6-8 months for us/our situation, as I am allowed to stay until late February of next year.

We are going to make an appointment with an immigration contact of a mutual friend, but as I am not sure if/when that appointment will definitely take place, I thought I would also seek advice on here because you seem like a supportive, knowledgeable source.

Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated. This is causing us much stress.

 

[computergeek]

Outland is generally preferred because it is faster (3 months for first stage + 6 months for London at present). You are free to leave while it is in process. Inland requires 11 months (stage 1 approval) + 8 months (completion of your part of the application) and you cannot (safely) leave Canada (if you are refused re-entry, your inland application is dead in that case). If you choose outland the one risk is that if they require an interview for you, it will be conducted in London. Note: those numbers are 80% completion numbers, so it is often possible to achieve completion times that are faster than these. If you have anything complicated in your application, it may require additional time.

You can certainly apply to renew your work permit, although odds are that if you were to submit now, you would be done (or very close to done) by the time your existing work permit expires, so even if it did not come through you could convert to a visitor visa while they finish up your application.

Good luck!

 

[LittleMermaid]

So you can file for outland sponsorship but still be in Canada? I didn't think that was an option.

Forgive me...I thought outland vs. inland was basically applying from outside or in, as simple as that.

 

[computergeek]

So you can file for outland sponsorship but still be in Canada? I didn't think that was an option.

CIC actually prefers outland processing (or has in the past, although they are now moving some "outland" processing inside Canada).

Outland versus Inland relates to where your application is processed, although a casual reading of the CIC website will leave you with the impression that it depends upon where you are located - it does not. LOTS of people apply via the outland route (because it has been faster in the recent past) than inland. This MAY be changing a bit, as I'm noticing a number of inland applications now being completed in under a year and combined with the recent outland CIC changes (e.g., the closure of the Buffalo Consulate, as well as numerous other overseas visa offices) but we won't know its impact for at least a year or two.

Forgive me...I thought outland vs. inland was basically applying from outside or in, as simple as that.

I'd say that it's probably the # 1 misconception when it comes to spousal sponsorship. Most anyone from a visa exempt country is better off going outland because you can leave Canada without fear of losing your application. If you apply inland, your only safe course of action is to remain in Canada because if you are refused re-entry at the border (a BSO in a bad mood) an inland application becomes moot (since you MUST be inside Canada for such an application.)

 

[LittleMermaid]

Wow thanks! I would have never figured that out by myself. My boyfriend and I are both intelligent people but the government site sometimes makes our heads spin.

Could I get my medical done here in Canada, and apply for my police certificate and finger prints etc done here also?

 

[computergeek]

Yes, you can get finger prints and medicals inside Canada, even while applying Outland. In fact, you can have your medicals done anywhere in the world (as long as they are done by a DMP).

 

[philipsweden]

Computer geek,

You say you can have the medical done anywhere in the world.

If I choose the outland spousal sponsorship and designate London as the VO for my application even though I am Swedish can I still do the medical in China where I am at the moment???

 

[Leon]

Computer geek,

You say you can have the medical done anywhere in the world.

If I choose the outland spousal sponsorship and designate London as the VO for my application even though I am Swedish can I still do the medical in China where I am at the moment???

Yes, you can do your medical wherever there is a DMP. Just make sure you tell them your visa office is London so they know where to send it.

 

[Tsichi15]

computer geek,

I'm also an outland applicant, visa office is Abu dhabi, I am from Philippines. I just submitted the required documents last month as requested by the embassy. Problem is my contract in Saudi will end this coming January. Is it ok for me to stay in Philippines while the application is ongoing in Abu Dhabi. What if an interview is required? Is it also applicable to do it in another country just like the medical? Thank u so much for the reply.

 

[computergeek]

Yes, you can do your medical wherever there is a DMP. Just make sure you tell them your visa office is London so they know where to send it.

Note they are now called "Panel Physicians".

 

[computergeek]

I'm also an outland applicant, visa office is Abu dhabi, I am from Philippines. I just submitted the required documents last month as requested by the embassy. Problem is my contract in Saudi will end this coming January. Is it ok for me to stay in Philippines while the application is ongoing in Abu Dhabi. What if an interview is required? Is it also applicable to do it in another country just like the medical? Thank u so much for the reply.

If an interview is required and you cannot attend their office, they should coordinate with you for a different location.

