60yr old Americans in Europe want to buy house and spend extended time in Canada

[Palermo]

Hello,

We are American citizens in our 60s who have been living legally in Europe for more than 7 years. We have frequently visited Canada and we would like to buy a house there, with the idea of spending at least 6 months per year there, and ideally more.

We are artists and teachers with considerable financial assets, and could afford to purchase private health insurance if needed.

We are wondering if it is possible for Americans of our age and in our circumstances to either obtain an extended stay visa that allows for multiple entires per year and is renewable, or a permanent residency. Or is there is some other type of visa or status we should be pursuing?

If anyone can provide guidance and details, or a link to detailed information regarding people our age and in our financial position, I would greatly appreciate it.

Thank you.

 

[polara69]

Here is something that might help..

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/retiring-in-canada-from-us-t140379.0.html

 

[Palermo]

Thank you very much. Reading that was indeed very helpful. I even followed one of the links to take a preliminary evaluation of our eligibility.

I was left wondering this, however:

We don't really wish to move permanently to Canada. We would just like to own a house there, and go whenever we feel like it, and that might add up to more than six months per year. It appears that as American citizens we can enter Canada and then apply for an extended stay once we are in Canada. Even if it were granted, before we bought a house, we would certainly want to know that legally we had a right to enter and couldn't be treated as if we were trying to move there permanently, with someone suddenly stopping us at a border or airport to tell us they had the authority to ban us from entering. This would be especially true if one of us was inside Canada and the other wasn't. Is there a document we could obtain short of permanent residence that doesn't need to be renewed every six months?

Does the Canadian government accept representations that -- nice as Canada is and Canadians are! -- not everybody wants to move there forever?

 

[polara69]

I am not a lawyer or anything, but I think if you stay longer than for six months immigration may see this as you residing in Canada. 6 months in, 6 months out appears to be fine, but longer?

You see, there is no provision for people residing in Canada for longer than 6 months except you have the necessary papers. Home ownership is fine as long as it is for no longer than mentioned.

On the other hand, I cannot go to the US to live for longer than 6 months either.. would need a green card or citizenship. There are only a few countries offering so called Retirement Visas


Australia
Argentina
Belize (formerly British Honduras)
Brazil
Costa Rica
Dominican Republic
Ecuador
Guatemala
Honduras
Indonesia
Malaysia
Mauritius
Mexico
New Zealand
Panama (the political system and government-related issues of Panama, including passports and visas are explored here)
Philippines
South Africa
Spain
Sri Lanka
Thailand There is also an Ehow article on these visas.
Tonga

Hope that helped.. sorry, no Canada on the list!

 

[Palermo]

Thank you for your responses! I don't expect you to be a lawyer -- or anything! I am sure I will need to ask many people.

Perhaps the confusion is that I don't want to retire to Canada. I don't want a retirement visa. Here in Italy, I have my choice of either asking the government for an extended stay, or I can ask for a residency. Either one gives me a guaranteed right to be in Italy legally for a certain length of time. And both are renewable. But until they need to be renewed, I have a legal right to be in italy (and Europe by extension).

From reading the links you provided, it appears that if I ask the govt of Canada to become a permanent resident, then I must stay in Canada for 700+ days consecutively. I cannot promise to do that, nor can my spouse. And we are not really interested in being permanent residents. We do not plan to die in Canada!

But if I buy a house in Canada, then I would like to be able to visit Canada frequently, and I would like to have a valid document that shows the authorities who might ask that I have permission to stay longer than 180 days during the year. In Italy, such a document would expire after a certain time and it would be immediately revoked if I broke the law, but in Canada it almost sounds as if the document would be revoked just because I bought I house even if I had no intention of permanently living there.

Perhaps someone knows the answer to this question:

If I go to Canada on a visit, and apply for an extended stay while I am there, will I get a face-to-face interview with an immigration official with whom I can establish that we are not moving to Canada? We have family outside of Canada, and work outside of Canada.

 

[polara69]

No worries, maybe someone knows more, by the way, io sono dalla svizzera, parte tedesco!

 

[zardoz]

As far as I am aware, there is no visa that offers you what you seek. Every entry into Canada by a "foreign national" (not a citizen or permanent resident) is subject to examination and possible, however unlikely, refusal. It is totally up to the discretion of the CBSA officer that deals with your entry.

 

[Leon]

As a US citizen, you can visit Canada for up to 6 months a year. You may have problems when entering if immigration thinks you may be residing in Canada a bit too much. You should in that case state that you are retired and that you are a seasonal resident.

As for applying for PR, you may not be eligible as most immigration classes cater to skilled workers who will be living and working in Canada and paying taxes. If you do find an immigration class you qualify under, you would not have to stay for 700 days consecutively in order to keep your PR status, you would only have to accumulate 730 days in Canada, in your first 5 years as a PR as well as in any rolling 5 year period after that. That is however still almost 5 months a year on average so if you do not think you will be staying that much, you shouldn't bother trying for PR.

 

[Palermo]

Thank you zardoz and leon.

I take it there no official category of seasonal resident with its own permit or document, but is there a functional equivalent? I noticed reading websites that there there is a type of "temporary resident visa" that permits multiple entires into Canada, sometimes valid for as long as 10 years. Would we be able to apply for that?

Just as in Canada, our permission to stay in Italy is subject to refusal at the time of application, and with each renewal. However, once granted, it can't be revoked unless we break the law and is good until the date is expired. No border guard in Italy or Europe can refuse us entry or detain us.

Also, in Italy, our permission to stay is not the result of a face to face interview or an individual officer's decision. It is processed through Rome, although we do need to show up at a regional office to be fingerprinted and establish our identification, provide documents attesting to income and insurance coverage, etc. I am wondering who it is that has ultimate authority over the decision to grant or deny an application in Canada.

