Letter of References

[professional 1]

I was just wondering where professional1 got the idea of sending reference letters for only 4 years. Maybe he used this procedure and was approved?

Man, it is not that complicated.

The instructions say clearly that the maximum points are for only 4 years, if you have 100 years of experience, they will count only 21 for 4 years, that is it.

When they said that the work experience which can be counted must be within the last 10 years only, it means that your work experience must not be older than 10 years, but they did not say send refference letters for 10 years even if you have work experience for that period of time.

Agian, when they say the experience that can be counted is only for the last 10 years, they use it for the applicant advantage not for them selves, just (to give a chance for people who worked in the past and currently are unemployed since a long time to apply if their experience fall within the last 10 years) or to give the chance for people who have worked part time for 8 years to be considered as a full time for 4 years) or ( to give the chance for people who worked one year in the past and stayed unemployed for a bunch of years and worked again one year and left their jobs again.....etc to be able to collect the total of 4 years experience but within the last 10 years not before that)
so if some one has a straight continuous job for the last 4 years, he does not have to show more refference letters for for more than that total)

However, if you or anyone is able to provide refference letters from all of his past employers, the immigration officers will welcom that and will not refuse it, but they will only count points for 4 years not more, and those 4 years must be skill level A, B, or 0 and it must falls under the 38 list of jobs for people who apply under category 1
For the second part of your question:

As much as you send them letters of NOCs, they will only count the points for 4 years and for the NOC that you used to claim your expereince (job titles and duties). 

[gtrwizrd]

When they said that the work experience which can be counted must be within the last 10 years only, it means that your work experience must not be older than 10 years, but they did not say send refference letters for 10 years even if you have work experience for that period of time.
- Well, the checklist, as PMM posted, did mention to submit reference letters for past and current employers. And since the number of years aren't specified, I am assuming that CIC requires reference letters for ALL previous work even those exceeding 10 years:

"7. WORK EXPERIENCE
For you and your spouse or common-law partner:
• notarized employment contracts from your present and past employers,
accompanied by an English or French translation
• original and up-to-date letters of reference from your past and current employers.
Letters must be written on company letterhead and show the company's full
address, telephone and fax numbers, and be stamped with the company's official
seal."

Agian, when they say the experience that can be counted is only for the last 10 years, they use it for the applicant advantage not for them selves, just (to give a chance for people who worked in the past and currently are unemployed since a long time to apply if their experience fall within the last 10 years) or to give the chance for people who have worked part time for 8 years to be considered as a full time for 4 years) or ( to give the chance for people who worked one year in the past and stayed unemployed for a bunch of years and worked again one year and left their jobs again.....etc to be able to collect the total of 4 years experience but within the last 10 years not before that)
so if some one has a straight continuous job for the last 4 years, he does not have to show more refference letters for for more than that total)

However, if you or anyone is able to provide refference letters from all of his past employers, the immigration officers will welcom that and will not refuse it,  but they will only count points for 4 years not more, and those 4 years must be skill level A, B, or 0 and it must falls under the 38 list of jobs for people who apply under category 1
- How about for those who are not able to provide employment contracts/reference letters from previous employers exceeding 10 years and work is not related to NOC declared by the applicant, would the explanation "Work experience not applicable for the NOC declared" be sufficient reason for not submitting the documents?

[Albularyo]

they wont be asking for work reference that do not fall under the 38 NOC list.

hth

[professional 1]

- Well, the checklist, as PMM posted, did mention to submit reference letters for past and current employers. And since the number of years aren't specified, I am assuming that CIC requires reference letters for ALL previous work even those exceeding 10 years

"You must have at least one year of full-time paid work experience, or the equivalent in part-time work, in an occupation listed in the National Occupational Classification (NOC) list. Your experience must be listed in an occupation listed in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC and it must have occurred in the past 10 years. You must have performed most of the duties, including all the essential duties, that are listed for the occupation."

Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/assess/WorkExperience.asp

- How about for those who are not able to provide employment contracts/reference letters from previous employers exceeding 10 years and work is not related to NOC declared by the applicant, would the explanation "Work experience not applicable for the NOC declared" be sufficient reason for not submitting the documents?