 

[PMM]

Hi

If an interview is required and you cannot attend their office, they should coordinate with you for a different location.

They won't. You apply at an office, they request interview, then you have to appear at that office.

 

[computergeek]

They won't. You apply at an office, they request interview, then you have to appear at that office.

I know there are cases in which someone applies via a specific office but cannot obtain a visa to visit that office (e.g., a regional office) and there is information in the manuals about such cases. Are you saying that if you were required to apply through Singapore, for example, but were prohibited from visiting Singapore they would refuse your application categorically?

I did a search of CanLii and cannot find any cases on point (either way) on this issue, though there is no statutory right to an interview. I couldn't find a single refusal upheld (or overturned) by the Court in similar circumstances.

 

[PMM]

Hi

I know there are cases in which someone applies via a specific office but cannot obtain a visa to visit that office (e.g., a regional office) and there is information in the manuals about such cases. Are you saying that if you were required to apply through Singapore, for example, but were prohibited from visiting Singapore they would refuse your application categorically?

I did a search of CanLii and cannot find any cases on point (either way) on this issue, though there is no statutory right to an interview. I couldn't find a single refusal upheld (or overturned) by the Court in similar circumstances.

1. Your example of Singapore. Bangladesh and Vietnam are a couple of countries that apply through Singapore. For an interview, it will be held in their home country as Singapore has itinerant services, where an officer from Singapore conducts the interview in the applicants country.
2. The only way an application will be transferred is for the "Integrity of the program" See: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/bulletins/2010/ob180.asp specifically

Visa offices are not required to transfer files for any other reasons. Such reasons include cases of applicants who comply with subsection R11(1) for the specified visa office, at the time the application is received at the CIO, but subsequently leave the territory of the specified visa office. In these cases, the original visa office should proceed with a final determination of eligibility and process the application if eligible. The visa office should not transfer the file to another visa office unless the transfer is warranted for program integrity reasons. Leaving a visa office’s territory alone does not warrant a file transfer. In this case, if an applicant requests a file transfer, the visa office should inform them that the application will not be transferred

 

[computergeek]

Hi


1. Your example of Singapore. Bangladesh and Vietnam are a couple of countries that apply through Singapore. For an interview, it will be held in their home country as Singapore has itinerant services, where an officer from Singapore conducts the interview in the applicants country.
2. The only way an application will be transferred is for the "Integrity of the program" See: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/bulletins/2010/ob180.asp specifically

Visa offices are not required to transfer files for any other reasons. Such reasons include cases of applicants who comply with subsection R11(1) for the specified visa office, at the time the application is received at the CIO, but subsequently leave the territory of the specified visa office. In these cases, the original visa office should proceed with a final determination of eligibility and process the application if eligible. The visa office should not transfer the file to another visa office unless the transfer is warranted for program integrity reasons. Leaving a visa office's territory alone does not warrant a file transfer. In this case, if an applicant requests a file transfer, the visa office should inform them that the application will not be transferred

Singapore may refuse foreigners visas for medical conditions that are not a bar to a Canadian permanent resident application, which is actually why I picked that specific office. Thus, you could be required to process through Singapore, yet be refused a visitor's visa to Singapore to attend an interview.

I think the key here then is that it becomes discretionary. My suspicion, and the rationale for my case law search, was that had a visa office exercised this discretion and refused an application because someone could not obtain a visa to attend an interview happened with any frequency in the past, there would be a court challenge or court decision. I could not find such a court challenge. That suggests to me either the issue truly is an unusual one - which surprises me given the length of time it can take for CIC to process application and the fact that some countries do have complex travel restrictions - or that this is a discretionary power that CIC does not tend to wield. In other words, if one is called for interview and refused a travel visa to attend the interview, the VO must exercise said discretion to arrange for the interview requirements to be satisfied in some other fashion.

I do agree that they will not routinely exercise this discretion to change a processing office for the convenience of the applicant.

For applicants whose legal status in the country where they made their application changes or
expires before the processing of their application has been completed, processing will be
completed in the office where it was submitted.

However, if an office concludes that it cannot continue to process the application without
jeopardizing the integrity of the program, that office must notify the applicant that it cannot process
the application and that the application will be transferred to the office that handles the new
country of residence or nationality.

emphasis added

Source: OP 1

This specifically seems to address the issue at hand (ergo a change in the R11 status while the application is in process). As for the OP, the determination of the correct processing office is up to CIC, not the the applicant.