We are not retired, and while our teaching and other group work projects are usually set fairly far in advance, making it possible for us to arrange to be in Canada for 5 months continuously, the biggest wild card is family (in particular elderly relatives) who might suddenly need us with them. Were it necessary for us to suddenly leave Italy during the process of our application for a permit to stay, the Italian government would grant it for family reasons. It sounds like the Canadian government wouldn't.

Our biggest interest in wanting some sort of legal status in Canada that grants us stays of more than 180 days in one year is that we would not want to own a house somewhere that we could be barred from attending to as needed. I would not want to have just spent 5 months and 25 days in Canada and gone elsewhere, and 2 months later there is a flood or a break-in and I am told at the border I cannot enter the country.

We have teaching commitments in Italy until next May, and we were thinking that we would like to spend some time in Canada after that. Does anyone know if it would be possible to meet with immigration authorities while we are visiting in May at a regional office? Or should we go to the Canadian embassy in Rome?

(polara69, it is fairly hard to get permission for extended stay in Switzerland too and foreign nationals are restricted as to buying property!)

 

[scylla]

There is no category for seasonal residents.

Having a Temporary Resident Visa will give you no advantages that you don't already have today by visiting on your passport. When you come to Canada on a TRV there is still no guarantee if you will be allowed into Canada and for how long (this decision is up to the immigration officer you encounter at the border).

As others have said, unfortunately no category of visa exists that meets your needs.

 

[zardoz]

As far as I can tell, the concept of a "seasonal resident" is a CBSA term for someone that acquires a property for at least 36 months ( http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pub/bsf5082-eng.html#s3) and is not a term formally recognised by CIC.

 

[Rob_TO]

I would not want to have just spent 5 months and 25 days in Canada and gone elsewhere, and 2 months later there is a flood or a break-in and I am told at the border I cannot enter the country.

That is the risk you will always have to take. As was mentioned, there is no such permit or visa that EVER guarantees you entry to Canada. Except of course for having PR status here, but you would not qualify for PR simply by owning property here or residing here occasionally. So all you can do each time is simply come on your visa-exempt passport.

That being said, your chances of being refused admission to Canada is incredibly small. Each time you visit, you basically just need to convince CBSA you will not over-stay your visitor status or try to work illegally. So if you mention to them you have a property here but always being proofs such as a return ticket dated for 6 months later (or earlier), proof of funds to support yourself, and ties to Italy (such as employment info), then really you should never have an issue.

Just keep in mind each visit is subject to the decision of CBSA. 9 times out of 10 you will probably just be rubber stamped with a 6-month status and not have to explain further. But if the officer you encounter doesn't like your story for whatever reason, you could be given a much shorter visitor status of less than 6-months, in which case you'll need to apply for an extension to stay here longer.

 

[Palermo]

Thanks again to all who responded. The main reason I posted here was to clarify what I thought I was reading (or might be missing) reading official and unofficial websites, and you are all singing from the same song sheet. I only have one remaining question in need of clarification. Rob-TO wrote:

Just keep in mind each visit is subject to the decision of CBSA. 9 times out of 10 you will probably just be rubber stamped with a 6-month status and not have to explain further. But if the officer you encounter doesn't like your story for whatever reason, you could be given a much shorter visitor status of less than 6-months, in which case you'll need to apply for an extension to stay here longer.

What does that mean exactly? And what would happen upon applying for an extension to stay in Canada longer?

We have lived in several countries outside the USA and have never thought it was a good idea to lie to immigration officials. And we wouldn't consider it sensible to make such a large financial investment as a house in a country where our legal right to stay was limited to a total of 180 days each year -- and apparently perhaps even less at the discretion of border guards, with no clear cut set of rules or advance warning. We do need to be able to make plans and commitments. (Here in Italy, as long as we continue to have the same assets we declared initially, and continue to provide our own health insurance, and obey Italian laws, we can be assured of entry and a renewal of our permit to stay for years in advance).

We will probably take the extra step of consulting with the Canadian embassy in Rome (and will be as truthful with them as I have been with all of you). And when (and now if!) we visit Canada next May, we would be interested to talk to local immigration officials in the province we have been considering for a house purchase. But given what I am learning, we will also start considering places other than Canada for our next planetary adventure! 8)

 

[Rob_TO]

What does that mean exactly? And what would happen upon applying for an extension to stay in Canada longer?

It means just as it sounds... each time you enter Canada the decision on your entry is up to the CBSA officer you encounter. For a visa-exempt traveler who owns property here and has good ties outside of the country, most likely you won't have any issues.

Usually it's not a big issue for visa-exempt traveler here to extend their visitor status by an additional 6 or even 12 months.

Remember that Canada is one of the most desirable countries to live in the world, and MANY people try to enter illegally to try and stay here forever. So our immigration policies are much stricter than most other countries.

 

[Leon]

Like others have said, you don't need a TRV because you are visa exempt. A TRV would only give you what you have anyway, the right to visit for up to 6 months at a time. TRV or visa exempt, it is always up to the immigration officer if they let you enter. If they believe that you are a risk to overstay your visa, they can deny you entry.

In most cases, they will let you enter if you are visa exempt and they will give you 6 months each time. However, as a rule of thumb, you shouldn't "visit" more than 6 months a year because then you are actually not visiting any more. An immigration officer who feels that you are living in Canada without proper status could decide to give you a hard time or even deny you entry.

If you want to stay longer than 6 months, you can apply to extend your visitor status and they might give you another 6 months but you'd have to apply for that each time you want to stay longer. In most cases, they will just let you in for another 6 months each time you re-enter.

You could also live in a border town where border crossings are a bit more relaxed.