"If the description does not match your work experience, then you might not have the experience you need to apply as a skilled worker. Look through the NOC list to see if another occupation matches your experience. Check all the jobs you had in the past 10 years to see if you have at least one continuous year of work experience in a job that will qualify you as a skilled worker."

Source:  http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/factor-experience.asp


PLEASE NOTE:If your work experience is not listed in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC, or if your experience did not occur in the past 10 years, your application will not be accepted.

Source:  http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/assess/WorkExperience.asp


If you  cannot open the first and last links; go to the self assessment tool in CIC website, click take the test, and then keep going until you reach the work experience page to see the above information.

[jes_ON]

2)  On Schedule 3: Economic Classes – Federal Skilled Worker Class (IMM 0008-Schedule 3):
"Your work experience Starting with your current occupation, list all of the occupations that you have had in the 10 years preceding the date of your application. For each occupation;
• include the appropriate National Occupational Classification (NOC) code,
• check the box that corresponds to the number of years of continuous full-time or equivalent part-time experience, and
• write a description of your main duties.
Note: List only occupations that fall in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC."


3)   Supporting documentation - #7 on Checklist:
For the principal applicant:
• original and up-to-date letters of reference from your past and current employers for the past 10 years.

Letters must be:
• written on company letterhead,
• signed by the responsible officer/supervisor,
• show the company's full address, telephone and fax numbers, email and
website addresses, and
• stamped with the company's official seal (if applicable).
Letters must include all of the following information:
• the specific period of your employment with the company
• the positions you have held during the period of employment and the time
spent in each position
• your main responsibilities and duties in each position
• your total annual salary plus benefits
• the number of hours worked per week
• a business card of the person signing
If you cannot provide a reference from an employer, provide a written explanation and any documentation that would support your claim to such employment and provide the information as set forth above.

Your points related to work experience will be assessed based on what you can document.  If you can't document it, write a letter explaining everything, but don't expect to get points for it.  It is true that you will not get more points for more than 4 years, but you are still supposed to document it to the best of your ability.

[gtrwizrd]

2)  On Schedule 3: Economic Classes – Federal Skilled Worker Class (IMM 0008-Schedule 3):
"Your work experience Starting with your current occupation, list all of the occupations that you have had in the 10 years preceding the date of your application. For each occupation;
• include the appropriate National Occupational Classification (NOC) code,
• check the box that corresponds to the number of years of continuous full-time or equivalent part-time experience, and
• write a description of your main duties.
Note: List only occupations that fall in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC."


3)   Supporting documentation - #7 on Checklist:
For the principal applicant:
• original and up-to-date letters of reference from your past and current employers for the past 10 years.

Letters must be:
• written on company letterhead,
• signed by the responsible officer/supervisor,
• show the company's full address, telephone and fax numbers, email and
website addresses, and
• stamped with the company's official seal (if applicable).
Letters must include all of the following information:
• the specific period of your employment with the company
• the positions you have held during the period of employment and the time
spent in each position
• your main responsibilities and duties in each position
• your total annual salary plus benefits
• the number of hours worked per week
• a business card of the person signing
If you cannot provide a reference from an employer, provide a written explanation and any documentation that would support your claim to such employment and provide the information as set forth above.

Your points related to work experience will be assessed based on what you can document.  If you can't document it, write a letter explaining everything, but don't expect to get points for it.  It is true that you will not get more points for more than 4 years, but you are still supposed to document it to the best of your ability.

jes_ON,
Can you kindly show the link to this document?  The documents I have doesn't specifically mention "for the past 10 years".  Thanks!

[gtrwizrd]

- Well, the checklist, as PMM posted, did mention to submit reference letters for past and current employers. And since the number of years aren't specified, I am assuming that CIC requires reference letters for ALL previous work even those exceeding 10 years

"You must have at least one year of full-time paid work experience, or the equivalent in part-time work, in an occupation listed in the National Occupational Classification (NOC) list. Your experience must be listed in an occupation listed in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC and it must have occurred in the past 10 years. You must have performed most of the duties, including all the essential duties, that are listed for the occupation."

Source: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/assess/WorkExperience.asp

- How about for those who are not able to provide employment contracts/reference letters from previous employers exceeding 10 years and work is not related to NOC declared by the applicant, would the explanation "Work experience not applicable for the NOC declared" be sufficient reason for not submitting the documents?

"If the description does not match your work experience, then you might not have the experience you need to apply as a skilled worker. Look through the NOC list to see if another occupation matches your experience. Check all the jobs you had in the past 10 years to see if you have at least one continuous year of work experience in a job that will qualify you as a skilled worker."

Source:  http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/factor-experience.asp


PLEASE NOTE:If your work experience is not listed in Skill Type 0 or Skill Levels A or B of the NOC, or if your experience did not occur in the past 10 years, your application will not be accepted.

Source:  http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/assess/WorkExperience.asp


If you  cannot open the first and last links; go to the self assessment tool in CIC website, click take the test, and then keep going until you reach the work experience page to see the above information.

professional 1,

I appreciate your detailed answer. It's becoming apparent that we are talking about 2 different subjects.  You're discussing mostly about the assessment criteria, which is all well and good. But I am just asking about the correct documents to be submitted.  If jes_ON has that CIC document specifically stating "for the past 10 years", then that's the answer I need. :)

[jes_ON]

Section 7 of the Checklist in the the Visa-Office specific instructions - Buffalo.  If that's not your visa office, check your visa-office specific instructions.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/guides/E37048.pdf

[professional 1]

The documents I have doesn't specifically mention "for the past 10 years".  Thanks!

Minimum work experience requirements
You must meet the following minimum work experience requirements to be eligible to apply as a skilled worker:

•You must have at least one continuous year of full-time, paid work experience or the equivalent in part-time continuous employment.
•Your work experience must be in the category of Skill Type 0, or Skill Level A or B on the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC). See below for instructions on determining the NOC category for your work experience.
•You must have had this experience within the last 10 years.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/factor-experience.asp

Third point under Minimum work experience requirements



All applicants must meet the following minimum requirements to apply as a skilled worker:
•
You must have at least one continuous year of full-time, paid work experience or the equivalent in part-time continuous employment
•
You must have had this experience within the last 10 years

•
Your work experience must be Skill Type 0 (managerial occupations) or Skill Level A (professional occupations) or B (technical occupations and skilled trades) on the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC)


http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/guides/EG7.pdf       

Page 6 first Paragrahp


Assessing applications against the Ministerial Instructions
The CIO will assess whether the applicant has an arranged employment offer (AEO), has resided
legally in Canada for at least one year as a temporary foreign worker or international student, or
has one year of continous full-time (or equivalent part-time) paid work experience in the last 10 years in one of the occupations listed in the Ministerial Instructions.


http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf

page 13 the last paragraph

Minimum requirements
The officer reviews the applicant's work experience to determine if the applicant meets the
minimum requirements to apply as a skilled worker, as stipulated in R75.
The applicant must have at least one year of continuous full-time paid work experience, or the
continuous part-time equivalent, in the category of Skill Type 0, or Skill Level A or B, according to
the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC).
The work experience which will be assessed for all skilled worker applicants must:

• have occurred within the 10 years preceding the date of application

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf


page 17 paragraph 9.1




To be eligible for points, the applicant's work experience must:
• have occurred during the 10 years immediately preceding the date of application;
• be in occupations listed in the National Occupational Classification (NOC) under Skill Type 0 or Skill Level A and B

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf


Page 29 under the table immdeiatly


be full-time work, which, according to R80(7), is equivalent to at least 37.5 hours of paid work
per week. Full-time work experience requirement may be met by the equivalent in part-time
paid work experience, e.g. two part-time jobs held simultaneously. Experience can be
calculated by adding up the number of weeks of full-time work, i.e. 37.5 hours per week in
one job or a total of at least 37.5 hours per week in more than one job, in one or more of the
NOC categories. Periods of work of less than 12 months during the 10 years immediately preceding the date of the application may be added together and divided by 12 to calculate the number of years

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf

Page 29 in the last line

[gtrwizrd]

Section 7 of the Checklist in the the Visa-Office specific instructions - Buffalo.  If that's not your visa office, check your visa-office specific instructions.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/guides/E37048.pdf

Thanks jes_ON. I submitted my application to the London visa-office. The visa-office-specific guide for London applicants doesn't mention "for the past 10 years" in the document list for letters of reference, unlike in Buffalo.

"7. WORK EXPERIENCE
For you, the principal applicant:
• notarized employment contracts from your present and past employers,
accompanied by an English or French translation
• original and up-to-date letters of reference from your past and current employers.
Letters must be written on company letterhead and show the company's full
address, telephone and fax numbers, and be stamped with the company's official
seal.
Letters must include all of the following information:
• the specific period of your employment with the company
• the positions you have held during the period of employment and the time spent
in each position
• your main responsibilities in each position
• your total annual salary plus benefits
• the signature of your immediate supervisor or the personnel officer of the
company
• a business card of the person signing
If you cannot provide a reference from your current employer, provide a
written explanation."

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/guides/E37023.pdf

[gtrwizrd]

professional 1, I think you already made your point sufficiently that CIC assessment is based on experience within the past 10 years on a NOC-defined skill. Thanks, I really appreciate your help. :)

The documents I have doesn't specifically mention "for the past 10 years".  Thanks!

Minimum work experience requirements
You must meet the following minimum work experience requirements to be eligible to apply as a skilled worker:

•You must have at least one continuous year of full-time, paid work experience or the equivalent in part-time continuous employment.
•Your work experience must be in the category of Skill Type 0, or Skill Level A or B on the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC). See below for instructions on determining the NOC category for your work experience.
•You must have had this experience within the last 10 years.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/skilled/factor-experience.asp

Third point under Minimum work experience requirements



All applicants must meet the following minimum requirements to apply as a skilled worker:
•
You must have at least one continuous year of full-time, paid work experience or the equivalent in part-time continuous employment
•
You must have had this experience within the last 10 years

•
Your work experience must be Skill Type 0 (managerial occupations) or Skill Level A (professional occupations) or B (technical occupations and skilled trades) on the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC)


http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kits/guides/EG7.pdf       

Page 6 first Paragrahp


Assessing applications against the Ministerial Instructions
The CIO will assess whether the applicant has an arranged employment offer (AEO), has resided
legally in Canada for at least one year as a temporary foreign worker or international student, or
has one year of continous full-time (or equivalent part-time) paid work experience in the last 10 years in one of the occupations listed in the Ministerial Instructions.


http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf

page 13 the last paragraph

Minimum requirements
The officer reviews the applicant's work experience to determine if the applicant meets the
minimum requirements to apply as a skilled worker, as stipulated in R75.
The applicant must have at least one year of continuous full-time paid work experience, or the
continuous part-time equivalent, in the category of Skill Type 0, or Skill Level A or B, according to
the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC).
The work experience which will be assessed for all skilled worker applicants must:

• have occurred within the 10 years preceding the date of application

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf


page 17 paragraph 9.1




To be eligible for points, the applicant's work experience must:
• have occurred during the 10 years immediately preceding the date of application;
• be in occupations listed in the National Occupational Classification (NOC) under Skill Type 0 or Skill Level A and B

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf


Page 29 under the table immdeiatly


be full-time work, which, according to R80(7), is equivalent to at least 37.5 hours of paid work
per week. Full-time work experience requirement may be met by the equivalent in part-time
paid work experience, e.g. two part-time jobs held simultaneously. Experience can be
calculated by adding up the number of weeks of full-time work, i.e. 37.5 hours per week in
one job or a total of at least 37.5 hours per week in more than one job, in one or more of the
NOC categories. Periods of work of less than 12 months during the 10 years immediately preceding the date of the application may be added together and divided by 12 to calculate the number of years

http://www.cic.gc.ca/EnGLIsh/resources/manuals/op/op06-eng.pdf

Page 29 in the last line

[professional 1]

professional 1, I think you already made your point sufficiently that CIC assessment is based on experience within the past 10 years on a NOC-defined skill. Thanks, I really appreciate your help. :)

You are welcom. However, if i have 10 years experience or more and i am able to document that i would collect all of those documents and send them with my application to the visa office just to strengthen my work experience documents and remove any doubts which they might have about it although i know that they will count only 4 years.

Good luck.